Are my expectations of my kids too high?

[greenberet]

Struggling to get perspective on current situation which triggers off low mood and depression.

Extremely acrimonious divorce well documented on MN and ongoing issues as a result.

Currently recovering from discectomy which has not gone smoothly. Op 4 weeks ago but wound not healing well just been on ABs to ward off infection and attending gp every few days for new dressing. Wound currently looks like a very snotty cold with lots of ‘slough’. Nurse has said it is going to be a long slow healing process. Nurse asked yesterday whether I was diabetic as noticed I have lots of old ‘sores’ on my back - these are from skin issue where I was under dermatology. Basically body has been through hell last 4 years starting with breast cancer diagnosis and treatment and ongoing severe stress of divorce due to financial abuse and repercussions!

My current state Is I can’t be bothered to get out of bed due to mood - but due to back I shouldn’t be doing anything anyway - no bending no twisting no lifting - so physically & mentally I feel resigned to bed!

My kids are used to seeing me in bed due to depression but prior to back op I was able to get up to go to the toilet make cup of tea or food if I felt like it.

I am still in pain from op and on prescribed Cocodamol. Kids were aware of impending back op months ago as I was told I needed urgent surgery within 4 weeks and due to pain have been unable to function pretty much for the last 4/5 months.

My issue is are my kids doing enough to help me or am I expecting too much.

Both are 17 coming up to a levels next summer - Ds at school - leaves house 7.30 returns 6 ish has part time job at weekends sat 12- 8 sun 10 -5 goes to x tues eve AnD eow

Dd at college hrs more flexible but also works part time mon tues eve 5 - 8 and sun 10- 5. Goes to x tues eve and eow. Stays at bf most weds night some fri or sat night.

Their ‘ jobs’ since 14 ish have been dishwasher, one clean upstairs bathroom other do downstairs loo keep rooms tidy etc help with washing put rubbish out - they have had £25 per month which has just been pocket money - I still buy everything else. X pays for top of range iPhones although has fought me for cm through CMS and was recently taking me to court but cancelled at last minute.

Neither of them do jobs religiously - I have to “nag” ( their words)to get anything done - have threatened take money away - no difference -

So currently I am not supposed to be doing anything - I think my wound has not healed as I have been doing too much and this has only been picking up dog poo as neither will ( neither walk the dog) putting on occasional washing and trying to keep kitchen clean and tidy. Both will cook but leave dishes - Dd will put a wash on but leave it in machine. Ds is an untidy bugger and leaves his clothes on floor in room in bathroom but will then splurge.

They are good kids - they have been through too much - Ds has had suicidal thoughts picked up by school - Dd has been severely let down by DF. They both continue to see DF - he has very rare communication with me even when emergency on my part - he doesn’t see it as emergency.

I am now in situation where i am going to have to leave former family home as can no longer afford to keep it on and I’m Looking to buy somewhere 200 miles away. This means kids will have to live with DF. They are all aware of this but none will communicate with me over it. Do t even think the6 have talked about it themselves. Think they think I am full of empty threats as I always have found a solution to some shitty situations we have been through .This is not my ideal their DF is emotionally and financially abusive but if I am to have any sort of life I need to do this. I cannot rely on being able to work as judge decided in her settlement and so I have to move somewhere cheaper - I currently live near Oxford. I’m worrying about this every bloody day - deep down I dont think this is best for kids not close to a levels not to be with DF full time even if he will accommodate this and I’m not sure he will - kids could be left high and dry!

My issue is they go to him for contact - even now when I need help they have gone - Dd to do her school work on his big computer - Ds just overnight - I now their relationship is a bit strained but not hostile. Should I bother about this?

I’m trying to keep everything ok for my kids and it has more or less killed me emotionally and now I’m pretty much physically unable to do much. My kids don’t seem to get it. Reading on MN a lot of mothers who thought they were doing the right thing by their kids have ended up being “judged” by their kids when adults as completely the opposite!

Am I expecting too much of them? I’m asking them to pick up the slack that has been caused by their DFs actions! They should wholly be concentrating on their school life, their friends their future. My divorce settlement didn’t give me the financial protection I expected - I am trying to pursue so,icitors for negligence and have been told I have a good case! But this too is going to cost me!

