Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Money matters

Find financial and money-saving discussions including debt and pension chat on our Money forum. If you're looking for ways to make your money to go further, sign up to our Moneysaver emails here.

Original poster

FREE school trips and holidays/parents on benefits!

185 replies

graceM · 11/02/2015 18:12

Tonight I've had a letter home from my son's secondary school letting us know that there is a trip to France coming up in July before they break up for summer. It's for four days and it costs £672, well I've just read at bottom of the page that the trip will be either free of charge or reduced accordingly for parents who claim benefits, ie income support, job seekers, housing benefit etc etc, well I'm absolutely furious to say the least!

I know that not everyone can afford to send their children on expensive school trips/holidays etc, neither can I really but I'm willing to scrimp and save to ensure my son gets to go. So why the hell should other parents get it free? If you can't afford for your child to go then they don't go simple, I know it's sad but that's just the way it is. Not happy!

OP posts:
Hulababy · 11/02/2015 18:51

My problem is that this school trip to France isn't educational as such, it is a fun adventure holiday. So I fail to see how a child who's parents are on benefits would necessarily benefit, educationally speaking that is.

Educational benefits:

  • practising a foreign language in the country of origin
  • seeing a new country, possibly for the first time
  • seeing new cultures
  • trying new, different foods

I would imagine the trip can slot into a range of curriculum areas, and hence why Pupil Premium money could be used to support these children in going.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 11/02/2015 18:52

So you're going to cut down on a few luxuries so your DC can go on a school trip? I feel for you OP, truly no-one can understand your sacrifices. [eyeroll]

Original poster
graceM · 11/02/2015 18:54

I totally get were you are coming from and no, it wouldn't be nice for any child to miss out on school trips. And although there are some parents on benefits who genuinely struggle through no fault of their own I'm afraid there are lots who don't struggle yet are willing to take anything and everything for free, including free school trips. Why should these parents get school trips paid for their children but not people like myself and my husband who are a working family who earn just over the threshold for help but after tax, national insurance, high rent, council tax etc are no better off than those who get money for doing bugger all?

OP posts:
fattymcfatfat · 11/02/2015 18:55

op this annoys me aswell.and I am on benefits! I always pay for my ds to.go on trips etc, but some parents refuse point blank or wont even give a pound for own clothes days etc. ridiculous. and I am sick of being labelled as one of them because of my circumstances. I wouldnt expect anyone else to pay for my ds to go away (pupil premium is given by the government yes but your taxes pay for it!) if I didnt have the money then he wouldn't go simple as but I always make sure I have it for him even if it means less treats etc.

Original poster
graceM · 11/02/2015 18:58

When I say luxuries, I'm not taking about cutting back on fancy manicures, hairdressing appointments, expensive meals out. I'm talking about cutting back on the things I personally consider little luxuries, like downgrading my phone/internet package, using the car less when I can walk hence saving on petrol, being that bit more frugal when it comes to food shopping and cutting out buying magazines.

OP posts:
chosenone · 11/02/2015 18:58

Pupil premium funding is there to help children who live in families categorised as deprived. It is not the child's fault. These families get funding for pre school when DC are 2and this level of support will follow them through school. Schools will see fit how it benefits each child. Thee gap between PP and non PP children is significant so something does need to be done.
It may annoy you and yes it can be seen as rewarding the feckless but it is not the child's fault.

Kaydev8 · 11/02/2015 19:00

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

CurlyhairedAssassin · 11/02/2015 19:01

I really think you need to have another hard think about why these kids should get a subsidised/fully funded place, OP.

The government agrees that kids on FSM should get pupil premium money to help bridge the gap between them and their peers. And that's a Tory government!

What is your problem? I really wish you could see how a lot of kids on FSM have to live - the home lives of some of them just make you want to cry. It's not just financial difficulties their parents often have - there can be mental or emotional difficulties which affect the kids and their experience of life. A sibling with special needs which means one of the parents can't work. People struggle, FGS, they're not just a bit short at the end of the month so have to tighten their belts next month.

If paying for a place from pupil premium money puts a massive smile on their face for a change then I'm all for it and can't understand why anyone would begrudge that.

By the way, I'm not saying that all kids on FSM have parents that are not the greatest, obviously I'm not, before anyone says "my kids are on FSM, I haven't got a choice about it, and I'm a great parent to my kids regardless." I am merely pointing out that a majority have OTHER problems as well as financial ones to deal with and people should remember that when they go off on a Daily Mail rant.

TinklyLittleLaugh · 11/02/2015 19:02

I think the problem is that there are many working families with the same level of disposeable income as people on benefits. When people on benefits are given stuff that working families can't afford, there is bound to be discontent.

Personally I think the whole school trip thing is just a minefield of privilege and inequality.

LeftyLoony · 11/02/2015 19:02

Doing bugger all?
I'll swap you. I'll do your SAHM OR Your DH's job and you do the night waking that we've been doing for 9 years now, the dealing with incontinence and destruction, getting hit,, bitten....

CurlyhairedAssassin · 11/02/2015 19:06

And yes, I'm pretty sure that the trip you're talking about won't be a blanket box-ticking "all pupil premium kids get to go free" type of affair. The school would consider carefully which kids would be offered it. It is often looked-after children. And why the hell not?

Angry
Original poster
graceM · 11/02/2015 19:06

Yes I'm fully aware of the two year funding places, or "free child care" (yes that's my interpretation of it, and I am allowed that ), my son who has additional needs was turned down for it as apparently we earned too much! Anyway I do understand that some children from backgrounds that are classed to be poor do tend to need extra help, provision, etc etc but not in all cases. I know of many families who on paper were classed as poor but who's children are now successful business people, lawyers, doctors etc, money or lack of it does not always come into it, it's more about the type of parent you are and how you chose to raise your child.

