I'm a Grandma, am I allowed here?

[AScream]

I hope that I'm allowed here?

DD and SiL lost their son at 35 weeks, nearly 4 weeks ago.
I was always going to be her birth partner, we have always been very close. (SiL would be there too, I was going to be there because she is terrible with pain)!

She had to give birth to him, I'm guessing that you all know that already.
I was there.
He had passed away already, we knew that. He died of a heart problem.

My DH is not her DF though he is close to her too. She has never known her DF.

Since it happened I've been sleeping in the other spare bedroom, because I'm not sleeping well at all

I'm due to start a new job tomorrow, everything is ready. They have held the post open for me for an extra month to get through this.
Except that I am not ready.

The hospital were fantastic, DD and SiL managed ok until it was time to take him away. DD couldn't let him go. In the end we had to gently coax her to let him go. Then she screamed and screamed.
All power to her for letting it out, but that scream? I won't ever forget that as long as I live.

This is not about me, I know that. And I promise that I'm not some sort of grief vampire.

At their request we have all of the baby things here, at our house. In one of the other bedrooms.

I'm in bed now, crying. I can't seem to stop, I am devastated for them both.

They are young and in their brighter moments they remind themselves that they have many years of trying ahead of them, conception doesn't seem to be a problem I'm not insensitive to those for whom it is, as they conceived with her Mirena still intact.

As I say, I'm just devastated. He is so loved.

Apologies if this is the wrong place for me. Apologies if anyone feels angry that I'm just the Grandma.
But I'm still devastated.

I'm sorry that I didn't post sooner.

@MrsC2018 every time I read it, your post makes me cry anew.

You too @Youseethethingis1, in fact that's very similar to what happened with my DD. I'm going to take a liberty here and make an assumption: I am absolutely sure that whatever you said and whatever you did, your Mum won't have even thought that you did anything wrong. She won't need to forgive you.

I won't lie, and I won't sugarcoat it, I am still crying every day and a lot of the night. Sleeping is difficult. Unfortunately, I can't take ADs.

I'm back at work now, finding it difficult to concentrate. I'm still doing my job but it's like I'm hypnotised by grief, my employers are good. I have been working there for many years and they remember our DCs when they were small, in a peripheral way my employers are feeling it too.

I'm going to be selfish here. Some of you will probably be angry with me. It won't be the worst thing to have happened this month.

Now for the even shitter bit.
I want to be completely clear: DD was saying that she wanted me as her birth partner before she even conceived.
She's always been the same, from childhood scrapes through fillings, to an operation, she always wanted her Mum.

Not long after I last posted here I was having a text conversation with DD, she suddenly got angry with me and hasn't spoken to me since. I have read through those messages again and again, I have no idea what I said that was wrong. I tried messaging again, I wrote her a letter and posted it. And nothing.

DD hasn't even spoken to DH since, and she has always adored him.

DH says that we just have to wait it out, that she needs some space and she'll come round eventually. I think that's his kind way of saying that I remind her too much of what she has lost.

So I am sitting it out and waiting.
I love her. I miss her terribly.

As I read through and got to the bit about you not being able to take anti depressants I wondered if homeopathy or bach flowers might help...

And then I read the heart breaking part about your daughter shutting you off. I am sorry.

You're not just anything! You're a mum and a grandma. I'm so sorry for your loss. I can't imagine how hard that must be.

💐

It's ok.
No, it's not ok at all. That's what I tell everyone when they ask.

What I mean to say on here is: thank you.
Thank you for telling me that I'm not a just, and that it's ok for me to grieve too.

Something I should have written about DD yesterday:

I don't really believe that DD is angry with me, or that she hates me, not really.
I do think that she is at the angry part of grief. And I am the safest person to take it out on. She knows that I will love her, no matter what, and that I will keep loving her. She can be angry with me, and when she stops being angry, she knows that we will pick up our relationship in just the same way as we did before.

Until now, throughout her life, DD has always been lucky. Doors have just opened up for her, she only has to say e.g. I'm fed up with my job, I'd love to be a journalist and a month later she's writing features for The Independent.
Or - and this one really did happen - we looked at this house today, but it is way over budget. It's such a shame because it's our perfect home. We could live there forever - cut to 6 months later sand she's moving into that house with SiL, a series of things happened, which resulted in them owning that house, for less than their budget too.

Understandably, losing their baby has hit her and hit her hard. Aside from all of the other considerations, this is the first thing in life that has not gone her way, which is why I think that it has hit her harder.

I don't think DD even considered that anything could have gone wrong with her pregnancy and birth - why would she?

Probably because I'm from a different generation, I will always be more cautious. I know what can go wrong, though I wouldn't ever share that with my daughters. I want them to feel relaxed and happy, not anxious, when they are pregnant or trying for a baby.

@ChateauMargaux than you. Don't be sorry about DD shutting me off, she'll be ok and I will be ok eventually.

Funnily enough, I am mainlining rescue remedy! I love it and I like to think that it is helping.

@Gr33ngr33ngr4ss thank you.

Really, although I have made this thread all about me, it's about DD and SiL. This is my outlet for my own feelings which I don't talk about IRL.

If you have read this thread, and even more so if you have made a contribution, thank you for your patience with me, your kindness and your understanding.

She will be at the angry stage. Veering back to disbelief. Racking her brain to figure out what she did wrong (nothing). Shouting at the universe because she didn't deserve this; she's a nice person.

It will pass. It's just really tough. Hang in there x

I'm so very sorry this has happened to you and your daughter and the rest of your family. It must be devastating for you all. I think you're being very caring and understanding and not at all making it about you. It must be extremely hard for you to be kept at a distance when all you want to do is be near to your daughter and support her. As you say, you are doing the right thing by backing off but being ready to be there for her when she is ready.

