Anyone choosing NOT to use HRT?

[WandaWomblesaurus73]

Does anyone feel that HRT isn't for them or feel happier without it?

@whywouldntyou

I am in my 60s so well past it but I don't know anyone who has taken HRT, we've all just 'got on with it'. To my mind you are just delaying it, unless you plan to take it until you die? There was an article I spotted this week that said when it is stopped the symptoms can be worse. I don't know, but taking it certainly isn't inevitable.

Symptoms won’t be worse when you stop taking it - that isn’t logical. They are the symptoms you would have had anyway? It might be a shock to come off it and see what it’s like without? Can you link to the article?

@RedPandaWanda

I certainly don’t think it’s inevitable for every woman. I know several in their late 50/60’s who have sailed through without any additional help. Unfortunately I’m not sure if I will be one of those lucky ladies, I am almost 49 and often feel like crap but atm that has mainly been because of my horrendously heavy periods and subsequent awful anaemia. On a side note can I ask if you had any side effects from the mirena? The gynaecologists keep pushing it at me but some of the reports of awful side effects have put me off especially as it’s something inside you which you can just stop taking if there are any adverse side effects.

For me the Mirena has been great - no side effects which surprised me because of my previous history with the pill! After about 6 months I stopped bleeding - but I still have a sense of a period - so a sense of my cycle - but not the constant draining blood loss that only Dracula would find sexy.

[quote ArabellaScott]But you're not supposed to need smear tests post age 65.

'You'll usually stop being invited for screening once you turn 65. This is because it's very unlikely that you'll get cervical cancer.

You'll only be invited again if 1 of your last 3 tests was abnormal.

If you're 65 or older and have never been for cervical screening, or have not had cervical screening since the age of 50, you can ask your GP for a test.'

www.nhs.uk/conditions/cervical-screening/when-youll-be-invited/[/quote]
Surely the point is that if the poster's mum has not had a test for 'years', she is likely to have missed her last one at 65.

@ArabellaScott If you want data, step away from the very out of date NHS info. It gives a snapshot of information, in layman's terms.

If you want to read real research papers, try Google Scholar, or Climacteric ( journal of the International Menopause Society), Watch Youtube videos where Nick Panay is being interviewed. Also the consensus statements of the brilliant British Menopause Society who are very measured and factual in their reports.

As I said, it would take me days to link to all of this and I do have a life other than posting here, however hard that is to believe!

I have written on meno and women's health for print and online media for a long time. That takes research and meno experts who I've interviewed, to give me info and quotes.

I've also discussed it with my gynae who is a meno expert.

For example, if you want to read about HRT and heart disease, pop that term into google and look for real papers- there is one done in Denmark on osteoporosis and heart disease. It showed a 50% reduction in plaque of the carotid artery in women on HRT.

Choose papers that are a recent as possible and where the trials include the types of HRT most women use now, not the old forms of estrogen and progestogen.

Don't look at large trials like the WHI and the Million Women studies as these are now considered flawed YET their stats are still included in meta analyses which gives a skewed outcome.

@Esspee I really don’t understand why you feel it necessary to make personal attacks.

Please state specifically and exactly which of my words on this thread were a personal attack on you. Don't hold back. Quote me exactly.

I repeat below my questions which you did not answer. If you feel that one of these questions is a "personal attack" then please reply by putting each such question in bold.

The real miracle in Esspee's story is not that HRT stopped her from aging for last 30 years, but that her friends are managing to get medical appointments in last 2 years.

"Do you interrogate everyone you know about their HRT habit -- how do you know who is or isn't on it?

How did you accompany so many people to their medical appts in the last 2 Covid years?

If you look 25 yrs younger than them, why haven't you converted all your friends already?"

@lljkk
Oh dearie me. You make up the story then expect me to justify your fiction. No way.

JinglingHellsBells thanks for the advice. I will look into those sources.

I do tend to go by NHS advice on the whole. It won't be perfect but I trust it to be based on evidence, at least, and know it's not profit-motivated. Not to dismiss Nick Panay out of hand, but it appears he will be making money from HRT.

So you don't look 25 years younger than your friend(s) who actually the same age? Do you look 35 years younger?

You don't actually know who of your friends is on HRT -- is that the wrong guess I made?

Other women you know don't want to look younger than they do -- was I wrong to suppose that, too?

I mean, which "story" I was supposing -- is incorrect?

@ArabellaScott

JinglingHellsBells thanks for the advice. I will look into those sources.

I do tend to go by NHS advice on the whole. It won't be perfect but I trust it to be based on evidence, at least, and know it's not profit-motivated. Not to dismiss Nick Panay out of hand, but it appears he will be making money from HRT.

It does muddy the water if profit is involved for me too

I have a general check up next week incidentally so will ask. Not sure if it needs to be specialist but not keen on anything expensive as I feel pretty good

It’s more the long term stuff I need to know about

@ArabellaScott

JinglingHellsBells thanks for the advice. I will look into those sources.

I do tend to go by NHS advice on the whole. It won't be perfect but I trust it to be based on evidence, at least, and know it's not profit-motivated. Not to dismiss Nick Panay out of hand, but it appears he will be making money from HRT.