OP posts:
HainaultViaNewburyPark · 11/02/2015 19:13

When I was small, I was the child who never got to go on any residential trips because my parents couldn't afford it.

When my DC were at state school, I used to pay double the 'voluntary' contribution the school asked for. I always told the headmistress to use the money to subsidise one or more other children at her discretion.

I have to confess I no longer do this now my DC are at private schools though

unlucky83 · 11/02/2015 19:14

Hmmm - in principle I guess I don't have any issue - unless other parents are paying more for their DC's place to subsidise the 'assisted' places - eg the coach cost is split just between the non-assisted children. As long as the pupil premium is paying the full cost of a place- the same as any other child.
And the reason that would be unfair is that other children might miss out because their parents are struggling but not on recognised benefits etc and the cost of the trip would be higher ..might make it unaffordable. When they also would never get to go abroad without the school trip.
I think the whole of FSM provision should be looked at as I understand it certain people can be struggling but not qualify ...but that is a whole other issue. I don't think being on FSM is necessarily an indicator of poverty.

(one of my DC's friends is on FSM - as a child of single parent - but they seem far from 'poor' - I think because the father pays generous child maintenance regularly and that isn't taken into account...that doesn't effect me and I probably would claim it in their situation too...but I do sometimes go Hmm when I hear of the latest spending spree -doesn't seem fair to people genuinely struggling ....)

CurlyhairedAssassin · 11/02/2015 19:15

The problem is that for a child, having both parents in employment is an advantage in itself, regardless of income. Those parents are modelling life skills such as a work ethic, punctuality and attendance, doing a job that they may not necessarily love but do it to support the family, the view that they have to earn what they receive etc. So many values as well as technic skills and knowledge that their children see them gaining. Parents pass all that onto their kids making it easier for them to become fully engaged members of society.

Please don't make the mistake of looking at benefits from a purely financial point of view.

Hulababy · 11/02/2015 19:18

unlucky - no other child's parent has to pay for the share of the free places, This is totally against school trip rules. They must also not make any profit. You can ask for a breakdown for any trip you are asked to pay for.

wannabestressfree · 11/02/2015 19:19

Pupil premuim also covers children who are adopted and children of serving forces personnel. I know that as my sons get it and I teach at the school.
Envy is not an attractive trait. Why not ask if you are struggling? It's great that we help children at school- that's purchase uniform, put money on cards for lunches, pay non uniform, school trips etc.

SlicedAndDiced · 11/02/2015 19:24

Sorry op.

But that's wonderful! I didn't even know they did things like that, good on the schools!

Seriously that's cheered me up no end. Some of those children will never have been abroad, some of them maybe even have a bad home life they can get away from for a time. I have reinstated faith in humanity.

KateMosley · 11/02/2015 19:28

Pupil Premium is a lot less for Forces children than for children with parents on benefits.

fattymcfatfat · 11/02/2015 19:29

wannabe as for non uniform days do you think its acceptable that children turn up to school in their own clothes then ask their mother for a pound. mum says im not effin paying it while stood there smoking a cigarette and telling her friends about the party she is throwing at the weekend.....that's what is being subsidised. as I said in my earlier post I am on benefits but would never expect someone else to pay for my children to go on trips or wear their own clothes for the sake of a pound! or to buy their uniforms! I feel bad enough that I have to take money from the tax payers due to my circumstances. I wouldn't expect extra just so I could get pissed up and smoke fags maybe worse! ( can you tell we are in a, lets say underprivileged area)

Gileswithachainsaw · 11/02/2015 19:31

Seriously that's cheered me up no end. Some of those children will never have been abroad, some of them maybe even have a bad home life they can get away from for a time. I have reinstated faith in humanity

and those barely above the cut off will Hmm

I'm not for a second saying they shouldn't get it.

but let's not forget that many children not in receipt of fsm may well be worse off. What with not even getting fed at school past yr 2. or having parents at home rather than fending for themselves while parents work Double shifts.

many people on benefits are better off than those just above the cut off.

help needs to be spread more evenly I think because these opportunities aren't open to everyone working or not

TendonQueen · 11/02/2015 19:32

Surely it would help all round to have a less expensive school trip? 672 is a huge amount to spend on one member of a family. There must be a lot of families out there who work but who couldn't afford that without sacrificing their own family holiday - that would be my position at the moment, and I earn good money.

GratefulHead · 11/02/2015 19:37

My friend is in full benefits, she walks round pushing her baby in his pushchair each day while smoking a cigarette. And if they subsidised trips in our school her older kid would get them.
What a scrounger eh?

Er no actually, my friend went through just about the most traumatic childhood it is possible to have. I leave it to your imagination what she experienced but let's just say no part of her was undamaged by the abuse she suffered as a child and teenager. Just leaving the house each day is a huge ordeal at the moment. She does so to get her older child to school and copes by smoking to calm her nerves. Her anxiety is so bad that she now wear incontinent pads in case her bowel leaks....that's how bad her terror is. She actually receives DLA and is under the méntal health team.

So remember my friend next time you see a parent smoking outside the school who can't afford trips but can afford cigarettes all funded by the taxpayer. Trust me she would far far rather be in the shoes of those who don't have her issues.

Branleuse · 11/02/2015 19:39

if youre struggling to pay, then speak to the office OP. They might be able to help you too.

GratefulHead · 11/02/2015 19:39

You can tell precisely NOTHING from what you see outside the school gate