I have family but they are dealing with their own issues. Some thoughts needed please

I’m asking them to pick up the slack that has been caused by their DFs actions!

Exactly. Their DF’s actions, not theirs. It’s not their fault their DH is a prick and they shouldn’t have to pick up his slack.
It’s completely fair to expect them to help you out when you’re incapacitated. However they do a lot already (school/college/part time jobs) and it is not fair to expect them to drop any of this or drop contact with their DF.

They are doing a lot at no fault of yours or of theirs. Have you explored getting them 'young carers' help? There's a lot out there, I believe. It could help both you and them.

Also you need some proper financial and housing advice. Shelter may be able to advise if you are worried about not being able to afford to keep your home. The children's college might have something like a family liaison officer who could advise given that this situation must be affecting their education.

Also what are you going to do when they go to uni? You need to start sorting out carers if you think your health could be affected long term.

I can see both sides here. They are very busy kids, what with studying, both have part time jobs, and both still seeing df. Their relationship with him must be ok if they're spending that much time there. On the other hand, you say he might not want them full time so they'd have to come with you anyway.

I think I'd be stopping the pocket money, especially as they're both working anyway. They don't need it and they're both almost grown up. Maybe that money could be used towards getting a cleaner in for an hour once a week? Not a lot but at least you'd be getting something for your money.

Tell them if they won't help with the dog he'll have to be rehomed as you're not fit enough to look after him. Dogs need walking and obviously you can't do it.

Apart from that, just grit your teeth and don't do any more than necessary.

Gently I’d like to point out that depression makes people suffering selfish, their world view is narrowed to their wants and needs.
You say your children are used to you being in bed all day because of your depression. That is horrible, it will have effected their feelings for you, they quite possible have less empathy for you because of this. Harsh I know but that’s how things work and probably not what you want to hear.
Look from their side
Mum is depressed and doesn’t engage in life, they learn to be emotionally self sufficient. Now you are bed ridden because of a physical issue it will be hard for them to separate that from your being bed ridden from depression.
They maybe 17 but they are still children who don’t seem (from your op) to have anyone supporting them emotionally. You are selling their home and making them live with a man they don’t have a good relationship with, there is probably resentment of you here too.
I don’t know what to suggest, you are in a shit situation and depression is terrible to deal with(I know).

Maybe a family meeting with them, lay out everything and actually talk rather that ignore the issues.

Thank you - I absolutely know it is not fair on them - I have tried my best for their lives not to be effected by their DFs behaviour. Their lives are full and this is what I want for them.

I didn’t make it clear re the family home - the x manipulated this being sold - took me to court to force sale - I managed to rent it - it was bought by developer at far below true value - I am here til August but can’t keep rent going and buy a home. X owes £5k in cm which would help.

They had no idea of my depression until x left I managed it - bit the divorce thebattles I have been through I found it too much to cope with was on the phone to WA many times.

I’m still supporting them emotionally there’s a thread on here where x refusing to take Dd to uni open day unless ow goes too

I needed to know if my perspective was skewed somehow I need to find a way to keep going Maybe a cleaner is a good idea

Ive just lost a whole reply to this.

I’m struggling to get my head round this concept that depression makes you selfish. If anything I think it is the reverse with me. I feel as though I give out too much. I cope but when I ask for help it falls on deaf ears - I THen start asking mor insistently and louder but at this point I’m accused of being a nag or unreasonable - I carry on as much as I’m able to before feeling abused overwhelmed taken advantage of and then I check out - for me this is going to bed.

This used to happen within my marriage - twins and an x running his own business who wanted to be no 1 in his industry - long hours and overnights away from home - when I asked him to give kids tea he thought I was punishing him! This didn’t happen often I managed my depression by being able to sleep during the day - this meant I was able to cope with the tea bed bath rotine that was sometimes pretty fractious!