Can you explain your comment about Panay, please @ArabellaScott It's one of the oddest things to read.

He leads up the NHS Chelsea and Westminster Hospital's menopause clinic (for women with difficult menopause issues and premature ovarian failure.) His work there is almost full-time, although he does fit in some research into menopause and fertility conditions.

He makes no money 'from HRT'.
What a weird comment to make.

Like many consultants, he has a private practice as well. His patients are treated for many kinds of gynaecology issues, - he's a gynaecologist- including menopause, amongst all the others. They may choose to use HRT, or if they don't want it he will offer other alternatives.

He is not 'making money' out of HRT.

It does muddy the water if profit is involved for me too

So this must rule out all the supplements like Menopace, and Vogel, etc etc, that women are persuaded to buy, as those companies are making a profit. That's their sole aim .

@JinglingHellsBells

It does muddy the water if profit is involved for me too

So this must rule out all the supplements like Menopace, and Vogel, etc etc, that women are persuaded to buy, as those companies are making a profit. That's their sole aim .

I don’t buy those tbh but yes I can distinguish everyday marketing, as for any product.

I don’t mind if it’s a clear distinction such as marketing

I’m not against HRT I feel very knee to it all. These threads always feel a bit confusing to me and I do want some clarity

I appreciate factual posts though and think I replied to yours saying this earlier. I’ll keep asking questions, it’s against what I’d usually do (I rely on diet and exercise first) but I’m interested in hearing more.

..New

He makes no money 'from HRT'.
What a weird comment to make.

I googled his name and came up with his website where he advertises services for menopausal women, most of which involve HRT. So yes, of course he is profiting from prescribing HRT.

As I said, it doesn't mean I dismiss his work out of hand, but it is something I bear in mind when evaluating information.

I'm 50. A few years ago I had flooding periods (from fibroids), panic attacks and brain fog, so my lovely GP gave me a Mirena and oestrogen gel.

At first my periods were fine, but have gradually got worse. The most recent one lasted 7 weeks. 😱

I'm on the waiting list for a hysterectomy now. But I also stopped using the oestrogen gel to see how I felt off it. It's been 5 weeks now and I feel exactly the same off the oestrogen as I did ON the oestrogen! But my period has finally stopped. I don't know if that's a coincidence.

I also take Menopace and have for a few years. I swear by it. It regulates my moods; I am a total bitch whenever I run out. 😆

I'm not going to use the oestrogel again until/unless I start getting unbearable menopause symptoms. It didn't cure my brain fog or anxiety. It just might have made my fibroids worse? I don't know.

My skin definitely looks worse after stopping HRT though. Again, not sure if that's a coincidence as it's winter now... But definitely drier (dryer?) skin.

Me. My perimenopause was speeded up considerably after breast cancer treatment. Nearly fully menopausal now. But I am at an age that it would not be considered premature. I'm ok so have needed no additional help so far. Added to fact hormone treatment might well not be straight forward with my history. I won't pursue it unless I need to. More hassle than it's worth for me.

@ArabellaScott I don't think she's had a smear since her mid 50s. But there are the other symptoms too.

@AlbertBridge Oddly my skin has been drier since starting HRT.

That's a shame, Susanna. Has she tried a sexual health clinic instead of her GP surgery, at all? I've found the difference in ability/comfort like night and day before.

A question about vaginal atrophy (asking for a friend...) Is it reversible if you start HRT or can you sort it topically?

Oh another question, what are the symptoms of fibroids?

Many women are unaware they have fibroids because they do not have any symptoms.

Women who do have symptoms (around 1 in 3) may experience:

heavy periods or painful periods
tummy (abdominal) pain
lower back pain
a frequent need to urinate
constipation
pain or discomfort during sex

www.nhs.uk/conditions/fibroids/

I’m 50 so never say never … but at the moment I don’t plan to use HRT because

• both my mother and sister had oestrogen driven breast cancer
• I have / had fibroids which were a real pain with heavy bleeding. That seems to be getting much better recently

I guess it’s weighing everything up and trying different ways to deal with the symptoms and have a good quality of life. I’ve had some night sweats and trouble sleeping but that’s it so far , and there is a definite correlation for me between diet / alcohol and symptoms.

So far I’m taking herbal supplements, running and doing lots of yoga, cutting out alcohol most of the time and having one coffee a day only. I think at some point sugar might have to go too! All so far so good 🙏🏼

@ArabellaScott

*He makes no money 'from HRT'. What a weird comment to make.*

I googled his name and came up with his website where he advertises services for menopausal women, most of which involve HRT. So yes, of course he is profiting from prescribing HRT.

As I said, it doesn't mean I dismiss his work out of hand, but it is something I bear in mind when evaluating information.

I make the same sort of assessments. But we do also need to know that the NHS advice is money focused too. They prescribe meds based on cost and availability. Only certain meds are avail in the UK based on contracts, cost and availability. For example we don’t always get the same HRT options as say Germany. The US doctors prescribe more testosterone than here. I wouldn’t dismiss Nick Panay so readily - he won’t want to be sued by private patients for a start!