OP have you considered having some kind of therapy that is specifically designed to help with traumas like the terrible one both you and your daughter experienced. Like EMDR or Rewind technique. Both therapies have registers of approved practitioners. It wouldn't require you to engage in long term therapy, but may help you to reduce the level of distress from intrusive memories of what happened. It wouldn't stop you from feeling sad but would stop you from re-experiencing the event as if it was happening in the moment, which is what a traumatic flashback is.

I'm so sorry for your loss OP, just reading this post moved me to tears so I can't even imagine what you're going through actually living through this.

I just want to say firstly that you are important, your grief is extremely valid and we are here for you 💐. Please don't feel like you don't have a space here 💕 you very much do.

A few years ago my firstborn was born very poorly, it was a traumatic time. I am very close to my Mum but I definitely went through a little phase of pushing her away after it happened. I can't make complete sense of it - but I know part of it was because I didn't want to deal with anyone else's pain too as I was in such emotional turmoil inside. This wasn't rational thinking, but I felt angry that she was so upset about it and talking about it as if it happened to her. I just couldn't understand it at the time and it felt like such a deeply personal story to me that I didn't want anyone else talking about it in those early days whilst I was processing. Again I still can't make complete sense of why I felt that way - perhaps wanting to control the uncontrollable and feeling like I didn't want my DCs story to be out there - it felt like a betrayal to her perhaps? I think I just needed time to process the stuff going on for me before I could process anything else.

I will be honest, at that time I was a new mother and didn't have complete empathy for how hard the experience also was for my Mum. I actually look back now and feel sad about my reaction because I can now imagine how I'd feel if the same thing happened to my little ones. Their pain is our pain. This happened to you too.

I just wanted to share incase I could give any clarity at all, it's a different situation but I wondered if it could help at all - even just to confirm it's a normal part of coming to terms with something traumatic. It sounds like you know that your DD will come back to you - she will 💕💕💕 she's just processing.

Big hugs to you, I'm so sorry for your loss and I'm so sorry to your family - I actually can't think of anything more difficult to experience than the loss of a child. I hope there will be some sunshine for you all soon ☀️☀️☀️.

An update for anyone interested.

There isn't really anything to update you.
DD still isn't speaking to me, or messaging me.
Nothing.

We used to speak every day, now nothing.

I know that I am being selfish here. It feels as though someone has scooped part of my heart out with a spoon.
My DGS died and my DD has gone.

My other DC is younger, they went to Uni and stayed there for their job. They used to be in touch a lot, less so over the years.

A decade ago I had a house full. Now it's just me and DH, we love each other but we are grieving separately. Does that make sense? Neither of us is pressuring the other to get over it, it hasn't brought us closer together. Nor pushed us apart.
We are bewildered satellites, moving around one another.

We go to DGS' grave site and place one flower there, every week.

I have so much love to give and it is going spare.
I don't need anyone to reply, I'm not sure what you could say.

We are worried about our DD and don't know what to do. We keep wondering whether we should get in touch, whilst knowing that we have to leave her until she is ready.

Simply, I am devastated.

for others facing similar.

I’m so sorry for your loss. How well do you get on with your son in law? Could you speak to him to find out how your daughter is doing? Or could your other daughter speak to her? It must be so hard not hearing from her, though the only thing you can do is give her space.

Oh I have just read this entire thread and it’s so sad 😞

im so sorry for the loss of your grandson. to go from such excitement to such grief must’ve been nightmarish. and it must feel like it’s changed your family.

i think your DH is right - give it time. it sounds like your daughter is facing a tragic loss without the backdrop of personal resilience, so she must be in a very bewildering place at the moment. she’s probably angry with the world and taking it out on you.

i hope time starts to heal for you all 💐

So sorry for your loss. My daughter miscarried over fifteen years ago and she was furious that I was upset at the loss of the potential grandchild.
Take your time, healing comes slowly over such a grievous loss .
As pp have said, be kind to yourself, possibly get yourself some counselling so you have a safe space to let it all out. You have my utmost sympathy.

To everyone, thank you. 💐

Finally she emailed me, it was tentative at first. We met for coffee and ended up hugging and crying. We didn't get the coffee. DD kept saying 'I'm so sorry Mum'. Of course she doesn't have to be sorry, I just want her to be ok and to know that she is loved. DH and I will do anything we can for them and our other DCs.

Instead, we went back to her house. We talked and tidied and drank tea and talked some more.

When my DGS was stillborn DD bled afterwards. Since then her periods haven't come back. She may be pregnant again. None of us are sure whether they are ready, and she acknowledges this, but a rainbow 🌈 baby is still a rainbow 🌈.

As I said, they are young and fertile, they are financially stable enough and emotionally doing as well as can be expected. They have a very kind consultant who talked them through it all recently, after they had processed their initial grief. That has given them confidence in their own bodies again.

I'm not sure whether I am making sense?

If/when she is pregnant again I know that the midwives will monitor her so closely. And of course, I will be there again, because that's what Mum's do.

I love her so much, I love my SiL too. Knowing that they are 'ok' and they are working through their grief in a healthy way, that is such a comfort to me. I have been so worried, particularly about DD. I love them so much.

DGS won't ever be forgotten, he will always be loved and any new brothers or sisters who do make it will be adored too. No baby can replace him, but they may arrive and they will be just as special.

All I have is love and hope.

Thank you for updating. I'm so glad you're reconciled. X

What pain. But well done to you both to have bridged that gap.

Love and hope... absolutely.

Sending you peace and love, and another hug OP. X

Oh I am crying for you :( I'm so sorry for you and your DD and DSil and all you have been through. I can't imagine anything worse. The thought of watching my DD ever go through something like that wounds me.

I'm very glad you've reconnected. ❤️ And I sincerely hope that you all are okay.