How do you deal with parental alienation?

[Mongolia]

That's the question. I'm trying to find strategies to protect my lovely, very mature but also very young DS, as his father is feeding him every single detail of our divorce process.

I don't have anything to hide, he is another story... he has been abysmally dishonest, but that is not the point. The point is that every time DS comes from his house he has been told I am not allowing his father to contact him.

The bastard is enjoying to play the victim with anyone who wants to hear him. Despite big expense and time put into place for him to keep in touch with DS in a daily basis (while also protecting me from his very chaotic behaviour). Instead he has decided to reduce contact and blame it on me.

I really don't know how to cope with this. I have been trying to tell him things like "I don't know why your father is saying that", "perhaps there is a misunderstanding" but to be honest it is not working, DS is beyond that.

Any ideas, prefferably not involving more solicitors as I'm already skint and not able to pay for them, and in any case, exh doesn't give a hoot about solicitors letters.

It is, unfortunately.

Something that you can do is to check what kind of mediators you are going to use. There are aparently, mediators who are interested in "fixing" the emotional side of the problem so things could start to work again. And there are those that are only interested into getting you to agree to something as if they needed to put a checkmark after everything.

I thought mine was one of the former, I suggested mediation to "untangle" all that misunderstandings that were causing the problems and from them to develop a "structure" that worked better for DS.

The interesting thing is that I wanted to tell him that there was no animosity on my part, that I was happy for the things to continue as when they were working (including the babysitting), that I was happy to be more flexible about his needs (not that I wasn't before but even more), that it was all a terrible misunderstanding and that I was very happy at him having a new family around in the same way that I'm happy now with someone else.

Instead, exH decided to focus on what HE wanted, and everytime I wanted to speak he shut me off saying that I was distracting him from the point of the conversation and that I was wasting everybody's time. It was his way or no way, he acted as a total bully, the mediator didn't help much (I think of her as someone who was there just to prevent people from hitting each other) and unsurprisingly, we both came out far worse than how we entered.

Something that also baffled me is that during mediation exh said he was going against medical advice regarding DS health. The mediator only put it to the side, treated me as an over reacting precious mum, even when such lack of care could result in a fatality and I told her that health problem and care were heavily documented.

Mongolia.

None of that surprises me tbh.

Mediators are often ill equipped to deal with men like your XH who comes across as being a controlling bully. And often the woman is portrayed as being over sensitive, hysterical etc (this happened to me too).

Makes me very sad because a lot of it seems to be more about fathers 'rights' than what is best for the children which of course it what any decent parent wants. Anyhow that is me pontificating and doesn't help you, sorry.

Have you thought about what or considered what would happen if you stopped contact? Do you want to do this?

I think children that are in these kind of situations (one or both parents being unfair, saying stuff etc) do get very adept at saying what they think the parent wants to hear even when that means bending the truth.

I would ask your ds what he wishes he could do/would happen let him fantise and you empathise with him. I just mean as a tool for him to work out what is making him unhappy. You can then support him by saying that you wish you could make that x happen for him.

Not sure if that makes sense but I hope so.

"Makes me very sad because a lot of it seems to be more about fathers 'rights' than what is best for the children"

Exactly, wondering if I were being unfair, I contacted "Families need fathers", I explained the guy the situation, what ex wanted, what he was doing and asked if his demands were reasonable. The guy in the line said "Look, we deal here with problems of fathers that would do WHATEVER to have some contact with their children. Your ex has something most people here can not even imagine, and he is doing __ ? I would say, the guy is out of his mind and you have been incredibly patient!)

Now, the mediator was desperately fighting to get him "access" an access that didn't need to be fighted for because he has always had it on tap.

First time I stopped contact, I ended up having to call the police. So... no, I really don't want to stop contact, eventually it will have to be resumed and it would be far worse for DS.

Good idea Sleighgirl, I think I'm going to put it in practise next time he starts complaining about his father.

I don't know if this would be useful, but I've just published a children's book to help parents discuss parental alienation with their young children.

www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07TTV4BFX?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

It's been inspired by my own situation. I searched and searched for something that might assist my children in understanding why their dad was saying bad things about me, but I found nothing.

I hope this will be helpful to people going through the same pain as my children and I.

EmmaStar1 . Just wondered if you've printed an alternative version of this book called "Why does my mum say that?"

I'm working on it. The illustrations cost quite a bit...also I was hoping to get some feedback on whether it's useful. There are so many different ways of approaching the subject...

