Surgical menopause

Scottishbagpipelady · 2025-01-27T19:59:23+00:00

Hi all. I’ll post on the menopause site first. 4 months ago I had my ovaries out and tubes. Due to my colon cancer spreading. I didn’t need chemotherapy for this as chemo tends to not work in the ovary department. There was no spread in any of my other parts and everything else was clear. It was only the one ovary the tumor was contained too. 2kg!! So all good. I was told I was curable. I’m waffling I know. Four months on I’m still arguing with myself to go on HRT, as this surgical menopause is crap!! I’m 51, so menopause must have been close. I was on the venlaflaxine for the hot sweats but it doesn't seem to work now. Has anyone else had experience with surgical menopause? These are my symptoms Hot flushes/ day and night hip pain buttock pain groin pain thigh pain finger pain wind. genital itch breast tenderness Is all this normal with surgical menopause? I’m paranoid with the cancer.

BCSurvivor · 28/01/2025 00:11

Hi, @Scottishbagpipelady
Yep, it all sounds perfectly normal to me!
I went into surgical menopause at 51, 6 years ago, after chemo for breast cancer.
Most of the symptoms you have described, aswell as insomnia.
The hip and lower back pain has got worse for me in the past two years or so, not constant pain, but now and again, aswell as general stiffness.
The hot flushes...I still get them, but they have definitely got better in the past three years...the first two years was the worst!
I can't take hrt because my breast cancer was oestrogen positive, so a surgical menopause has been brutal!

JinglingSpringbells · 28/01/2025 09:00

Unless you've been advised not to use HRT then why not?

I don't know if this is relevant- you'd need to talk to a specialist gynae who understands HRT- but HRT protects against bowel cancer so whether that's another reason for using it now- something to query?

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 10:52

Hi @Scottishbagpipelady. Going through something similarish myself.
I had my ovaries and tubes removed at the end of 2024 due to a ruptured ovarian cyst. A mass on my ovary (apparently not the ruptured cyst though) turned out to be cancer. It was the lining of my womb due to endo so now I need to have my womb removed. Waiting on scan to see if it has spread.

i can’t use HRT due to the cancer. I hadn’t felt like I’ve had many symptoms of surgical menopause eg just a few hot flushes that aren’t terrible and in the last few days mild headaches.
But I’m having random mild pains in legs, shoulders and under ribs. Not agony so maybe it is just health anxiety as of course everything is making me think the cancer has spread.
Could these actually be menopause symptoms?!
I am in my late 30s with young kids so both the diagnosis and not being able to use HRT is very upsetting.

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 10:54

BCSurvivor · 28/01/2025 00:11

Hi, @Scottishbagpipelady
Yep, it all sounds perfectly normal to me!
I went into surgical menopause at 51, 6 years ago, after chemo for breast cancer.
Most of the symptoms you have described, aswell as insomnia.
The hip and lower back pain has got worse for me in the past two years or so, not constant pain, but now and again, aswell as general stiffness.
The hot flushes...I still get them, but they have definitely got better in the past three years...the first two years was the worst!
I can't take hrt because my breast cancer was oestrogen positive, so a surgical menopause has been brutal!

When did your symptoms start?
my surgery was a month ago and I haven’t felt any awful symptoms yet but could they still come?

CoastalCalm · 30/01/2025 10:55

I’m in similar position after full hysterectomy start of November but thankfully I must have been well through menopause before that (two years since last period) as the sweats etc have all stopped. HRT not an option for me anyway due to a stroke in 2020 -fingers crossed your symptoms either reduce or HRT sorts them for you

BCSurvivor · 30/01/2025 11:04

Hi, @Toarrie !
My periods stopped completely after my second chemo session.
Symptoms wise, it's a bit hazy to say when they started as I had 6 chemo sessions, all with their own side effects, plus radio, so I was on my knees by the end of treatment, both physically and emotionally.
But I remember the hot flushes starting with a vengeance quite soon after finishing radio, along with extreme fatigue and insomnia, both of which I still have.
I had lower back ache during the first year, and mild stiffness.
The stiffness and bone ache - hips, knees, lower back...has got gadually worse over time, although it is not constant.
Menopausal weigh gain has been gradual and I feel that my body has definitely aged on the inside.
My memory recall for things is definitely worse than it was, but more in the past three years.

