Anyone choosing NOT to use HRT?

[WandaWomblesaurus73]

Does anyone feel that HRT isn't for them or feel happier without it?

When are you meant to start taking it?

If all is normal but 47

I did consider taking HRT a few years back although the GP wasn't keen on prescribing it. I know I could go back and ask again, but tbh I think I can manage without it. My mum never took it, shes 89 now, and still pretty fit and healthy. Hopefully I will follow in her footsteps.

I'm not allowed HRT due to having had a heart attack (or 2). So I have to live with the symptoms. Hot flushes, night sweats, achy joints and brain fog. Sometimes it's tough, but not all the time. So although I haven't chosen not to take it, things are bumbling along OK ish.

I’d happily have my periods back if it meant my vaginal atrophy would go

For those who have sailed through it with a fully functioning vagina that’s great but latest research estimates around 70% of women will eventually have VÁ because of menopause

It’s not “dryness” it’s the thinning of tissues in the vulva Abd vagina which can lead to tearing, bleeding, prolapses, UTI, the shortening and tightening of the vaginal canal, the disappearance of the vaginal lips & the shrinkage of the clitoris. It makes PIV extremely painful & in many cases impossible

I am on topical oestrogen ustrogen & testosterone to manage it as well as internal moisturisers & even so it’s been 18 months since I’ve had PIV with my DH

Periods were a picnic in comparison

@ginislife

My MP started at 52 (I'm 61 now) and I didn't take HRT. I never felt I needed it really as whilst I did have day & night sweats they were manageable. I have always been minded what an older friend of mine said about when you stop taking it you'll still go through all the symptoms, you'll just be older and so I didn't think there was much point as I'd be less fit when I'm older to cope

Working on that hypothesis ginislife I should have put up with 30 something years of menopausal physical deterioration in the off chance that one day I might stop taking it and get symptoms?

Did your older friend show you any medical research showing where she got that idea?

My friend took HRT for early menopause, she took it for I think 5/6 years then came off and went back on it and I think is now off it again. But my aunt too HRT for at least 30 years. She did end up getting cancer of the vagina which caused her death, this type of cancer can be caused having prolonged higher oestrogen levels. But she as 83, so a good age. Possibly for her the benefit of HRT was worth it all. I imagine she would say it was. So I think women take it for varying lengths of time. Not sure why my aunt was on it for so long, possibly osteoporosis but I am not sure.

And as for it bring a natural process, menopause happened on average at 50-55 and the average age of death used to be around 56; we’re not designed to live another 30+ years with no oestrogen, and still take care of young children, elderly parents and work and be productive.

Was about to say something similar but yours was much better @siblingrevelryagain. This absolutely.

I'm 49 and not on HRT yet but I'm very much open minded about it.

Regarding the breast cancer risk, if you are over weight your risk of breast cancer is higher than taking HRT. If you also drink every week, your risk is higher than taking HRT.

@rambleonplease

My friend took HRT for early menopause, she took it for I think 5/6 years then came off and went back on it and I think is now off it again. But my aunt too HRT for at least 30 years. She did end up getting cancer of the vagina which caused her death, this type of cancer can be caused having prolonged higher oestrogen levels. But she as 83, so a good age. Possibly for her the benefit of HRT was worth it all. I imagine she would say it was. So I think women take it for varying lengths of time. Not sure why my aunt was on it for so long, possibly osteoporosis but I am not sure.

The main cause of vaginal cancer is HPV infection. There are other lesser causes such as having a mother who took DES while pregnant but taking HRT is not known to increase your chances of getting this extremely rare cancer. Misinformation about health matters needs to be corrected.

I’m sorry your aunt is no longer with you rambleonplease but I hope I get to 83 by which time I will go happily knowing I have lived a full life and controlled my health to the max.

@ginislife

My MP started at 52 (I'm 61 now) and I didn't take HRT. I never felt I needed it really as whilst I did have day & night sweats they were manageable. I have always been minded what an older friend of mine said about when you stop taking it you'll still go through all the symptoms, you'll just be older and so I didn't think there was much point as I'd be less fit when I'm older to cope

Me too, went through the menopause 5 years ago with little symptoms so never been on HRT. I've suffered rotten physical health since though so seriously thinking about asking for it!

