cb42.org Child Benefit

[WillCarden]

Hello Mumsnet

I am a Divorced father of 2, I have my boys 40% of the time and split costs 50/50 (uniforms, trips, holidays, medical etc) with my Ex. I am on low income but unable to access benefits to help me cope. I was wondering what the forums thoughts were on the splitting of Child Benefit (for two or more children) so that BOTH parents were able to access benefits. There is an article at www.cb42.org . This situation affects both men and women who though loving, caring and supportive parents are deemed as "absentee" by HMRC and DWP. To be classed as childless by these organisations when you would give your life for your children is hurtful, inhumane and discriminatory. I welcome your comments.

Regards

Will

"Please, if you are going to reply to me, do so with ADVICE and in knowledge of the system and legal standpoint. I have not asked for emotional viewpoints, nor social commentary - merely ADVICE based on THE LAW and benefits system."

This is an internet discussion forum. Try the CAB for qualified advice, MumsNet (and others) exist to discuss the subect at hand. The internet has some rules that you obviously need to be made aware of. 1: Shouting your real identity about is an open invitation for the less savoury elements of society to target you. I suggest you keep a close eye on your bank accounts in case of identity theft. 2: Promoting other sites is frowned upon. 3: Courtesty costs nothing, please show respect for other users as they in turn respect you. You are the only person on this thread shooting their mouth off.

Some questions:

How is three days a fortnight the same as 40% of the child care?

What figures are you basing your calculations on, and where have you found that information? Are they averages across the UK, or another country?

What medical expenses could a British citizen under the age of 16 possibly incur? You mention medical expenses in your OP...

How do you justify your time spent campaigning for whichever group it is you are/not a member of? Does this not interfere with the time you spend with your children?

Misogyny is not something that I subscribe to - what is the opposite? Please explain why you think I hold those views - if you are right (or at least I am perceived that way - just as important), then that would need to be something that I would want to address.

Dear giyadas: Please read the thread - especially the bit where I explain that I would pay the "lost benefits" back to her. "I suggested that benefits paid straight into Exes account, NOT BY ME but direct from HMRC - she could then pay me the balance. No risk to her (more of a risk to ME in fact), she would have same income"

Somewhat typical of the reaction here inasmuch that people "pitch in" without actually bothering to read the rest of the posts or even think. This is obviously the wrong place to look for constructive advice - I shall leave you all to it - shame, I had heard good things about the people and advice available here but it seems that it is just another "axe to grind" chat room.

Bye

purplepidjincantatem

3 days a fortnight (during the week ) - Every Other weekend, Friday to Sunday and 50% school holidays - actually 39% not 40, sorry.

Medical expenses- calpol, trips to hospital (go on I DARE ANYONE), general 1st aid, etc.

I don't campaign, just ask questions. I can type when my children are away from me.

Will, do I understand correctly that you want the benefits to be split between the 2 of you and then you just put it straight into her account? Doesn't that mean that there is no difference in where the money ends up?

I must have missed something but don't have time to re-read the thread again now.

And the electric, gas, household maintenence, furniture, repairing things that get broken, myriad of other little things that need sorting out immediately by the resident parent?

Your suggestion makes no logical sense. If you have an amicable agreement with your ex, surely she can just hand over some cash from the benefits to cover the children's expenses? That way, the government won't need to increase their income to pay for an even more complex system

And, seriously, sort out the amount of info you have out in public - you are shockingly googlable!

How, exactly, would this benefit the state? If the money is split down the middle and put into two bankc accounts (and you maintain you would generously transfer this money into your ex's account) then this just means a whole heap of extra administration costs which, in turn, would be generously passed on to the tax payer.

It wouldn't benefit the children involved and it wouldn't be of any use to the the Inland Revenue so the whole idea is a complete non starter.

Hi Beryl

Thank you for a straightforward question - I do appreciate that we are all busy and that reading an entire post is time consuming and asking for clarification is the intelligent option.

Basically

I will gain approx 7500 if I have CB for 1 as Council and HMRC will actually recognise that I have children. She will loose 3250 as a result of getting CB for 1 rather than 2. I propose my bens are paid into her acct (I can elect for that to be done) and she pays over to me the additional amount as it comes in to her- it seems strange that it works this way but trust me, those are the numbers. This way Her income stays the same, I can afford to house my children without fear of bailiffs every day and rebuild my business/work prospects. Incidentally - if I can do that I will NOT claim any benefits and I will be in a position to be able to pay increased maintenance to my Ex therefore everyone wins (including Joe tax Payer). At that point I will no doubt find myself paying for Sir Fred Goodwin's pension as well but Hey Ho - thats the way it seems to be -at the moment

Regards

Will

wow! how can i get 7500 extra cash

StewieGriffinsMom

Sorry if I am not clear (communication is the reaction you receive)

My comments are aimed not at women, not at men, simply asking for sensible suggestions as to how best cope with an intolerable, inequitable and hurtful system. I would ask YOU how you felt if every time you filled a form in you had to put a big fat "Zero" in the box when asked "How many children do you have". Please, if you can do nothing more, I ask that you consider that for a moment. To have to say that you have no children!!!!!!!!