I get what yiu are saying about kids being emotionally self sufficient but actually I think they are emotionally drained. They have shut down to anything that is outside of their “ teenage” spectrum! Thinking about this I can’t say I blame them they have had too much to deal with in a very short space of time

Their GM died - x mother - this was the catalyst for his affair I believe - all kicked off with this. Difficulties at Xmas and I kicked him out January. He then did a disappearance act that involved police looking for him he claimed to be suicidal - kids witnessed all this - they were 13 At time - Dd was keeping DF talking whilst police found him - wtf this must have been huge for them!

Just as x left I was diagnosed with breast cancer - Dd used to call me ‘boob’ prior to this! X didn’t want to know - all he cared about was insurance payout.

Kids often came home from school to find me in tears or angry as divorce progressed - I wS being manipulated by x and his solicitor, my Legals didn’t get what I was saying - I was fighting to keep the kids in their family home I was fighting to keep the kids at private school - all claimed as being inaffordable by x - all lies!

To make it worse I got stitched up by my solicitors and badly let down by justice system which I have been fighting to try and resolve.

My back issue has been going on for 6 months - 6 months of pain and not being able to do very much prior to op. There was a possibility of cauda equina syndrome which meant I could have been left incontinent/ paralysed - I had to fight to get this op!

Someone mentioned has their schoolwork been effected - yes and no - school are aware of the difficulties - Ds Googled how to kill yourself at school - I tried to get Ds to see camhs and school offered him someone to talk to - he refused - x thought it was a schoolboy prank! Ds was also taking drugs - x marched him into school for this!
Schoolwork surprisingly no - and I have realised this is where my issues are - I ask for help - they say they have school work to do - I used to ask x for help he always had business stuff to do - so I would soldier on or go to bed depending on mood. X then said business was goi g down the pan during divorce - completely false - and evidence he lied at final hearing but ignored by judge! I got shafted in final hearing!

I have been likening kids to x in my head - seeing their inability to help me as putting schoolwork first - but actually I paid for this in Ds case and I’m encouraging Dd with her uni choice!

Last night Dd came home from work she got into bed with me - she then wanted me to get up and make her food - she didn’t ask about my back - she knows I’m not good but I don’t understand this - to me someone’s health is the first thing you ask about especially when they are dealing with something serious!

My Dd thinks I am ok because I went to wales to look at a house - I sat in a car the whole way there - I walked round a house for 30 minutes - I then sat back in the car - I didn’t have to do anything else - this is completely different to trying to run a home and all that it entails.

I’ve tried talking - they know what the situation is - they know they may have to live with their DF - but I can get nothing out of them! I can get nothi g out of their DF either - all just ignore ignore ignore - and you know what this has made me realise how bloody strong I am - that despite what I have been through And am still going through I haven’t yet given up - I feel like it I can bloody tell you - it all feels too much many a time - I take time out but then I’m back on it. I can’t do much physically at the moment but emotionally fuck I think I may have conquered myself!

Yes I would have liked some more help, yes I would like my kids to clear up a bit more after themselves but when I realise what they have just been through in what 4 years and they are still going through I realise how bloody amazing they are!

And I need to tell them!

I’m panicking because I have a house inspection this week - the house is a mess - but if I canot be given some grace due to my back then this is not my issue - it’s the landlords! I’m not going to risk my back for a tidy house !

I have other issues I need to sort out and I need to ge5 myself prepared for a stitch to be taken out today - this is going to hurt like bugger! But my wound can’t heal whilst it’s still there!

Something else dawned on me this week - the house the x has bought with Ow - what happens to his share if he dies? He’s made out this big thing with the kids how they both share everything down the line - he confuses the kids by buying them the latest I phone - he must be an ok dad if he does this - the thing is he gets this through the company - costs him bugger all - also enables him to keep tabs on the kids! But this house thing if his is 50% - if kids are his priority as he says this should come to kids on his death right? This would mean either Ow has to come up with funds to cover this or she has to sell house and buy somewhere smaller for herself and her kids - i e just seen another flying pig!

Must ask x abou this - this could cover their uni debt they are going to have to stump up to cover living costs that otherwise would have been paid for by us. Kids still bloody suffering!,!!