@Esspee You sound awesome 👌

@Esspee do women on hrt get some kind of bleeding? Would hate that but have to balance it with getting sleep!

[quote Quarks69]@Esspee do women on hrt get some kind of bleeding? Would hate that but have to balance it with getting sleep![/quote]
There are many different combinations of HRT, some continue with a monthly bleed some don't.
Ask for a referral to a menopause clinic and discuss your needs with them. One type does not suit all.

These sort of threads always turn into an heated discussion. I guess it's best to focus on the facts.

There are two stages to menopause which any gynaecologist will tell you- short and long term effects of loss of estrogen.

1 Hot flushes, sweats, mood swings, brain fog, insomnia, depression, etc.

2 After 10+ years - pelvic floor issues, (bladder, vagina, prolapse), osteoporosis, heart disease, and possibly dementia (more research being done on that.)

There is a spectrum of symptoms, which vary hugely.

There are 25% of women who get none of 1. These women say they have 'sailed through the menopause'.

75% do get 1. They can last for 2 years or 20+ years, or forever. (I have been told by my dr that some women in their 90s still get them.)

A lot of women who have none of 1 will find they get the long term symptoms, but never connect it with loss of estrogen.

Osteoporosis affects 1:3 women, maybe even 1:2.
Deaths from its complications in old age - 100K a year - outstrip all female cancer deaths.
And it's not just the occasional fracture - it's entire spines crumbling, long term pain and disability, affecting breathing and digestion. I know of several women in RL with this now.

Likewise, heart disease and dementia are the biggest cause of death in women.

Of course, many women will never want to use HRT or feel a need. That's their choice.

But there are many very expert drs (not talking about 'celebs' who promote HRT) I'm talking about professors involved in research on a global level.

They think that more women ought to think about replacing estrogen, given its protective effects on long term health which, in their view, outweigh the small risks. And there are top UK gynaecologists who already give HRT to women who want it for long term benefits, even if they don't have any of the short term symptoms.

I don't think these threads should turn nasty. It's clear that feelings on HRT run high. If you have no symptoms, or only short term and bearable, fine. But that's you. Accept other women are different.
And also accept that even without some obvious symptoms you may be at risk from other illnesses.

Ok, that's enough from me. I'm butting out of this thread now :)

@rambleonplease

My friend took HRT for early menopause, she took it for I think 5/6 years then came off and went back on it and I think is now off it again. But my aunt too HRT for at least 30 years. She did end up getting cancer of the vagina which caused her death, this type of cancer can be caused having prolonged higher oestrogen levels. But she as 83, so a good age. Possibly for her the benefit of HRT was worth it all. I imagine she would say it was. So I think women take it for varying lengths of time. Not sure why my aunt was on it for so long, possibly osteoporosis but I am not sure.

We have to remember that the hrt products keep changing and updating so patches etc were not available to women who are now in their 60-90s.

The discussion around menopause always seems to be about ‘symptoms’ and it lasting a year or two. This really needs to change as the impact is actually for our whole lives.

I think the medical world really need to give this whole topic more research and focus. As ever women’s health seems to be in the dark ages. Why aren’t we being educated about this stuff in our early 40s?

'I don't think these threads should turn nasty. It's clear that feelings on HRT run high. If you have no symptoms, or only short term and bearable, fine. But that's you. Accept other women are different'

This thread 'turned nasty' because a pp wanged on rather insensitively about how young she looked next to her poor friends (mistaken for their daughter.. at 73 ) who weren't on hrt, how she felt sooo sorry for how very decrepit they were with their many ailments and errant husbands chasing 'younger models'.

I'm with you, everyone can 'do you' but let's not make other women feel crap shall we and talk about this things appropriately.

'The discussion around menopause always seems to be about ‘symptoms’ and it lasting a year or two. This really needs to change as the impact is actually for our whole lives.'

