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Original poster

Protecting Inheritance from care home ...help me!!!

160 replies

lincolnpaul1 · 21/04/2016 11:57

Hi there,
Thanks for reading this first of all....
Summary:
My mother is ill and now in care (home) with Alzheimers. She is self-funding her care home fees but the money owed is being run up on her property (about 14K currently). I have Power of Attorney over her finances and she is not in the position to make any decisions now, so I make all these. She has her house which I am currently selling for her (120K). Some of the proceeds will go to pay off the debt. We will be left with about 100K capital in mum's account. Mum will continue to self fund her care (about 700£ per week) until her saving are down to about 20K. Mum wanted to protect her savings (as much as the 100K) and obviously didn't want it all to go to her care. Does anybody know how I can/what I can do to protect this to ensure it is passed onto family?

OP posts:
SquareDolphin · 21/04/2016 14:10

£1000 per week is just ludicrous. Yesterday I booked a 4* hotel in central London for less than that day rate. Double room. Peak season price. Free internet Grin

True story.

wiltingfast · 21/04/2016 14:11

Have you thought of other ways of generating income to pay for the care home instead of using up the capital in your mum's property? What about renting it out for example?

Has she any shares, pensions, life insurance etc that could be sold? Other valuable assets? Assets abroad?

Caution I'm not British and not familiar with the rules.

But I do think you probably need to try and think outside the box a bit if you want to try and preserve the house for family.

Babyroobs · 21/04/2016 14:14

Square Dolphin - Presumably you weren't getting Nursing care in the central London Hotel though ? It is the 24 hour nursing care that costs a lot of money.

GraysAnalogy · 21/04/2016 14:15

square to be fair this was Nursing Home and the cost of nursing is high, it's not just bed and board. There's also a hairdresser onsite, gym, etc and a restaurant where you get a free meal per day (otherwise your meals are cooked in the home kitchen)

Babyroobs · 21/04/2016 14:20

I will try to keep my df at home as long as possible should he become infirm. I know that is what he would want. I would rather give up my job temporarily or reduce my hours than pay hundreds of pounds a week. One of my colleaugues has recently done this to care for her fil with dementia who has moved in with her. She says a Nursing home would cost more than her wages so she would give up work. Admittedly she is quite close to retirement age heself. I know not everyone could cope with looking after a relative 24/7 and it would depend how dependent they are, but I would do it for as long as possible.

NewLife4Me · 21/04/2016 14:21

I get it now, apologies, i got the wrong end of the stick.
It is awful when people have worked all their lives for this to happen.
Even more so if it was their wish for this not to happen. Quite often relatives come across as being selfish or grabby but this isn't the case and because of the person's wishes.
it is such a difficult time for those managing the finances of the patient/ old person.
My heart goes out to you OP Thanks

VinceNoirLovesHowardMoon · 21/04/2016 14:21

Oh yes! People who rent and pay 2-3x the sums people with mortgages pay per month are so lucky they get a home for free when they need care!
Your mum worked and saved and enjoyed her home. Now she needs to spend the money she saved (by investing it in her home) on her care needs.
It's understandable to want to save some of that money but equally plenty of it will be unearned equity that grew through buying some time ago and living in a financial asset.

SquareDolphin · 21/04/2016 14:24

babyroobs no, I am not getting 24 hour nursing included in that price.

But nursing care, even round the clock for dementia patients does not necessarily cost this in some other (wealthy) countries in western Europe. Nothing like this. Even 1 to 1 care.

Since the issue looks only likely to increase, I would hope that the government can look more holistically at methods of effective care.

Rereading my last post...sounds like I was being flippant. Not intended. But I look to the way other countries (eg Germany) care for the elderly and find the way things are done in the UK really sad.

cocochanel21 · 21/04/2016 14:27

We were also in your position. My mum's house and all her savings went on her care home. Her savings are now at 16k so the council will now be paying. When we sold the house we paid for her funeral the social worker was raging and told us we should have paid for her funeral ourselves.
Thankfully my mum has no clue this happened. My parent's were so proud to be able to buy their council house to be able to leave their 6 children something. Worse decision they ever made.
Mum's home costs £750 a week and its defently NOT worth the money.

Babyroobs · 21/04/2016 14:29

One to one care for a dementia patient 24/7 to keep them safe, even for an unqualified carer on £7 an hour ( not taking into account more pay for nights or weekends) = £1176, not taking into account food, room , utilities etc.

GraysAnalogy · 21/04/2016 14:30

A hospital bed here can cost £400 a day, so it's no surprise that those needing nursing care will pay a lot of money.

