Increase oestrogen gel during prog phase

[Juicebox1]

Hi all,

I'm at my wits end and really need a bit of advice please.

I'm 48 and peri, currently on oestrogel and provera. My first cycle was ok but I'm now on my 2nd and the provera has brought on severe anxiety/depression/anger. This happened on Elleste Duet and Femoston too. I am in my room, don't want to speak or see anyone and can't even take the dog out as I can't face stepping outside

I really didn't want to phone my GP at this time or try something new so I wondered if increasing the oestrogel during the prog phase would help?

Thank you.

How much gel are you using already?

Yes, you can increase it- the max amount suggested is 4 pumps a day.

I have similar reaction to progestogen. Really bad.
Im on elleste duet and ive found im ok if i have half a progestogen tablet or maybe two thirds, but thats pushing it.
Obviously you cant go with no progestogen but i have had to balance the risks with my own mental health and still take as much progestogen as i can tolerate.
I dont think more oestrogen is necessarily the answer as youd need to balance it with more progestogen, because that is to negate the risk of oestrogen related cancers.
If you can find any more info on this or that your method is ok, please report back though as I am keen to find a better solution too and it is so hard to find info online. For example I can find info that there is a risk, but not how high the risk is etc.

I had PMDD before, and the progestogen makes me feel that way again, and i'll do anything to avert it, as not fair on me or anyone I live with.

Branleause.. the amount of gel advised- up to 4 pumps a day- is on the leaflet. There is no need to use more progesterone with that amount. If there was, it would say so on the patient info.

You, however, ought not to be using half the amount of progesterone.
In effect, that's doing exactly what you have warned the poster not to do- you're upsetting the balance of estrogen/ progesterone.

There is a minimum amount of progesterone needed.
Where there is an intolerance, you may, under medical supervision, be able to change to a longer cycle where estrogen only is used to more than 2 weeks, (maybe 3 weeks or even 4) but you need specialist advice and not simply having tablets.

Have you spoken to a menopause specialist on this and been given other options?

*having= halving

Hi all, thanks for the replies.

I'm currently on 2 pumps a day. I tried to increase yesterday and added an extra half a pump in the morning but within a hour had major palpitations which just added to the anxious feeling, so I'm assuming it's too much? Although I'm not even sure of the symptoms of too much or too little oestrogen.

I think I'm going to have to ring my GP again at some point as I really can't deal with this, I spent most of yesterday crying

Jingling no I haven't spoken to a specialist, just my GP and bless her she isn't very knowledgeable. I think she'll probably just change my prog, which will most likely be Utro(?) as I haven't tried this one yet. The reviews don't seem great so I'm a bit scared of it.

It's unlikely your GP will know as you have said.

It's possible that the half a pump more and the effects were 'reverse placebo' if you are anxious, then you tend to get negative effects.
I doubt very much half a pump would make that much difference. (I've used gel for 12 years.)

I'd not get hung up on the reviews for Utrogestan. I've used it for 7 years but don't come to the forum saying how great it is- you will only hear bad reviews!

My consultant says women love it or hate it so it's trial and error.

I'd carry on increasing the gel for a while and seeing if that helps.

Thanks Jingling I'll give it a go

@jinglinghellsbells ive asked for referall to specialist but nothing in my area for 6-12mths and GP seems to know very little about it, so ive taken to just doing what I can while balancing my mental health.

Last time i did the full dose of progestogen I dumped my partner. Disowned my nephew and got banned from mumsnet all in one day. I cant cope with it. Im even worse off the HRT. PMDD is massively prevalent in autistic women unfortunately

Been trying desperatly to find out what would work better. Private menopause doctor is very expensive but i am tempted to save up

I'm intrigued by posters on MN referring to the "progesterone phase" - I've just started HRT and I'm on 1 pump of Estrogel and 1 Utrogestan dose daily. That's it, no phases?

Is it because I a) have a mirena coil, admittedly one coming to the end of its 5 year life, and b) I'm on such a low dose of oestrogen?

Sorry to hijack, just thought I'd ask. Fwiw I think it's helping, my rage and irritability has certainly lessened. Still have occasional flushes and brain fog though.

Hope you feel better soon OP, that sounds really shit. I would call the GP, they can do a phone consultation.

@Branleuse I really feel for you, but halving the progestin tablet is not the answer. It could mean you are not using enough to keep the lining thin. Please try not to do that?
A specialist would probably suggest another type but most GPs if you can get an appt now by phone could offer you Utrogestan.
The other option for women very sensitive to progestins is as I said, a longer cycle. You need a dr's advice to do that.

@Mortyfide Look up continuous and sequential regimes.

You are on continuous presumably as your periods stopped over a year ago? If not, then you need to sequential regime until they have or you might get break through bleeding and spotting a lot of the time.

Thanks Jingling - I remember you from my original thread! I haven't had periods for 10 years, but I've had a mirena coil all that time anyway. In my mind, not having them because menopause is different to not having them because mirena?

I'm 47, so if I didn't have the mirena maybe I'd still be having periods, who knows - but I've had pre-menopausal symptoms for nearly 2 years, hence the HRT trial.