Is this old age? How it’s going to be from now on? 🤦‍♀️

[DollyDaydream55]

I’m taking HRT tablets (Kliofem). My GP stopped them last year as she felt “you’ve been on them long enough” 🙄 and at 59, I was plunged back into sweats/bone pain/sleep issues and all the usual. Three months later, she restarted HRT, at my insistence.

Im not sure if it’s “just” old age but my body is wracked with aches and pains. I also have cervical C1-T2 degeneration. Some disc bulges and stenosis (narrowing) of cord. I’m in agony. Last MRI scan (have them usually every couple of years) showed it had worsened significantly in the past two years. Also have lumbar spine pain but the neck’s the worst. Up to now I’ve been on paracetamol and occasionally, codeine 30mg at night if desperate. Can’t take Bruges but have used Voltarol gel (utterly useless).

The hospital consultant told me to take Gabapentin but ten days in, I was very woozy still and the pain hadn’t changed. I stopped. Can’t see GP till March and I’m struggling massively. I also have a very physical job so, that’s beginning to be a big problem too. I’m 60. Am active. Walk miles with the dog. Eat reasonably well.

Would anyone recommend I give Gabapentin another try? See a HRT special clinician(???) Will the dizzy/wooziness wear off. I drive as part of my care job.

It's a myth that you can only take HRT for so long. The hormones aren't going to magically come back on their own. I'd see a private menopause specialist if you can afford it.

OP I take amytriptiline for cervical disc herniation (I also have arthritis and stenosis in my neck and disc bulges further down) its worked well for me. Having said that I have had to modify my life a lot and no longer do any lifting or heavy exertion as its flares it all back up.
gabapentin will only really work if its nerve pain , I think. Its not the drug of choice for bone or arthritis pain.

My GP stopped them last year as she felt “you’ve been on them long enough”

Find a different GP. This is very outdated thinking, and erroneous thinking if it plunged you back into perimenopause symptoms.

FWIW I’m 64, and after discussion with my GP am planning to stay on HRT for the rest of my life.

Grrrrr! Predictably, I'm going to repeat what PPs have said.

There is no time limit to using HRT.
Your GP should not have stopped it.

NICE guidance says 'discuss with patient, outline risks and benefits, let patient make decision.' (I'm paraphrasing that, of course.)

Anyway you are back on HRT.

Kliofem is not great, because tablet form is not advised for women over 60. More risk of blood clots.
You should swap to patches (or estrogen gel +a progesterone.)

Going to question your back issues. Have you had bone density scans?
The degeneration might be more than that. It could be fractures and these can be missed. Have you had a DEXA scan? It sounds a bit like undiagnosed osteoporosis.

As you are already on HRT I'm not sure how seeing a meno/HRT specialist would help other than prescribing a different type.

Who's dealing with your spine/back issue? Are you seeing a consultant rheumatologist? (I'd hope so!)

I suppose the main point @DollyDaydream55 is what's behind all this with your spine?

Degeneration is usually osteoarthritis. It can also be osteoporosis.

If it's the former, there is not a lot you can do as it's wear and tear. However, HRT can help maintain the soft cartilage around the vertebra and help stop some degeneration, where the bones will rub together.

I think you need a full explanation / assessment of what's going on and any life style or diet changes that might help. Living on painkillers is not great as some are addictive or have a lot of side effects.

Sorry I missed the point that you'd been put back on HRT. Agree with @JinglingSpringbells re the type though. Kliofem didn't agree with me and am now on gel & utrogestan.

I think gabapentin can help with lots of types of pain. Personally I'd give it a month or so before discounting it.

Agree you need a DEXA scan. Osteopenia is very common in menopausal women and can progress to debilitating osteoporosis if not treated. I took Fosomax for several years and that helped.

I'd also see a physiotherapist to see if exercise might be appropriate. For me, it has been life- changing, especially weight training. But do so only under medical supervision, given all your issues.

I take Sertraline 100mg daily for fibromyalgia. I supplement with VitD and Omega3. I also take a collagen supplement but, that’s for skin. Had bone density test ten yrs ago (have had neck issues from 30’s). It was fine. Referred to rheumatologist but he saw me one and discharged me as it’s NOT rheumatoid arthritis despite a family history of Crohns, ulcerative colitis and psoriasis. My joints now are so sore, especially elbows, the skin is tender to touch. The SKIN!

As a child I went to boarding school and we were literally starved. Ballet school so, a lot of very hard physical work as a kid/teen/young adult. I don’t think that did me any good. Many of my friends have had hip/knee replacement and are in massive pain.

@Tethersend01 can I ask what dose of Amytriptaline you’re prescribed. I was on the lowest dose at night for a few years in my 40’s but then, taken off.

Had bone density test ten yrs ago (have had neck issues from 30’s).

But that's 10 years out of date! That's no good.

It's not telling you how you are now. Women lose up to 5% of bone a year for 5 years immediately after the menopause. (HRT can help but it depends how old you were at menopause and how long you took hrt.)

DEXA scans are done every 3 years at least (and every 2 years for women with osteoporosis) to monitor bones.

Seriously, you need to push for one and go back to the GP and maybe get a referral to another rheumatologist.

You haven't actually got a diagnosis from what you have said.

Your only diagnosis seems to be degeneration of the spine (wear and tear= osteoarthritis.) If you work as a carer, being over and lifting, this is only going to make it worse.

Ought I to be taking calcium supplements?

