her dad ( who is crap) is taking her on holiday for a week with his partner, her kids and his parents, but she does not want to go and is hysterical

[pirategirl]

I am stuck in the middle. I am royally fucked oof that he can take her or leave her, but this break away, orchestrated and paid for by my ex inlaws is for 'their' benfit not our daughters.

They see her rarely as they love abraod. my stanc eis, i have tried to be fiar for two yrs, always pavimg the way for his visits, trying to make him see her more, but am constantly met with a ridiculous attitude, which is so self centered.

Last yr they did the same thing, but she had just turend 4, and off she was ferried, and obv missed me but somehow she seemed ok , and had a nice time.

This year, omg, well she is more grown up, has started school, and is very clingy to me. very disturbed by the fact she is to be away from me for a week.

Tonight it all came out, that when she was awy last year it 'was like you had died mummy', like 'my heart was empty mummy' and daddy doesnt listen and i miss you, please fonehim mummy and tell him i dont want to go.

All this, and she is five fucking yrs old. What the hell do i do. I face his wrath, i face him coming down on me like a ton, altho if he cared to really think, he would admit to himself i have done everything to make sure she has a healthy relationship with hi, you know, praising him up etc...

My daughter dislikes hi girlfriend, say s 'she hurts my feelings mummy'.

my inlaws just gloss over all he has done to thier grandaughter, and thik she is ok to go away for a week. They booked it without even consulting me, like my ex has a 'right' to do this.

I am scared to appraocu him, i am only gonna be the bad guy again, which i dont like but have to getused to. Its always my f ing fault, the way my daughtr feels about him and the fact he has left.

never his.

tonight she went and dug out a photo of us, and basically cried, and said ' i really loved daddy when i was three and he lived with us, i wish he would come home, becuase i hatehim now'

yes thats a good way to think about it. we have had the absolute bones of the matter 2night. i know exactley how she is feeling right now, but not in 2 weeks.

she will be in school the first week they r here, but they will obv be popping around.

i do tend to try and makeit all alrgiht fro everyone, i just cant bare to be the baddy, all the time.

I know it should notmatter, but i am still hurt by him, and it matters to me that this once love of my life, can reduce me to feeling like a weak, awkward person.

he's kicked me when down so many times. i do not want to be that target any more.

i am going to mention tonight to him, i will be factual.

I just sometimes want to scream at him and his girlfriend, that i am a good, honest person, who is doing her best.

Sometimes you have to be the baddy. I've been there (with my own parents, in fact). I never used to 'do' confrontation and it was an utterly traumatic time, but it was the right thing.
Tbh, I'd be inclined to have it out now rather than directly before the holiday.

poor your dd, don't have anything to say that hasn't been said allready but hope you work it out.

ok well a few more balanced comments - is it a languge thing if their first language is not english does she feel not understood (hard for an adult worse for a child), youe ex PIl do sound like they are making an effort perhaps in the only way they know - and finally in my experience of 5 year olds things do tend to go up and down day by day and they seem to "forget" things which really stick with us....what about playing it by ear see how she goes but give im warning that if she is really distressed closer the time you won't behappy for her to go ???

I think you should write to the ILs and say that your dd has expressed extreme distress about being away from you for that week. Say that, once she has got used to them when they are here for the first week, she may change her mind (and you would be very happy for her to spend a week away with her family), but, if she is still as distressed at the end of the first week, you do not consider that it will be in her best interests to force her to go.

That way they are forewarned of her feelings, have the oppportunity to bond with her beforehand which might make her feel better about going, but ultimately know that you won't allow her to go if she still feels the same.

I can't see why the ILs, exh and his partner and her family can't all go together even if dd stays home.

Sounds like it would do her good to be away and stop her being so clingy. I would just tell her she'll be fine and make her go. It's lovely her grandparents get the chance to see her and are taking her on this trip. Small children often say what they think their mothers want to hear anyway. I think both parents should have the chidlren 50% of the time and then these kinds of issues don't arise.

I wouldnt make her go

I would tell them its her desision

I've only read your OP but I'd say don't make her go. If your ex/his partner had been making a lot of effort with her and had a consistent and close relationship then maybe I'd see if I could persuade her to go with the caveat that you'd speak to her every day but poor thing, you shouldn't make her go imo. Tell them it's her decision, you're doing what's best for HER and he'll have to lump it. at like you'd died, poor thing.

Xenia, as the child of divorced parents, I would have HATED 50/50 custody (as it was called in those days). I wanted a home of my own, a place to live. Not to be shunted around to salve the conscience of the adults. People who talk about 50/50 care as a rule for everyone are thinking about the needs of the adults, not the child. It may work for some families tailored to their circumstances. But it is not right for everyone or even for most.

Agree with Honoria, write it down, very calmly. Also start documenting EVERY time he lets her down/breaks arrangements/does ANYTHING you think worthy of note. And the next time he threatens you with legal action go straight to a solicitor of your own, armed with this evidence and write a legal letter right back.

If the grandparents have your dd's best intersts at heart and if you write a good letter they ought to understand.

Sorry pirategirl, posted too soon! I don't think I would make your dd go, given my experience as the child in this situation. Write to dh and his parents, telling them exactly what dd has said without interpreting it or explaining it - just her words. Then suggest they stay nearby to build up a relationship with dd so that she feels secure enough to go on holiday with them in the future.