Totally agree. Some women do think if they've had their last period withiut any problems they've sailed through it. The focus should be on how they will feel in 5 yrs time when oestrogen levels are totally depleted.

I don't want it either. I feel like there's a real push for people to be on it as the only solution. When most women as you point out only discover at this late stage how unprepared their bodies and nutritional and lifestyle are to cope with menopause.

Seriously - don't let one poster put you off.
Obviously if you don't want HRT don't have it!!
However just be aware that it's about far far more than short term symptom alleviation and oestrogen loss does for many people carry significant long term health problems.
Good nutrition is fantastic and vitally important - but it will not make any difference to Osteoporosis caused by oestrogen deficiency.
That's the key differentiator - it's long term health not only symptom alleviation.

Do what you do but do it with knowledge

@JinglingHellsBells do you have a cut and paste word doc at the ready lol?

People are throwing around terms like ‘heart disease’. ‘dementia’ - without any context.
As far as I know there is no proof that HRT prevents dementia. There was a recent study that investigated dementia risk because some researchers thought HRT increased dementia risk. I think the later study was ‘ inconclusive’.
How big was the study ? Who over saw the study? Who funded the study ? All things you should be asking yourself
Research isn’t fixed or black and white.
Some one mentioned breast cancer risk is greater if you are overweight . This is true so does that mean if you are overweight , don’t compound the risk with HRT or do you think overweight is a greater risk so I can use HRT with impunity?

It’s your own choice based on the information we have at present ( it will change again when another large population study is done).

@Esspee and @JinglingHellsBells Thankyou for your posts x

Anyone citing data would be really useful if you could put links to this so we can check that out. Ta.

@ArabellaScott

Anyone citing data would be really useful if you could put links to this so we can check that out. Ta.

I've spent 15 years researching data (as well as talking to the UK's menopause experts.)

You can find it all out yourself, like I did, by using google or going to sites like the BMS.

Everything is available online. You just need to look.

That way, you aren't just going by posts here.

@JinglingHellsBells

These sort of threads always turn into an heated discussion. I guess it's best to focus on the facts.

There are two stages to menopause which any gynaecologist will tell you- short and long term effects of loss of estrogen.

1 Hot flushes, sweats, mood swings, brain fog, insomnia, depression, etc.

2 After 10+ years - pelvic floor issues, (bladder, vagina, prolapse), osteoporosis, heart disease, and possibly dementia (more research being done on that.)

There is a spectrum of symptoms, which vary hugely.

There are 25% of women who get none of 1. These women say they have 'sailed through the menopause'.

75% do get 1. They can last for 2 years or 20+ years, or forever. (I have been told by my dr that some women in their 90s still get them.)

A lot of women who have none of 1 will find they get the long term symptoms, but never connect it with loss of estrogen.

Osteoporosis affects 1:3 women, maybe even 1:2.
Deaths from its complications in old age - 100K a year - outstrip all female cancer deaths.
And it's not just the occasional fracture - it's entire spines crumbling, long term pain and disability, affecting breathing and digestion. I know of several women in RL with this now.

Likewise, heart disease and dementia are the biggest cause of death in women.

Of course, many women will never want to use HRT or feel a need. That's their choice.

But there are many very expert drs (not talking about 'celebs' who promote HRT) I'm talking about professors involved in research on a global level.

They think that more women ought to think about replacing estrogen, given its protective effects on long term health which, in their view, outweigh the small risks. And there are top UK gynaecologists who already give HRT to women who want it for long term benefits, even if they don't have any of the short term symptoms.

I don't think these threads should turn nasty. It's clear that feelings on HRT run high. If you have no symptoms, or only short term and bearable, fine. But that's you. Accept other women are different.
And also accept that even without some obvious symptoms you may be at risk from other illnesses.

Ok, that's enough from me. I'm butting out of this thread now :)

This is useful

Btw I don’t think feelings need to ‘run high’ but I did find pp odd too.

Facts like this are better

Dr Louise Newson on This Morning at 10.20, may be worth a watch.

I do wish they'd feature health care professionals who didn't have private clinics though, it seems obviously biased when they have money to make from it imo.