OP, I think you could do with looking around for a new doctor. This is what I did as my old doctor also subscribed to the belief that I should come off HRT asap!

My new doctor is a menopause specialist, and as far as I'm concerned I'm on HRT for life.

I'm sorry I can't help you with your other issues.

No.

The latest research shows they do no good, and may actually cause furring up of the arteries. The only people who need them (possibly) are the very elderly who are not eating a good diet.

You do need a DEXA scan. Can't understand why this has never been offered recently when you have spinal pain and are 60.

My mum died in 2019. She was 79. She had multiple spinal fractures which she had no idea of u til she went in to hospital at the end. She always complained of back pain and told to use paracetamol, up to 8 daily.

Makes me cross when I think of her, always with a heat pad at her back 🤦‍♀️☹️

Agree with all pps - my Mum is 76 and has just gone back onto HRT (her GP initially said no, so it took a private referral to a menopause specialist who did her first prescription and then wrote to her GP to advise that it's continued) after many years struggling when she came off it 10+ years ago. She's feeling tons better already - it's outdated advice that you need to stop..!

I started HRT in my late 40's a few years and intend never to stop. It's maddening that women are deemed not to need these vital hormones once we reach a certain age - wouldn't happen if men needed them.....

I had a DEXA scan 15 years ago which showed osteopenia of the spine. I couldn't get on with Fosamax so stopped. Another scan two years later was normal. The difference was due to my taking up yoga, which I still do, although I expect any weight bearing exercise would help. I hadn't realised that bone is living tissue.

Do you have a rash on your elbows as well? It could be the rash associated with coeliac disease? Also autoimmune like chrons' disease. Would be worth checking thyroid too.

If your mum had osteoporosis (which is what you are describing) then you ought to have a DEXA scan. It sounds as if she wasn't actually diagnosed with it or given any treatment? Why was that?

Osteoporosis is often hereditary.

The sooner it's diagnosed, the better the outcome, as most of the strong drugs can only be used for a few years and sometimes it's not possible to build all the bone density back.

Even if this is not what you have, it needs ruling out.

Please go back to your GP and discuss all of this, and get a scan sorted.

Isn't fibromyalgia = aches & pains everywhere?

I am starting HRT any day now and was told, today, that after 60 my risks of clotting go up and it's recommended I stop HRT.

@lljkk Yes, fibromyalgia is all aches and pains but surely, there’s something more than paracetamol for it?

@BreakingPointAgain No. No rash. Years ago I had an allergy thing where I just kept ending up in hospital as I’d puff up, for no apparent reason. It got to the stage where I needed to carry an Epipen. They got used to me in various A&E units 😐 Then… it just stopped. No explanation. No “reason”. It ended as quickly as it began. GP said it was an auto-immune oddity.

Even in USA, the drugs you're on/been offered appear to be the standard treatment.

Google says that you should expect Gabapentin to need 3+ weeks to work, so 10 days wasn't long enough to know if it helps.

Trying to track, you're also taking
for fibromyalgia=chronic aches, an antidepressant = sertraline
for fibromy, paracetamol & occasional codeine
for "sweats/bone pain/sleep issues and all the usual", Kilofem hRT

VitD and Omega3.
for skin, collagen supplement

is that the full list of conditions that need/ pills?
Google says fibromyal not supposed to escalate but it can flare up in response to many things, hormones and stress/lack of sleep etc. I'm not a pharmacist, but am thinking you'd be better off staying on the Gabapentin for longer before giving up.

@lljkk Thank you for putting in so much effort to my problem 😊

I take anti hypertensive meds for blood pressure which is under control. I am not overweight, a non smoker and exercise regularly each day. Have done, all my life.

Am going to try the Gabapentin again, from this evening.

I have fibromyalgia & inflammatory arthritis/rheumatoid & osteoarthritis
I've tried every pain pill over last decade. Gabapentin, pregabilin, amitryptaline, duloxetine etc
The only thing that has worked for me & it's bn a godsend is Low Dose Naltrexone (LDN)
I researched it, joined the Fb support pages and asked the Pain Management Clinic to prescribe it for me, which they did. GP's won't prescribe it.
There is only one place in uk that dispenses it which is Dicksons Chemist in Glasgow. Look them up and you can book an on line consultation with their specialist doctors, I think it's £50/£60 for that and then each prescription costs around £ 22.50
I also have ME/CFS and it's bn literally life changing for me. It's used, off licence, to treat a whole host of conditions, a lot of auto immune ones & it's recommended for Fibro.
Go research it, see what you think.
It's a v slow titration starting from 0.5mg liquid and working up fortnightly by 0.5 increments until you get to 4.5mg where you transfer to capsule form.
Everyone is different and some find 2.5mg fine where others are better at max dose of 4.5mg
As you titrate up so slowly, you find your on sweet spot, where you will feel so so much better and my quality of life has improved drastically. If when increasing the dose is too high symptoms return so you drop it down again. Hence the "sweet spot" terminology.
I cannot recommend it enough. It's even helped my brain fog & fatigue.
I'm also on Setraline too & the combination works well. I've dropped all the other pain meds I was on. I only need to take them if I'm in a flare

Your dr needs to do some more reading on HRT!

Have a look online-loads of info there.

Basically, women are not advised to use tablet form hrt after 60 as the risk with tablet form is there (anyway, for all women) and you should swap to transdermal (patches or gel/spray.)

It's pretty simple and if your dr doesn't know this, they are dreadfully behind the times and clearly have not had any HRT training.