Spitting mad and very upset - advice please!!

[Meanoldmummy]

We've just bought our first house (mortgaged to the hilt of course!!) and left our rented house a couple of weeks ago. We've been trying to contact the agent for the past week or so to find out about getting our deposit back. We really need it as the new house needs lots of work done, and we are boracic! The agent has been "out to lunch", "back later", "will call you this afternoon" and generally playing silly buggers all week. We weren't allowed to be present at the final check of the house to assess how much deposit we could have back, as it would cause "confrontation". DH finally pinned him down today, and he has said that he is keeping £50 of our money to get the oven professionally cleaned, and that we have got to go round and remove stickers from the walls before we can have any of our money back. The stickers in question are 2 or 3 white labels saying things like "fire" and "wall" which I put up when teaching DS1 to read.
None of this may sound unreasonable at face value. However when we moved into that house it was uninhabitable. It took us months to redecorate every room, lay new floors in the kitchen and bathroom, put doors on the bedrooms(!), replace light switch covers because of wiring sticking out, clear the rubbish from the yard - the walls were all filthy and many of them had huge gashes which we filled with polyfilla before painting. There are internal slide doors between the living room and dining room which have cracked glass panels in them at toddler height - we asked repeatedly for this to be replaced and it never was, despite them sending someone out twice to measure it. The oven is, in my view, beyond cleaning and was filthy when we moved in. The complaint about the stickers is a bit much considering that we had to scrub and redecorate every single wall just to be able to stand being in there. I am so angry and feel very powerless. DH is proposing to go over there this evening and steam the stickers off the wall and just allow him to keep the money for the oven cleaning. I don't want to waste another evening beautifying that hellhole. Does anyone have any ideas, or is it just "tough"? Sorry if I sound rabid, I am really upset

It is very very hard legally for a landlord to keep a penny of your deposit. You can prove the oven is 'reasonable wear and tear' for example. They must also give you a chance to clean it yourself instead of getting a professional company into do it.

Fight him!

I'm not surprised you are angry, but tbh this has happened to me so many times that we tend to view the deposit as "lost money" now. Once we lost our deposit because the landlady said we had taken her light fittings (there weren't any when we moved in) and once because we had put up some hooks in the hall for our coats. They insisted the money was to "make good the damage" - which of course they didn't, they just pocketed the money. Unfortunately they have you over a barrel and use it as a way to screw extra money out of you .

they dont have you over a barrel miaou although they try to pretend they do

I had similar when I was a student. They deducted money for stupid stuff like replacing spent lightbulbs. I'm ashamed to say my Dad got one of his hard knock friends to ring up the landlord and threaten to rip his legs off unless the deposit was returned. It was returned minus 50p for the lightbulb!

Enid - how do I get the money off him though? The oven is a joke. Really. DH said we would have another go at cleaning it, and he said "ah, no, the professional company will take it away and dip it in acid". Surely it's not reasonable to charge us then? But short of holding up the office at gunpoint, how do I get my money?

Thing is though Enid, unless you are prepared to pursue them through the small claims courts, you can't get it back. They have it. You don't.

Try Citizen's Advice Bureau or Trading Standards for advice.

This man is a real dyed-in-the-wool b**tard too. This is what he does. He first tried to claim that we owed him a month's rent, and then did his "disappearing act" for a week to let us stew. It's only because we've been done before that DH keeps all the receipts so we were able to prove otherwise. he's a greasy shifty little Dickensian rack-renter

I bet he does it with every single rentee (I think I just made that word up, but YKWIM!). You could call his bluff and take him to the small claims court, or write him a solicitor's letter, all of which will cost you money. For the sake of £50 I would say it is not worth it (which of course is what he is hoping you would say )

That's what makes me so mad. There IS a principle at stake, and i DO care, and I AM sick of being trashed and insulted by arseholes who make their living preying on people who haven't got enough money to fight back. But £50 is a week's shopping!!!

How about doing it this way (it'll still cost you the £50 but at least the bastard won't get it in his slimy little hand!) - pay yourselves to get the oven cleaned, and then insist on the whole deposit back.

That is tempting Janh...but he insisted on having the keys back before he would even do the assessment. So we can't get the oven out to have it cleaned in the way he is suggesting. He will lend us the keys for one evening to remove the stickers. It's all so humiliating, when I think of the work and expense involved in just making that place fit for my children to set foot in...GRRRR!!!