Our care of the elderly needs improving though. A LOT. Social care has been decimated. I said in another thread that I don't very often work on A&E but when I do it's full of elderly people who's only reason for being there is because there families can no longer cope. Because the poor families don't know what else to do.

RudeElf · 21/04/2016 14:31

Im a bit shocked by some posts on this thread.

Do people not work to provide for their own future including their care needs when they are older? Confused its one of my biggest motivations for working and saving now in my youth so that i can pay for whatever care i need if i need it later in life. Who else should i expect to fund my care if i have the money available?

SoupDragon · 21/04/2016 14:34

Do people not work to provide for their own future including their care needs when they are older?

I think it is the feeling that they are being penalised for having saved/bought their own home when they could have lived the life of Riley, spent the lot and had the state pay for their care needs.

GraysAnalogy · 21/04/2016 14:37

That would be my feelings too Soup although I see it from the other side too

Bassetfeet · 21/04/2016 14:38

X posted . Thank you all who answered my questions . Very helpful .

Babyroobs · 21/04/2016 14:39

I don't really think about paying for my care in old age when I go to work, I'm just thinking about providing a roof over my kids heads and food and a cheap holiday each year. there is nothing else to save for the future although obviously the mortgage is an investment.

VertigoNun · 21/04/2016 14:40

Who is the state? You mean local council tax payers?

Babyroobs · 21/04/2016 14:42

Presumably though if people have a state pension, private pension, attendance allowance etc coming in it could mean the shortfall in fees needed for a nursing home isn't that great. Obviously one at £1k a week is going to be out of reach of many but a more realistically priced one could be affordable without selling the home.

SquareDolphin · 21/04/2016 14:42

In Germany there is/was a government scheme that encouraged families who wanted their elderly relatives to be cared for at home (IE not a nursing home) to employ qualified nurses from countries that would not normally be automatically eligible for working visa. Just for this specific job, renewed visa annually.

The costs were very low, relatively speaking. Peanuts compared to a nursing home.

Through this scheme, My FIL received one to one care from fully qualified nurse, for a couple of years, right up until his death. He stayed in his own home, with his family popping in and out every day, able to focus on enjoying / supporting his last years without being overburdened by the more unpleasant aspects of caring for a dementia patient.

A pp saying social services begrudged reservation of funeral cost makes me feel ill. It's just awful to treat sick, old humans like this Sad

VinceNoirLovesHowardMoon · 21/04/2016 14:42

People who don't have funds to pay for their care don't have no funds because they spent it all on furs and cruises.
Also remember that most people don't earn the value in their homes, it's equity that for most people has been accrued through the economic housing bubble not hard graft or clever investment

RudeElf · 21/04/2016 14:43

I (currently) work part time on minimum wage and i really worry about how i'm going to manage when i'm older. Preferably i would like to be in a position to have enough money to have a choice in where i am cared for (if necessary). When i see the state of "the state" funded services currently there is no way in hell i want to be left dependant on the state in 30/40/50 years. I would have thought anyone with any sense and ability to save would be thinking the same. If i have property when it comes time to be cared for then i'll be only too glad to sell it/use it to fund the best care i can arrange.

AndNowItsSeven · 21/04/2016 14:48

If you own your own home and have an asset you have the luxury of choosing a nice private care home not being dumped in an awful one.
I would want my parents to use their money to make their last days comfortable. It's not inheritence until your family is dead.

CamembertQueen · 21/04/2016 14:49

People should have to pay for their care imo. From my experience there is a big difference in state funded care vs privately paying. I would choose the latter a million times over. I want to have choice over where I go. Generally all the funds your Mother has will go towards her care until her funds go down to £21,500 (something like that), which is the threshold the LA take over funding.

GraysAnalogy · 21/04/2016 14:51

sqaure That sounds like an interesting idea, one that I bet was hard to implement but still a great idea. But doesn't that mean people would have to open their homes up and house this nurse? And what about people who need more than one person? Many clients in nursing homes need 2 (even more!) people just to roll them to provide personal care.

Thanks for sharing that I'm interested to read more

Bassetfeet · 21/04/2016 15:20

Just to lighten the thread as a one off . My mum is frail but despite two broken hips is quite fit for 94. Her core strength sitting up in bed like a jack in the box is astounding to all who see it . No hands or Oohing and Ahhing .
The irony is that she so wants to get me a stair lift due to progressive illness.
Of course I cannot take funds for that but the situation makes me smile Grin.
I don't know why I worry .....the feisty old gal will outlive me probably .