You're still so focussed on him - what possible relevance does how he is going to split his inheritance have to do with your wound healing issue?
In the short term, yes your children are doing a lot and need young carer support. You need a proper carer. And through counselling or otherwise I hope you are able to move on from thiat, and recover physically and mentally.

No I’m still focused on the kids - I don’t know where you get inheritance from! It’s money he got from the divorce settlement - that he manipulated - money he should have used to pay DD’s school fees!

The kids are going to have to take on a loan for uni - he has already told them due to me not working they will get maximum grant - so hes assuming they will be applying from living with me - which is why I can’t count on him having kid to live with him fulltime - this will impact on his relationship with OW - Christ he can’t even give up one day to take Dd to uni!

There is enough money to pay for kids uni I can bet you on this - it’s just he will not want to use his hard earned money to support them - selfish beyond a fucking doubt - but he owns half a house - and my question is who gets this on his death - his kids or her kids?

I don’t really need to ask - unless he’s changed his spots - I already know the answer - but the kids still believe he wouldn’t do this to them - just like I did - they got suckered by a bloody phone!

Yes they should be having time for work towards their public exams. Lying in bed is not the right way to manage depression. If you can drive to Wales and get out to GPs then you can get up and do some caring of your children.

Breast cancer treatment was four years ago so it’s in the past and not a current issue. Most children take a loan for university.

I’m afraid you need to put proper support in place for yourself and your children and move yourself into the present. Hard though it is, you’re making it harder. Try small steps such as not being in bed all day.

Reading this we see two kids who are highly unlikely to achieve the a levels they deserve unless their parents (both of them) get themselves in order.

You say you're focused on them but haven't responded to the many pps saying they do plenty and/or are in a very hard place - instead you have gone back to talking about yourself and your ex.

Step away from this for a minute. If he had died or gone overseas (as quite. Few exes on MN) you would still have to cope, and without them with him sometimes or getting any help at all. What would you be doing then? Maybe imagining for a minute he no longer exists would help you concentrate on the needs of you and your dcs.

Depression is awful and you deserve lots of support. Caring for someone with depression is also awful and your teenage children also need more help.

It'll depend on his will. Without a will it will all go to his wife as next of kin. Even with a will they may say the other partner can live in the house for the rest of their life, then split and remaining money. But if his wife outlives him she can write a new will and leave it to whoever she likes.

Had he died or disappeared it would have been far easier - yes I would have been doing all the childcare which I pretty much am anyway - he provides a bed, food - sometimes and a phone. He’s £5k in debt for cm for 18 months and I would have had none of the mind games - this is what is most destructive.

Tell me what is the right way to manage depression - CherryPavlova? I have someone who takes me to the Gp and took me to wales - I can’t currently drive due to an open back wound!

I take it youve not had cancer - I haven’t yet had the all clear - and as my brother had secondary cancer after testicular cancer it’s something that is always on my mind!

I’m very much in the present - probably looking too much into the future - focusing on ‘my’ present has impact on kids - focusing on their present has impact on my future - the only one who seems not to have to give a shit is their DF!

My kids will get the a levels they deserve and stuck yes by taking the focus off them and back to myself I am listening to what has been said!

Ive realised they’ve been through too much and as much as I need help I have to find other ways because I want them to succeed in life and have the life that was meant for them even if I have to do this myself - and it will be down to me because x has not facilitated this in any way since he buggered off despite what he may believe.

He is never going to get himself in order so I have to!

He’s not married to Ow - but I get this - what I’m Saying is they are likely to end up £50k in debt each - money that was available for their uni education until he had a mid life crisis followed by an inability to meet his responsibility to his kids.

You’re still focusing on him. What he has done, what he will do, what he should do, what he doesn’t do.
Forget about him. Your initial question was about your children, and whether you’re expecting too much from them, but you’ve turned it into another rant about him. It doesn’t help. He’s not going to change.

Your dc sound amazing. Just think about that for a minute. At that age most kids have dm to wave them off or call them three times( mine) but yours are independent and have thheir part time jobs.
If l was you l would do everything l could not to move 200 miles away. These kids need you. At the moment you are not well so not a good time to make a decision.

