Childminder pro rata conundrum!

[Nic1981efg]

Hi,was just wondering if anyone could give me a little advice or point me in the right direction. Recently my childminder of 3 years gave me notice and stopped caring for my son one week before the end of school meaning I had to pay extra for additional childcare. As I work term time only I have always paid her over a full 52 weeks.....when she initially gave me her notice she said all I had to pay was the next four weeks as per my contract. On the last day my son was in her care however she presented me with a hand written document from her accountant saying I had underpaid her by £1,026 as the contract runs from September 14 to September 15. She has offered the opportunity for me to pay it off in small increments which it will need to be as I have new monthly nursery fees.....my question is can she do this? My contract just mentions the 4 week notice period and has no mention whatsoever about pro rata issues. Have tried looking everywhere and don't want to not pay if I genuinely owe her but neither do I want to he paying money I don't owe. Has anyone please got any advice?

If you only used her term time but wanted to spread your payments over the whole year (to standardise and reduce payments presumably?) then yes you do owe her. You've used more hours than paid for due to the August holiday not having been yet at the point of contract ending. It's not really her problem if you now have other bills to pay.

I agree with Teddy BUT if those are the terms she broke the contract by not providing childcare for the last week of term so I'm not sure where that leaves you. As a minimum it seems fair to deduct the costs you paid out for the last week of care.

Hi Nic1981efg - we're going to pop this over to a more appropriate topic for you to get the best response.

But surely pro rata or not four weeks notice is four weeks notice?
How much notice did she give you.

How do you pay her the 52 weeks? I pay a half weekly fee during holidays as a retainer. I don't understand how if she wants paying until sept if your DC left there mid July?

So she only gave you one weeks notice but still wanted four weeks notice pay originally? That's not on.

Confused. Do you only use her termtime, so the charge is for 40 ish weeks of childcare that you spread payment for over 52. In which case you may be in arrears compared to paying for the actual hours already used since September. How much notice did she give ?

Do you mean that you pay her 52 weeks of the year, based on full fees for all weeks? So that you're paying her for ?11-12 weeks that you're not using her?

Or that you only pay for the weeks you use, but spread out into equal payments over the 52 weeks to give her a steady income?

She gave you four weeks notice and broke her contract by not working the last week of term. Her employment with you ended I'd say when she broke her contract. You certainly don't owe her any more than for the four weeks notice. She sounds a total chancer to me. I'd tell her to whistle for her money. (Not in so many words.) As far as I would be concerned her employment with you ended after her four weeks notice which she didn't even work in full anyway. Don't pay her. Let her sue you. She won't stand a chance.

stopped caring for my son one week before the end of school meaning I had to pay extra for additional childcare.

Did they give notice prior to ceasing providing their service? Was that notice of the length as described in the service agreement?

As I work term time only I have always paid her over a full 52 weeks.....

Why? How is that defined in the agreement? This could be a very important aspect, as as others have said you may be paying for care, or you may be paying for care plus a retainer fee, and the payment may or may not have been split over a full year to make budgeting easier.

the contract runs from September 14 to September 15.

Does it say that the agreement is an annual agreement which is renewed annually? They run their own business so can have their own terms of business but what was actually agreed? Read the contract you have, see if you can find anything about length of the contract, renewing the contract.

They gave you notice, not you giving them notice, so I would expect them to be reasonable in calculating any outstanding payment. They will need to clearly explain how the payment is calculated. It could well be that you pay a certain figure for childcare and that the figure is split over 12 months/52 weeks. Without seeing your contact it is impossible to know.

Have you calculated what you feel is owed and are you able to set out why you feel that amount is owed? If so, then pay that. Then leave it up to your ex-childminder to decide what to do - they can take it through small claims court procedure but they will need to prove that the money is owed.

I still think the CM is in the wrong. Even if the contract runs for a year it just means renewable after one year not that the CM is entitled to be paid for that whole year. Supposing she only worked the first two weeks of the year that wouldn't mean she should be paid for the whole year. I agree it's complicated but I'd think the CM wouild be hard pushed to justify being paid until 15th September in a court.

Vivienne I don't think the cm is requesting to be paid for the whole year, but to be paid for the hours worked because the op has used more than paid for due to the pro rata payments issue.

Eg TTO is 38 weeks @ £100/week
Hols @ £0/week

Op is paying the yearly total over 52 weeks for budgeting purposes. (Maybe I don't know the reason why)

£3800 / 52 = £73 per week.

So by July the op has used 37 weeks of childcare (£3700) one week short of the academic year and has made 45 weekly payments (£3288) so a shortfall.

Obviously these are all made up numbers but I'm trying highlight the point that the shortfall is for hours worked, not the cm trying to diddle the op out of extra money.

Yes I do see that. I'd say that was just the way it worked out. The CM gave notice so her employment ended on such a date. Can't see the OP should pay anything after that date. I suppose it depends exactly what it says on the contract and if it makes it quite clear that in the event of the contract being ended then the shortfall would have to be made up. If it doesn't mention it on the contract can't see that she could demand the money. Seems strange that at first the CM agreed to four weeks pay and then presented the OP with that large bill.

What was the reason for the cm not working the final week of childcare? (Eg sickness?) Did you pay for this care, and did you incur a large fee for using alternative childcare? If so, you need to consider this if you do indeed pay this money to the cm.

I think it sounds like you use her termtime so 38 weeks of the year. Say its £100 a week that means you owe her £3800 a year spread over 12 months is £316 a month but you had only paid up to 10 months so only £3,160 when She had provided 37 weeks of care so actually your bill is £3700 but sounds like you have underpaid as you pay pro-rata.