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 11:12

@BCSurvivor thank you.
I was so fit and healthy before this, rarely even picked up the kids bugs from nursery/school so it is all a bit of a shock to me. Going through menopause and having cancer. But I just have to deal with it, if I get through the cancer I’m sure weight gain and looking and feeling older won’t seem as big of a deal. Fatigue and memory problems sound hard going.
I am sorry you have had such a rough ride, I am not looking forward to starting chemo.

Discombobble · 30/01/2025 11:17

I think everyone is different - I had a surgical menopause (massive fibroids) and felt so much better afterwards. Didn’t really have any symptoms, so didn’t need HRT. If your symptoms are bothering you to that extent, I think you should do what makes you feel better

Original poster

Scottishbagpipelady · 30/01/2025 21:53

Thanks all. I had my operation In august last year. Started of with hot sweats about a week later. Flushes are still here but not as intense. Sweating during the night though.
The past few weeks my joint pain has been awful. Even my fingers. Worse today
Mind you I was in on holiday from work for two weeks then went back. My jobs physical. So that’s maybe why my joints hurt so much today. My cancer wasn’t hormonal, but stk hesitant to try HRT yet to get up

OP posts:

JinglingSpringbells · 30/01/2025 22:34

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 10:52

Hi @Scottishbagpipelady. Going through something similarish myself.
I had my ovaries and tubes removed at the end of 2024 due to a ruptured ovarian cyst. A mass on my ovary (apparently not the ruptured cyst though) turned out to be cancer. It was the lining of my womb due to endo so now I need to have my womb removed. Waiting on scan to see if it has spread.

i can’t use HRT due to the cancer. I hadn’t felt like I’ve had many symptoms of surgical menopause eg just a few hot flushes that aren’t terrible and in the last few days mild headaches.
But I’m having random mild pains in legs, shoulders and under ribs. Not agony so maybe it is just health anxiety as of course everything is making me think the cancer has spread.
Could these actually be menopause symptoms?!
I am in my late 30s with young kids so both the diagnosis and not being able to use HRT is very upsetting.

@Toarrie It may be worth asking for other opinions on no HRT. There is a lot online from medical sites saying it is safe for women after ovarian cancer - or is it endo cancer? Sorry if I've misunderstood. Obviously you need to talk to your drs on this but there are different opinions and approaches. You could see a menopause specialist as well as your oncologists- or ask them to talk to each other. You will need support for your bone health so check they will monitor that.

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 22:53

JinglingSpringbells · 30/01/2025 22:34

@Toarrie It may be worth asking for other opinions on no HRT. There is a lot online from medical sites saying it is safe for women after ovarian cancer - or is it endo cancer? Sorry if I've misunderstood. Obviously you need to talk to your drs on this but there are different opinions and approaches. You could see a menopause specialist as well as your oncologists- or ask them to talk to each other. You will need support for your bone health so check they will monitor that.

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@JinglingSpringbells no you didn’t misunderstand. I think it is ovarian as it was on my ovary but it was the lining of my womb which is why they said no HRT. It was the gynaecologist and he was quite definite. No HRT, ever.
I am concerned about my bones but honestly cancer is a bigger concern for me. I will look in to it though.

JinglingSpringbells · 31/01/2025 07:52

Toarrie · 30/01/2025 22:53

@JinglingSpringbells no you didn’t misunderstand. I think it is ovarian as it was on my ovary but it was the lining of my womb which is why they said no HRT. It was the gynaecologist and he was quite definite. No HRT, ever.
I am concerned about my bones but honestly cancer is a bigger concern for me. I will look in to it though.

