Paying joint bills fairly

[Imstickingwiththisone]

At the moment we have a joint account for household bills and food and each month partner and I go 50/50 putting money in to pay the direct debits. The rest of our earnings remain in our separate bank accounts and we don't discuss it beyond house bills getting paid. We both have debt repayments to make but basically for the last 5 years I've worked part time in a job that already paid less than DPs job when I was full time, so I've been earning considerably less. I've continued to pay my 50% share towards the house bills because I'm shit at discussing that I can't afford to and I need to know whether I'm right to sort this and how.

My DP has big loan repayments but also has a drink every night and is a smoker. He doesn't have any money left at the end of the month and I do believe that. Talk of him giving up smoking has been going on for years with several failed attempts which has resulted in me being patient while nothing happens as he wants to get it right next time. I don't say anything, I don't nag just be positive when it's brought up. He finds his job extremely stressful and the knowledge of a drink at the end of the day helps him get through it tbh, not like a dependency but a treat to look forward to and to break up the monotony of the working week. Theres nothing wrong with that but it grates when im down about money.

Anywho this is getting v long winded. I've basically dealt with my money problems over the last few years by getting second jobs at times when childcare isn't needed, and racking up more debt. Now I can't manage anymore.

Spoke to DP about it with a wobbly lip tonight and to sum it up he says he can't afford to contribute more and he isnt keen on knowing how much I owe as he will worry. Ready to burst at this point but I get quite emotional and kids were about so I left it at that.

I feel like I'm on the edge of saying something I will regret when it's just money at the end of the day. But I want my DP to know that while most of his personal money goes on debts, at least he is chipping away at it and not increasing it while paying off the minimum which as it increases becomes more unaffordable. And he berates me for buying 'crap' for the house (storage boxes 1.99 in home bargains) while he has the luxury to drink and smoke every day. He doesn't pay as much tax as someone who earns double what he earns because that wouldnt be a fair system so why is this acceptable and why can't I get it sorted?

I've had too much pride in the past and wanted to pay my way. Now he genuinely thinks that this shouldn't change.

A solution would be helpful as I have no idea what it is!!

I doubt my money problems are going to help DP being successful at finally giving up smoking. As in dont spend hundreds of pounds on cigarettes but put it in the house account so I can pay off some store cards a bit quicker.

I would suggest that after bills and debts are paid, you try to make sure you each have the same left at the end of the month to spend as you like. If he can no longer afford gags/booze then hats his problem. You are supposed to be a partnership, he should be helping you not burying his head.

Do you have children together? You don't sound like a family, more like flat mates.

Who gets the child benefit and tax credits?

How much do you owe?

Does he pay towards the children

Yes we have children which is why I'm now part time. We work well as a family and pitch in. Money problem doesn't rear its head too much as I deal with it myself borrowing from Peter to pay Paul and then shut off from it. When I do bring it up I can never come up with a solution and a massive part of me feels wrong for asking him to pay for more than me.

I guess what you say is straight forward enough annoyed. I've wrongly been lumping fags and booze in with debt repayments and saying neither of us have anything left at the end of the month. He did he just spent it.

Is this what most people do then? I don't want to sound naive here but both dp and I are both accustomed to our (really shit) way of dealing with money so Id like to be able to say that were changing things to how most families do it.

No tax credits as our combined wage pushes us over threshold. I get child benefit but apart from when I'm in real trouble it is all spent on the kids so clothes, swimming lessons etc.

Have you cut up the store cards to stop the spending? First things first, stop all non-essential spending. If you don't have the money, then don't buy it. You buy food & essential items for the kids, and any essentials you need but do not use store cards.

Work out exactly what you need each month to make the minimum payments on everything you owe. Do you have that much, if you cut out all non-essentials?

Are you in an overdraft? If you are - Call the bank and tell them you are in financial distress, you have debts etc. They have a mandate to help you and you might be able to get any overdraft fees they have charged you refunded and ask them if they'd consider suspending the fees for a set time so you can get back on track. They do do it, you just have to ask and hope they do it for you.

Go to your partner again with all the figures and tell him, clearly and bluntly, that you live together and have kids to support so you need to clear your debts before anything gets worse. Tell him exactly how much you need to have available to pay towards your debts each month and how much you're short by. Ask him what's more important - a secure home with no bailiffs at the door, or his drinking every night? You both got into debt and now you're paying the price which is cutting back. Keep talking to him about how you are a team and this needs sorted. If he really doesn't want to share money, then offer to pay a bit more for a set period of time in the future once all is paid off.

'Is this what most people do then? I don't want to sound naive here but both dp and I are both accustomed to our (really shit) way of dealing with money so Id like to be able to say that were changing things to how most families do it.'

NO! We're a family, we're not flatmates. 50/50 is for flatmates or when both people are earning the exact same. It all goes in one pot here and we each have equal spends because we're a family. You're not.

Personally, I'd go back to work FT and he'll need to pay 50% of the childcare.

Actually, I'd probably go to FT and get rid of him as would be better off without him and not subsidising his fags and booze.