Fucking landlords piss me off!

I just got a letter saying they got no money for December. That's funny, cuz I've got a bank statement right here that shows they were paid £500.

Of course, the housing officer doesn't work past 2.30 on a Thursday.

Not my f*cking problem they cocked up their direct debit system when they merged w/uber corporation.

As if I wouldn't miss £500! I'd better NOT have so much as a speck on my credit report over their balls up.

were you there at the start when they did an inventory? did they give you an inventory with the state of repair of everything? (I'm thinking hopefully there's some record of the state of the house when you moved in)

I would fight the agent definitely. I would also be tempted to complain about him either to trading standards or the appropriate estate agent regulatory authority (forgot what it is called - I think most main estate agents belong to it).

Yes, there was an inventory, though I don't think we got a copy of it. I would know better now. Anyway it used terms like "untidy" to describe the garden which had a skipload of rubbish, broken furniture and iron bars etc strewn across it. It now has a planted-up flower bed and clean/tidy yard. Silk purses and sow's ears leap to mind. And I think the really big problems like the exposed wiring and the broken glass were left off because they promised to deal with them immediately, in the first week. Most of it we did ourselves, and the broken glass is still there. I really don't like confrontation like this, I wish people would just be fair. I know we're not going to get treated decently and he is going to effectively steal the £50.

DH is all in favour of just letting him have whatever he wants, because at least it's only £50 and not the whole deposit, and if we kick up a fuss the agent will invent more problems and we will get nothing. I am going to get railroaded as usual.

I don't suppose you have any photos of what it was like when you moved in and what it's like now...?

No, I wish I did. He has told dh that we can't prove any of the work we did was done by us. He's right

Janh you beat me to it, i was just going to suggest that when you go round to remove the stickers, take your camera, and take photos of everything, walls, windows, carpets, and then if he does try and say other things are wrong, you have proof. I would also try the citizens advice bureau.

Thanks very much everyone who replied, I would be really tearing my hair out without mumsnet to rant at!!!

I think we're going to get him to put his insane demands in writing, because dh thinks if we don't roll over and co-operate he's invent more crap to charge us for. Then when we've got it in writing we'll discuss what to do about the bloody oven etc. WHY oh why does it have to be like this

dh spent yesterday evening steaming the bl**dy stickers off the walls at our old house, and the agent said hopefully we should be able to have a cheque for our deposit - minus £50 to get the oven cleaned - by the end of today. Noe he's "out" again and we haven't been able to get hold of him all day. How do people like this sleep at night? The house is worth at least £100 per month more in rent now because of all the work we did on it, without asking for a penny towards it. Why doesn't this count for anything? I am fed up Ignore me, I am just having a moan.

This agent, is he an estate agent? I'd complain to his professional body. Estate agents are VERY tightly regulated these days.
He does NOT have the right to keep your £50 and I am not surprised you are so angry.
When I was young I shared a house and the landlord wanted to keep our deposit. Luckily, my friend's father was a senior policeman, who just 'popped round' to discuss his daughter's deposit, while he happened to be still wearing his uniform. We got it all back. But I have been fleeced by other landlords. They are such shits.

I've been scammed for thousands by landlords. So much so that now, I tape EVERY move-in and move-out. And I mean from the moment I put the keys in the door for the first time. Last time, I even taped us at the letting agent, on the ride from the office directly to the flat, and then going through every room in here, plus opening the oven, toilet, shower, etc.

They're bastards for the most part.

Mine just wanted me to hand over my bank statement to prove my December rent hadn't been put back in my account.

Um, no, you're new computer system ballsed it up. YOU sort it out!

Yes, he's the estate agent that handles the rent etc for the landlord.

I would have fought him tooth and claw for the £50 but unfortunately I let dh deal with him, and the big wet fish has caved in... he says the agent basically implied that if dh didn't agree to his terms he would invent more charges and keep more of our deposit.

If we don't get some kind of result by the end of today, though, I will phone him in the morning and tell him to "hang fire" on the cheque as I am taking independent advice about letting him take £50 for the oven-cleaning. If it gets that far I will find out who their regulator is and speak to someone. The CAB was engaged all day yesterday. It all feels so petty and sordid, I don't know how he can do this to people for a living.

Thanks for advice everyone - it's great to have someone to talk to other than toddlers!