I understand you are very hurt by your ex but focusing on him makes you a victim. You have raised two good kids. You won't be with an open wound forever. Row the thoughts back in and focus on today..
Stop panicking about university. All UK kids have loans by the sounds of it so she won't die.
Try today to just get through. Say thanks to your dc for putting up with it all. See if anyone else can help..maybe a family member.
If you focus on your ex you are drinking the poison hoping he will die. He has done enough damage. Today focus on resting while dc are out and then maybe give them a bit of attention when they get in.
They are marvellous to do as they do.

It’s easy to say stop focusing on him - it maybe a rant about him but we are in this position due to him - me and the kids - I can’t fulfill what I want - I haven’t got the financial means to make it work - so no matter where it starts this is where it ends up.

My kids are amazing I know this but I’m struggling - there is no family member to ask - I have a dB and a DF - my dB is going through his own shite - my DF he’s off somewhere else!

If I want to live in anything other than a 1 bed flat I have to move - I’ve looked closer - I’m trying to eek this out til the kids go to uni hopefully - come September next year but I can’t - I haven’t got enough. I have to give 2 months notice where I am this was going to be today funnily enough but the house I was looking at for the last 9 months fell through - so I’m already on plan b!

I’m blubbing now because I know the kids need me - I’ve always fucking known this - I’m 53 and still need my dm sometimes - she’s no longer here - I’m trying to makes things work that right now feels impossible - it felt impossible when I was well - right now I can’t do fuck all - apart from lie in bed and wait for my wound to heal!

I wanted to know whether I was being unreasonable to expect more from them - I realise I was - so this has eased this tension but it doesnt help the other issues - all it means is I stop stressing about the state of the house and that nothing is being done!

The other issues are still there still to be dealt with still need to magic something out of nothing!

I know you’re in that position due to him. But is he going to change? Is he miraculously going to become a decent human being and start providing for you all financially and emotionally? No he’s not. So this is all a waste of energy. Energy you don’t have. Energy that is better spent on yourself and your children.

Wow - that's a lot and I apologise for not reading all your follow-up posts, but to answer your first question - Are they doing enough to help and are you BU for expecting this? I think, tbh, that you should try and get more help for yourself from outside. Dog walker? Cleaner? They're both doing A levels next summer and already have PT jobs - to me that sounds like quite a lot on their plates already without having to run the home as well, because you can't/won't get out of bed.

Are you having treatment for your depression? I can understand you feeling low due to the operation and your horrible divorce, but picking up the slack from all the terrible issues in your life is really not their job. They are still DC, they still need you to be their mum and it's really not fair to expect them to put housework before their studies. Their whole lives will hinge on how they do in their A levels and I think you need to cut them some slack on that front and talk to your GP about additional help/support/medication to see you through this tough time you're having. Expecting them to keep their rooms clean and tidy, empty the dishwasher and throw on a wash is reasonable btw and they should be doing this.

As for a 200-mile move - if you were my friend I'd urge you to rethink this. Yes, your DC will be 18 next year and they will technically be adults, but by moving so far away you will quite literally be abandoning them. I know that sounds harsh, but you will. And yes, behind your back people will be saying that. Personally, I couldn't imagine moving so far from my teen DC. I realise they both may be heading off to uni next Oct, but they will still need a home and a base and your presence in their lives. Do you really need to move so far? I know how expensive Oxfordshire is, but can you really not afford a property any closer than 200 miles away? I think I'd have a really good think about that, if I were you, because your DC may well be feeling angry and resentful and that's why they're not talking to you about it.

It doesn't need to end up with him. It might be his fault, but that doesn't help. Otherwise it's like someone who got hit by a car (along with their DCs!) and instead of trying to sort out their injuries, sits by the side of a road clutching a bandage and refusing to leave because they might still see the car in the distance.

Don't give him the power to fill your head every day. yes, he was a shit husband. yes, there are a LOT of shit husbands about. Luckily, it seems like you have some great kids, and you need to refocus some of your energy now to stop thinking about uni debt and make sure they get to the uni courses they deserve, and the lives they deserve.