EmmaStar1,

why is the book called "why does my daddy say that"? It's almost always mothers who like to alienate children from their fathers. 98% of the time.

I have 2 DSC - the mother is an expert manipulator and alienator.

Some examples....

Has stopped contact as a way of control (which she no longer has as my OH took her to court for contact).

Wouldn’t let the children speak to dad unless she held the phone and it was on loud speaker.

Guantanamo bay interrogated the children after they have seen dad. My OH usually gets a stroppy email 10 mins after the kids are dropped back about something she’s not happy with.

Stopped a holiday the night before unless the dad gave her a £3k lump sum. Then told the children they weren’t going as daddy didn’t love them.

Tells the 14 year old that mummy loves you more than daddy.

Told the kids not to phone or text their dad as it upsets her.

My OH has court ordered direct contact 3 x a week. When the kids are with dad she’ll ring in average 4 x a day. Text every hour and throw a fit if the kids don’t jump.

Won’t let the kids bring anything to their dads. Conversely - the kids won’t take any birthday or Christmas presents back to mums as they apparently ‘aren’t allowed’.

Told the kids i’m the OW. I’m not - I met my OH 2 years AFTER his divorce and he left her as he wasn’t happy in the marriage (not for an OW).

Just a few examples....

The woman is completely bat shit and can’t see the damage she’s doing to her own kids. It’s been 7 years since they divorced and it gets no better. These people are so damaged they can’t see the harm they are doing.

How do we deal with it? Ignore ignore ignore. Never bad mouth her and never react. You can not control these people or your actions, you can only control how you react. Do not react you will only fuel their fire.

The kids will make their own minds up in time.

Mum56347 That isn't my experience at all. All my divorced friends are experiencing father instigated parental alienation. In all cases, the ex husbands were emotionally abusive during the marriage and are using the children to continue to control the wives after divorce. Narcissism has a greater prevalence in the male population and it's the lack of empathy that often drives this behaviour.

NorthernSpirit I have the exact same situation in reverse and I'm so sorry for your situation. It's heart breaking to think of the psychological damage that both fathers and mothers can do to their children. I agree that not reacting to the negativity is the best thing to do but I do believe that children need emotional support when they are dealing with such an onslaught. I really recommend a book called 'Divorce Poison'. It has great techniques for helping children understand and deal with what's happening and I believe that taking an active approach reduces the chances of children being permanently brainwashed.

I'm working on the reverse version of the book.

My own do is being excused of having dislike for his ex due to speaking up for once and responding to her list of concerns.
They have been over for 3+ years, in her concerns she mention how he cheated is a compulsive liar and has never been around. Dp proved there where no gaps in contact
Showed texts where the ex used the dd as a tool to get dp parents to talk him in to giving up pr.

To only now find out that the guy she has dd calling daddy, (which is somehow my dp's fault)

Was cautioned for assault on his family 4 months in to dating, she still allowed this guy to move in and holiday, he's not allowed to see his 3 dc, and no one will explain why.

Dd turned up the other day convinced she was getting a switch, ex had told her dp with get it for her. Dp said for bday or Christmas.
Ex said See dd only she you for the gifts you give.
Dd 5.

This abuse is unreal and is just adding to the MH issue of adults.

More that not it's the mothers who bad mouth.

Out of the 3 men I've dealt with in this, my exh, dp and my own df they usual enjoy the time with the dc, they actually don't care about the mother and her crazy. Yes they get pissed off, but they usual don't use the other parent as an excuse when every thing and anything goes wrong.

Poster on MN the other day got sunburnt, and stated her ex was on holiday so she was left to deal with the issue herself.

Limestars, I'm sorry for your experience.

I just think it's not worth us debating who is most likely to do this kind of thing. It happens both ways and both mums and dads have to deal with the fallout. :(

@EmmaStar1 no the child does. The adult who grows from the child does.
And a one sided book shouldn't be added to a thread where equal PA can happen

@EmmaStar1 "I just think it's not worth us debating who is most likely to do this kind of thing. It happens both ways and both mums and dads have to deal with the fallout"

And the Children.

This is why your book, without having to open it, is misleading and biased and a classic example of the stereotype pedalling , double standards, and hypocrisy, that is rife on these forums.

I'm glad that you followed up that you are working on an alternative version. Perhaps you should have done an objective / gender neutral one from the start.

" I just think it's not worth us debating who is most likely to do this kind of thing. It happens both ways and both mums and dads have to deal with the fallout. "

The reason we are debating this because you named your book "why does my daddy say that?". Then you say "it happens both ways"?