I'm at the end of my tether. The rage and Drs.

[WildFlowerBees]

I am peri (apparently) started at 40 now 45, my GP was utterly useless so I got on the waiting list for a hormone clinic in London saw the Dr she prescribed me Utrogestan saying that's all I needed.

For a while I felt like I was normal again until I started feeling the rage and at my checkup she upped my dosage and told me to take it daily.

Had blood test done on day 21 of my cycle and showed poor levels of progesterone but oestrogen and testosterone were high.

Couldn't get to London to the clinic for next appointment and dr refused a zoom so moved to the Newson clinic where you can do all by zoom.

Dr there tells me I absolutely need oestrogen regardless of blood results, take Utrogestan on days 14-28, Evorel 25 patches cut in half so 12.5 twice a week.

Well, my appetite went through the roof I bloated, my breasts are now a cup size bigger and I feel fucking awful. Stopped the patches but no idea what I need or now who to go to because two very well known clinics are telling me different things.

I am so angry and hot all of the time and pissed off that I paid thousands for a breast reduction because I had awful back and neck issues only for a bloody patch to make them grow again.

I feel like a whale, I don't know what to do now.

can you try your GP again? ask to see another one if you have that option maybe? I had to fight to get the right treatment from mine too, which is hard when you're feeling ragey and vulnerable, but I got there in the end good luck 💐

The Mirena coil drastically reduced my rages.

I guess it all depends on your symptoms
and what your expectations for improvement are.
just giving progesterone is weird.
Newson dr sounds right. But if you can’t tolerate the lowest dose of oestrogen, maybe that isn’t what you need either.
GP? Maybe investigate other causes for symptoms?

I had similar issues with private clinics (including Newson) telling me different things (I have lots of autoimmune diseases that caused early menopause aged 37). I ended up going back on the waiting list to see an NHS menopause specialist (usually a gynaecologist) because I thought at least if something goes wrong or I need advice I can get it for free in a system that is all linked up. It took 2 years (2 years!) for that appointment to come through and I am now back on the HRT - as Newson prescribed actually, oestrogel and utrogestan (and the mini pill for contraception and some progesterone).

I have to be honest… it’s made my boobs huge too and I’ve put on weight. However, I am mainly taking it for the osteoporosis protection and cardiovascular benefits so I’m sticking with it. How long did you try it for? It may be that it may have evened out if you kept going with it.

I would try to see an nhs specialist for a third opinion. I am very surprised that the first clinic purely prescribed progesterone- that is incredibly unusual. Usually it’s the oestrogen that’s the most important part of HRT and progesterone is prescribed for those with a womb to stop the lining of the womb from becoming too thick (which is an increased cancer risk).

Is this a mainstream hormone clinic or one offering 'bio identical HRT'? There are a couple in London that are not working necessarily in the usual way.

I don't want you to post the name here, but feel free to PM me as I know quite a bit about the various clinics and their approach.

Both Drs I have seen are both private hormone Drs costing an arm and a leg because my GP was so dire. I do not want the coil at all. All I was offered was the coil and antidepressants so felt I had no choice but to pay to see a hormone dr.

Dr 1 seems to think that as my oestrogen and testosterone levels are higher than normal I do not need extra supplementation.

Dr 2 says not true, the patches have been awful. Is there anything else?

@JinglingHellsBells one offering Bio identical, I am on Utrogestan.

Sorry- ignore- I see you are no longer with them and went to the Newson clinic.

That's a tiny dose of estrogen- a 25mcg patch is the smallest available.

You don't need 14 days of Utrogestan. I wish the Newson team would stop telling women this! It's 12 days. The newson clinic decided it was 'easier' for women to remember 14 days (as if we all all stupid) rather than counting to 12.
Some women find 14 days far too hard to tolerate. The leaflet in Utoregestan clearly says 12 days, from day 15-26.

The other clinic said to take Utrogestan every day. The patch I had to cut in half so 12.5. I'm really sensitive to hormones I didn't think I would have an issue with such a low dose though.

Didn't particularly like the Newson dr I spoke to, was very judgemental about the previous clinic and spent most of my appointment talking to me with her eyes closed.

I'm not sure who to trust anymore no one seems to say the same thing.

Following your update I'd guess you are having too much progesterone.

What's going on with your own periods? Had they stopped, become less frequent, heavier, lighter? What were you main peri symptoms?

My advice is you consider reducing the Utrogestan to 12 days per month (not 28 days - per month which is 30-31 days.) That's what a lot of consultants suggest and sticking to the same day each month, and counting to 12! So, 1st Sept, then 1st October, etc.

Thanks @JinglingHellsBells my periods are regular no change at all in them. Main symptoms are wanting to take heads of people for simply breathing and am always boiling no sweats though and my memory is now shot, I forget what I'm saying halfway through a sentence.

There is a tablet form of HRT which is for younger women in peri. It's called Tridestra. It's a 3-monthly cycle. Out of the 3 months, you take estrogen every day for the whole 3 months, and estrogen + progestogen for 14 days.

There is also the tablet form HRT called Femoston - the progestogen is similar to Utrogestan but slightly better tolerated by some women.

You might be better off Utrogestan and trying either of these.
You are very young, so there should not be any concerns about blood clots, because women over 60 are advised to use transdermal estrogen, not tablets.

TBH I'd go to your GP armed with info, and ask to try either of the above tablet form OR reduce your Utrogestan to 12 days and use a 25mgs patch and see how that feels.

It's usually the progestogen that causes RAGE and it needs enough estrogen to balance it. Def not a good idea to use too much!

Have you checked your thyroid levels? Also vit D, B12 and iron/ferritin? It might be a combination of a couple of things?

Thank you so much @JinglingHellsBells really appreciate you taking the time to give me that information. I'll take this to the GP and see what they say.

@SeaToSki yes had those checked Vit D very low so take a supplement for it. Thyroid was fine.

I tried a few different preps and now use oestrogel and utrogestan it's been a godsend

I wish doctors would stop with trying to get everyone to have a coil. It’s so tiresome. I flatly refused to have one for various reasons so I take the mini pill instead and take utrogestan every day for my progesterone. I know that doesn’t suit everyone but it’s like no one ever even suggests the mini pill!

The mini pill is progestogen. Why are you using it as well as Utrogestan? Is the mini pill for contraception?

The mini pill is not prescribed (except off licence) as part of HRT and then it has to be taken in much bigger doses than for birth control.

I take it as half the progesterone in HRT and to control my periods. This method has been agreed by both the Newson clinic and by my menopause specialist on the NHS. I take 100mg utrogestan every single night and the mini pill. It works for me and I’m happy with that routine. It means I don’t ever have any bleeding - I have lupus and previously I was having large clots during my periods which I hated, this is another reason why I like being on the mini pill.

Everything I take is prescribed on the NHS.

And yes I know the mini pill is progesterone- that’s what I am saying, I take that and utrogestan for progesterone (both together).

What were your thyroid numbers? Sometimes it looks fine, but its not actually. The range is really wide and you could be a person who is meant to be right at the end of the range, if your test shows you in the middle or the other end you might look fine, but actually are not. Did they check you thyroid antibodies as well?