All our money is joint, we spend a similar amount day to day and agree on appropriate spends. I couldn't be with someone who spent that much money on cigarettes and alcohol and had children, I just couldn't.

I really think you need to rethink things significantly- what you're doing now isn't fair. But equally, you're not married and don't have much legal protection if you separate. I'd look into all of that, start working full time and start making him pay the difference in childcare. You're subsidising his ability to make more money by providing childcare. T makes sense for a family unit if he earns more, and that extra money goes to the family- but it doesn't. It goes to him. At least if you worked full time, you could spend extra money on your children rather than booze and fags.

Does he realise that you've taken a cut in pay to raise the kids you had together? You're not just cutting your hours for the fine of it - you both chose to have kids, you both decided that you'd be the one to stay home and look after them, so you both need to sort out the shortfall in your debt payments. This is not just on you - he was happy for you to cut work and cut wages, so he needs to help you and quite the drinking if that's what it takes.

So you have reduced your hours, sacrificed your career and borrow money to put your 50% in the pot?

Dh smokes and drinks the money away, but it's ok as he works hard. But you don't see the financial benefit of him working hard? In fact you are working harder, you no doubt do most of the childcare, the housework AND put 50% in the pot.

And you worry you weren't paying your way.

If his job is so stressful the drink and cigarettes are needed. Then why doesn't he go part time, enabling him to pick up all the wifework. He can pay 50% of the bills easily as he will no longer need the stress relief of cigarettes and alcohol. You can go full time and use your surplus (only 50% contribution needed remember) to repay the debt.

I don't think he'd go for this somehow.

Thanks for the reassurance. We've both got ourselves into this mess in a way. I've always been on he generous side even when I haven't had a pot to piss in, yet adamant that it's fine. I think that outlook has continued in loads of ways.

I think what expat says about going FT is another reason I've skirted round the issue. He has suggested I go FT I'm the past but I don't want to as I don't want my youngest in childcare full time. I know others do this and it's not a criticism of anyone by any means but I'd rather continue with how things were moneywise in order to be with the kids more. So then I feel like I'm asking him to make changes because of my choices and so I can have the luxury of working PT.

There are many different approaches: what is your personal relationship?
50/50 is fine for students who have left home and sharing a flat.
% of income, if his wage is twice yours then 75/25.
Ideally you two sit down and do a proper budget and find out where the money (each and every penny is going over a few months time) then you have a non judgemental discussion.
Not all couples survive financial woes does the prospect of you and him going your seperate ways scare you?

Suggested he goes part time in he past as work was getting on top of him but unfortunately he holds a position in which the workload would be unlikely to reduce so it wouldnt be doable.

Thanks everyone for your input. I feel more confident in approaching this now and won't avoid being matter of fact about it all.

I would like to point out that I've probably laboured the drinking side. He doesn't drink a lot, it's just he gave up his evening tipple years ago and when the habit developed again it was a more expensive drink as he doesn't like the old one anymore! So it's not a big issue and I don't think it's so bad that someone enjoys a glass of wine in the evening it's very very common, I guess I mentioned it because I'm seething with resentment and it's not healthy

Write down (bank print out) all your expenses. There may be other things chipping away at your income.

I bet he has a lot more disposable income than you think.

Is this what people do?

I'm a SAHM. Dp's salary does into one account and all bills come out of it. All money is joint money, all debt is joint debt, all spending is joint spending. You need to sit down with him , work out all of your debts, income and outgoings and work out a budget . It is ridiculous to be in a family where one person has cash and the other struggles.

eh? you've had children with this man and are working part time to look after them???? and he's still enjoying his ft salary???????

everyone's salaries go into the joint account. you each take your 500 or whatever for fripperies (FAGS BOOZE ) pcm. the rest takes care of THE FAMILY via the joint account. .

You are both living beyond your means. This isn't your fault as you only have a part-time wage. This simply can't go on. If you live together and have children together how can debts be separate especially when one earns a lot more than the other. He will simply have to listen to your debt and take it on board.

To answer what people do - DH is a much, much higher earner but money is shared. We get the same amount of pocket money and the rest is used for bills, food and larger expenses/savings etc are agreed jointly.

Different families do different things, but as a family you need to understand that your expenses and your income are 'the family's'. As others have said, you aren't flatmates.
You need to draw up a list of all money coming in, and then all money that
a) has to go out
b) ought to go out
c) is nice if you can afford it
d) would be nice if you could afford it

Think of all money coming in as family money, and all expenses going out as family money.

Repay the debts as quickly as you can - they have to be a priority over luxuries. Luxuries are what you buy with 'spare' money after youve covered a) and b).

Together, then you look over this. You explain to him that childcare costs £X per day, which you are saving by not working FT.
Together you then decide what you are going to do - the choices have to be balanced and fair to both of you. "Spending Money" should be equal, or you can choose for that to be minimal, and you could start saving (for emergencies, or for small treats each or whatever - but, only if you need to incentivise yourself, debt always costs more to feed than savings earn in interest).