I am not anti male nor anti female, just looking to be treated as an equal. One day I could put a "2" in that box, the next I was forced to put a "0" in the same box.

We all have the hard earned right to put an "X" in a box every four years - would this forum tolerate it if as soon as you became separated or divorced that right was taken away. Which is the more fundamental right??

Please do not vilify me for raising this point - just looking for help.

W

Okay, so as a 'family unit' you will be gaining £1000 per year from the taxpayer.
I can see that this will be beneficial to you and would be your preferred option. However, I imagine that if the system were changed so that both parents had to split benefits there are some people who would lose out, but more importantly the children who have a truly absent parent who needs to be chased to pay the slightest thing are likely to lose out as they will never see the benefit of this money.
Does that make sense?
To have it on a pick and choose basis of who wants it paid to one or both parents sounds like more cause for argument and bureaucracy.
No system is perfect unfortunately.

Also, £1k a year comes to £83 a month - does that really rebuild your work prospects and pay your rent too? If it does, then I bet you could find another way to earn that money each month. Some people buy stuff at car boot sales to ebay and make a fair profit. A couple of evenings pub work?

Why do you have to answer all forms saying you have no children? How is that correct?

Do you mean the forms ask if you have dependent children? because I can't think of any reason why you would put 0 instead of 2 when simply asked how many children you have.

DuelingFanjo

Quite Simply

If you are on a low income and have no children (according to HMRC) you get 0 CB, 1550 WTC, 0 CTC, and 5440 LHA (for 1 bed property) - Total 6990. If you have 1 child, WTC and CTC come to about 7000, LHA will be 7140 and CB 1060.

These figures are based on my income and where I live and are approximate but should give you and idea. All calculators are available online.

The difference between 0 and 1 child is disproportionately higher than between 1 and 2 .

I would not be claiming (or trying to) unless I needed it but at the moment I do.

W

Could you both claim to have one child living with you?

BerylOfLaughs

The figure is actually about 400 difference - that does make a big change, it will increase my "income" to £12,000 - about half the national average.

I COMPLETELY agree about the issue of absent fathers - they should be hounded to the end of the earth (although some children are better of without some men around I accept). It is NOT an easy one but where there is evidence of care and support then it is not THAT hard. Most of these benefits are means tested any way and a simple bank statement showing "Clarks shoes" or "puffins nursery" would suffice (don't mean to be flippant)

regards

W

BerylOfLaughs

4000 difference that should be!!

BerylOfLaughs

Unless you are in receipt of Child Benefit you are deemed by HMRC and Local Authorities NOT to have any children. This is the crux of the matter; CB though not a huge amount is a "gateway" benefit that allows you to claim others. Yes - it is perfectly legal and in deed common for parents to choose to split the CB - HMRC's own guidelines quote that CB can be paid to a person who a child "does not live with" so long as the person in receipt of the benefit pays MORE than the amount of the benefit in upkeep. That does not need to be in cash. I have asked my Ex to do this but she will not - hence my original reason for being here - simply to seek advice.

giyadas

Any form regarding benefit will ask how many children you have - on reading any accompanying notes it is always the case (for benefit forms) that you can only say you have children if you are in receipt of CB - hardly seems right (and I am not even talking about being fair)

regards all

Will

Sorry, my mistake on the numbers.
When you say you are not able to acknowledge your children every time you filled in a form, you mean only benefits forms. I think this part is a red herring, you know you have children as does any friend/family, you need to just deal with putting a zero on these forms. It doesn't mean you love your children any less.
Campaign for a change in the law if that is what you want but don't let it detract from trying to find a job that pays well. If I've understood correctly you are on £8k a year which is very low indeed. Use the time without your children to get extra hours at what you do or another job.

Are you in a 2-bed property at the moment?Is there any way you could downsize temporarily? I know a 1-bed isn't ideal but it is a lot cheaper and could help you get back on your feet again.
Really not sure how successful the campaign will be tbh. The current govt is all about cuts to even the most vulnerable people. I can't see them rushing to hand out more benefits to people in your situation.

BerylOfLaughs

Am doing what I can

Weekends I work developing my own business (every other weekend) and during the week I have a variety of part time jobs that fit in around school pick up times etc. I cannot afford childcare and as I "have no children" (re-benefits) am in ineligible for childcare tax credits. Childcare tax credits (dependent on me getting CB) would enable me to get a more regular job.

I believe that children brought up by both parents benefit emotionally and helps them develop into more rounded and happy people (in an ideal world with both parents happy together) This is why I choose to spend time with my children. It is right for them, and right for me. The long term benefits of this far outweigh any short term difficulties and I just need to find a way to make it possible. The payback through my ability to work and that of my children far out strips any short term burden on the taxpayer.

Regards

W

giyadas

Hi

I am considering this but the boys welfare is paramount. Its all a balancing act - I cant afford to be too choosy but need to make the right decisions.

I take on board you comments re-cut backs and appreciate that we all need top make sacrifices to pay for others mistakes - -however, having been a life long contributor and employer (pre credit crunch) I feel that more needs to be done for those with LEGITIMATE needs (esp where children are concerned)

W