Since he's keen to reach for the solicitors, I'd definitely have all this in writing, and might be worth you striking first and consulting a lawyer yourself. So you are ready if he does try to frighten you.

Now I've read the thread, agree with Freckle also, a letter now is a good idea (and 50% parenting is crap imo)

Oh, and think about telling dd what you are doing re writing to dh/gps - I don't know your dd, obv, and how she'd react, but sounds like she might appreciate knowing you are trying to sort this out IYSWIM.

And I think it's fine and understandable for a small 5yo child to be clingy when it comes to this situation.

how does the 50% thing work exactly,
my oldest would hate to spend half the time at his dads, we live 100 miles apart at the moment, his dad works odd hours so could never be there for him before and after school,
he would miss his siblings and they would miss him

sounds great in an ideal world not so practical in reality

It must be absolutely heartbreaking, but I am well aware that DS, also 5, is capable of coming up with very emotionally literate and extreme (even dramatic) descritions of how he feels. I'm not suggesting tht your dd is doing anything manipulative or nagative in any way - i think small children often explore their emotions by taking the idea of situations to the extreme - it's natural. But I think Freckle is right - and it may well be that she would actually have a lovely time if put in the situation. There's also something about the way children are presented with things - if she feels that it is all somehow beyond your control, daddy and grandparents have insiste, you can do nothing, then she will feel v insecure. if she feels that the person she relies on most is confident that it is the right thing to do, she will feel much more secure and safe about it even if it isn't the thing she most wants to do. (this is something that someone v wise told us about children who need big medical procedures that cause apprehension - don't sympathise in a way that says 'I'm so sorry, but the doctors say it has to be done, Mummy's upset too....but appear to be in control of the doctors)

I would be seething at the way it has been done - but that is a separate issue.

You are in a really difficult situation emotionally - huge sympathies, I would be gnashiung my teeth and imagining horrible revenges. But I think Freckle has a good plan...but be careful not to do lots of 're-assurance' and 'are you ok?' - no surer way to signal that there might be somethng bad enough to need re-assurance! If she's goig to go, you want her to be happy and confident about it.

I took an ex-partners dd away for 2 weeks - I promise you she was as happy and relaxed and joyful as she could have been. She occasionally missed her Mum - we spoke about her lots, and I had some letters written by her Mum, and small beach gifts to give throughout the hol.

Loads of parents do it particularly where both work full time. It also helps the children as the family has two full time wages and the mother doesn't live in poverty on benefits as many single mothers with children do. Children like certainty so usually it's something like Saturday night to Tuesday at father's and rest of week mother or someone else I know has a week at one parent and a week at another. I am not saying teenagers would accept it but if it's the norm for a younger child they manage fine with it because it's the situation they are familiar with. In some countries it's the default position and you have to argue hard to get it changed. It also makes it likelier children will have a close loving relationship with both parents.

hi, morning.

imo, too as parents we should have 50/50, but what if the ex dh, doesnt actaully want or maintain that 50/ 50 thing until it suits?

not turning up cos he is going to a gig, to watch a mean.

getting his girlfreind to tell dd off for saying she doesnt like him, then when i questioned it and said, ' this is not going to help, making dd feel bad for feeling like she doesnt like her dad, because of your lack of contact and neglect' I then said now dd thinks your girlfreidn thinks she (dd) is mean.

I got 'well thats her (dd's name) fault not my girlfriends'

so, that my daughter is clingy then at 5 i think she has her reasons. I see many clingy children, who are ot having to dealwith this.

pirategirl,i wouldn't make her go my dd grandparents want to take her abroad and i'm refusing cos i don't know if he's gonna turn up and who else might be there.she is your child.your the one bringing her up.your not the bad guy cos you put her best interests first.just tell them straight she doesn't want to go and you are not prepared to put her through it.

I don't know him and you should never let children be unsafe but vast numbers of mothers in the UK deny fathers contact, fathers who weep in secret about it and I think if there's ever any doubt about whether to or not allow it.

I wish I were in your position anyway. My ex has never once has any of the 5 children to stay at his house in 4 years and it's only 5 minutes away. I'd quite like 1% of the time never mind 50%.

Xenia, I have a close relationship with my father, thanks very much, you can do that without buggering the child around to suit the grown ups' needs to feel loved and wanted.

Xenia, your ex sounds like an arse of the highest order.

xenia, your bubble is not my experience.

i will not bite in the way i really want to, becuase my post is about my concern for dd's distress, not for going off on a tangent.

my thread is clearly detailing lack of interet forn the father, until it suits. There is no show of love or care int he bits where it doesnt involve impresing his parents.

ie the other 51 weeks of the year

being clingy is part and parcel off going through this I think your ex partner is being very unreasonable IMO.

If he cant keep to regular visiting dates why should he take her on holiday he needs to build a good relationship with his daughter where she jumps up and down and cant wait to pack!!

I dont agree with the 50/50 thing but if it works thats great I have no experience of this because all the men i know hold professional jobs that mean they are often not in the country

do you know what,i've stopped my dd's dad's contact because he is an arse.totally.he doesn't care about her and only sees her to keep his family happy.it is not true that the child is always better off seeing their father.it is no good to a child's self esteem to see they are picked up and put down whenever it suits,and come after the gf,other kids,hobbies,whatever,in the father's list of priorities.