Show quote history

It's probably worth talking it through at some later time?

The RCOG has guidance on HRT after cancer (it's online so you could read it some time if you want to.)

Their guidance (last time I looked) was that if it's Stage 1 endometrial cancer that is limited to the uterus, HRT is ok. Also, if it's early ovarian cancer, HRT is sometimes possible. From what you have said, it seems it's not ovarian cancer but uterine cancer spread to an ovary.

I completely understand your concerns and the priority but it's just as you're so young, bone health will need to be addressed long term with scans and maybe meds.

I do hope your treatment goes well x

TwentyKittens · 31/01/2025 08:01

I had ovarian cancer at 45. Everything removed. Four weeks after surgery I went on HRT, as I was burning up (felt like I was on fire constantly) and suicidal.

Still on it over a decade later, and no intention of coming off. It's protecting my bones and has other benefits. And I'll take the small breast cancer increase in exchange for the positives.

Toarrie · 31/01/2025 08:33

JinglingSpringbells · 31/01/2025 07:52

It's probably worth talking it through at some later time?

The RCOG has guidance on HRT after cancer (it's online so you could read it some time if you want to.)

Their guidance (last time I looked) was that if it's Stage 1 endometrial cancer that is limited to the uterus, HRT is ok. Also, if it's early ovarian cancer, HRT is sometimes possible. From what you have said, it seems it's not ovarian cancer but uterine cancer spread to an ovary.

I completely understand your concerns and the priority but it's just as you're so young, bone health will need to be addressed long term with scans and maybe meds.

I do hope your treatment goes well x

Show quote history

Thank you very much @JinglingSpringbells
it is a unusual one as consultant doesn’t think it has spread from my womb as womb looked ok in ultrasound, MRI and when he was operating and he said for it to have spread I would have had symptoms? But as I have endometriosis there was a bit of my womb on my ovary which had developed into cancer. Getting more scans and womb removed to confirm. So currently stage 1. But he said something about hormones causing it? I need to discuss more.
I do also have a family history of breast cancer, my grandmother died from it and my mum had precancerous cells and her sister had BC (although in her late 70s now!).
I am a healthy weight, already do weight training and have a healthy diet. Gp has given me some calcium and vit d tablets.

JinglingSpringbells · 31/01/2025 10:12

Toarrie · 31/01/2025 08:33

Thank you very much @JinglingSpringbells
it is a unusual one as consultant doesn’t think it has spread from my womb as womb looked ok in ultrasound, MRI and when he was operating and he said for it to have spread I would have had symptoms? But as I have endometriosis there was a bit of my womb on my ovary which had developed into cancer. Getting more scans and womb removed to confirm. So currently stage 1. But he said something about hormones causing it? I need to discuss more.
I do also have a family history of breast cancer, my grandmother died from it and my mum had precancerous cells and her sister had BC (although in her late 70s now!).
I am a healthy weight, already do weight training and have a healthy diet. Gp has given me some calcium and vit d tablets.

Show quote history

That does sound quite complicated.
Yes, if it was endo cancer you'd normally have had bleeding of some kind (not your normal period.)

You do have a high-ish BC risk based on the family.

However, it's worth talking to other drs in time.

The idea of giving out calcium tablets is now under question. They are being linked more and more to heart disease as the calcium can fur up arteries. If you get enough calcium in food (1000mgs a day) you don't need to take supplements.

www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/calcium-supplements-should-you-take-them

Toarrie · 31/01/2025 10:39

@JinglingSpringbells yes consultant said it was unusual but not unheard of. I had no bleeding other my regular period. Apparently I have just been unlucky.
I hadn’t heard that about calcium tablets, in fact my consultant said he takes them. Thank you for your advice, really appreciate it. I have a good, healthy and varied diet so likely would get enough on a regular day.