He doesn’t get to fill my head every day - I realise I’m having a blip - it’s a culmination in losing a property I’d been invested in for the last 9 months - the seller refused to sell it to me in the end because I wouldn’t take his word and complete without a survey. More lies more unnecessary shite.

It’s a culmination of expecting to be on the mend by now back wise and perhaps a delayed realisation how much I had to fight for this too.

Everything is a bloody fight and when I grind to a halt there is no one to pick up the pieces - nobody to depend on!

I fully get the kids may think I’m abandoning them - it wasn’t meant to be this way - my settlement indicated I would get £450k for housing and jnt lives spousal. I didn’t get either spousal for 2 years which runs out as kids reach 18 and about £300k for housing - out of this I’m paying Ds school fees, maintaining the former family home - and living whilst fighting to get the correct amount of cm out of the x.
x claims he cannot afford school fees but funnily enough has managed to maintain a rental property at £1600 per month as well as buy a house! All this on a business that was going down the pan! I’ve said before Ds was suicidal at this point - I couldn’t not risk keeping him at his private school.

Buying 200 miles away at £220 gives me somewhere the kids can come to in their breaks at uni and somewhere for the future. I cannot count on being employable and so I need some money back to live on once kids get to 18 - I will not be able to support them financially after this. If by this time I can get the emotional shite under control I hope to be able to do something to generate some income.

I’ve kept the kids informed all the way through this - they came to look at properties with me at the start when I was looking local - I know they don’t want to come with me I’m not expecting them too - I’m hoping somehow they can set themselves up with something they are happy with but I’m also thinking beyond this. I won’t be able to afford to move again this has to cover all future requirements - recently I wasn’t able to get upstairs - I’ve had to take this into account. I’m trying to keep all options open - although it’s 200 miles away it’s accessible by mainline trains - for them and for me!

I know the kids still hold a lot of anger and resentment and I fear for their long term mental health. I’ve tried not to hide anything from them - some call keeping stuff from them protection but I feel they need to know reality even if reality is not nice or requires adjustment.

Maybe I was protected ( by parents) too much and this is why sometimes I feel overwhelmed. x definitely destroyed my ability to trust and i cannot take anything at face value anymore - this is a horrible way to live.

I’m currently worn out mentally & physically and trying to garner what help I can - the next 6 months could be the hardest yet - kids will be under enough strain I’m trying to do what I can to minimise anything else - but I need to be strong first - physically I have always been pretty able so being as I am is not good for my MH.

This is a difficult time of year regardless dms anniversary coming up - starting to not like xmas As completely out of sync.

I know this stuff is all in my head - that’s my biggest issue!

although it’s 200 miles away it’s accessible by mainline trains - for them and for me!

But it's so far OP! My parents live 100 miles away and by road that takes 2 hours and 20 mins (there is no train to where they live). It's far enough that I only go up there with the kids about four times a year - that's all. If they were double the distance it would be even less. Can you at least put this move off until after they've done their A levels? Have you used the benefits calculator to see if you're entitled to any benefits that you aren't currently claiming and which might help you to stay in your home a bit longer, so you're not having to kick your DC out halfway through their A level courses? www.entitledto.co.uk/ Where are they likely to go to uni? Will you be any closer to either/both of them once you've moved and if they get their first choice(s)?

I’m already claiming benefits - how old are you kids Juneau ? I want to hold out until after a levels if I can

i remember back to when I was this age although I didn’t go to uni I was away from home as much as I could be - even though I was probably 1/2 hour away from my parents I don’t think I saw them that much - it was only when I had kids myself this changed.

DD is looking at London not sure about Ds

My kids are 11 and 7 greenberet

Have you looked at Bedfordshire for properties? I know it's a lot cheaper than many of the areas in the south, but maybe it's not cheap enough for you to afford what you need.

I think this huge move will be less relevant if your DC have already gone off to uni when you do it - but I'm worried about you moving and leaving them while they're doing their A levels - I just think it would be so unsettling for them - particularly as your ex is such a monumental arse.

yes you are and I think you know it