Moan about men...well some of them

[flightattendant]

I've been trying to get Ds1's father to visit, no strings, whatever, for about 2 1/2 years now. Ds1 is nearly four. I never get an answer to my friendly messages. I know he's the type to avoid any emotional confrontation and is probably scared or something, but it makes me fume.
I'm just glad that Ds never had a chance to get attached to him, so didn't 'lose' someone he already loved...but he asks why he hasn't got a daddy, and cries sometimes.
Amazing thing is that this man now is married to someone with three of her own children, he had two with his still-wife (!) when Ds was born, and left them...why does the new bird trust him??? (Same reason I did, perhaps?)
What makes me really furious is that some men insist on seeing their kids despite it upsetting the mother so much that the kids see her stressed/being sick/ or even go to court to get custody so that the kids are split up, just to prove they are the big man. My other ex did this and was a crap father to his son for 7 years until the poor lad moved back to his mum's and sister's. Makes me sick.
Why do the government not take into account that children need stability and happy mothers/primary carers, not stressed out, scared, angry ones who have to put up with idiots in their lives? It can't be good for kids to be handed over knowing that their Mum doesn't trust or like the person she's leaving them in the care of...I don't think this should be happening. I know kids have the right to see their parents but surely it should always be up to the kids...'they would keep changing their minds and messing everyone about' is probably the argument against child-led access decisions - but don't most of our ex's do the same to our kids?
Ok vent over!!

I totally agree. These are the same dads who refuse to provide for their children, even to the point of giving up their jobs in some cases. So the mother has the added stress of dealing with the CSA, no money etc. I wonder how the children react when they discover the truth of what is going on?

Well my X is all of the below and has fought me all the way over everything despite the kids accusing him of hitting them! He is also now unemployed he says after years of getting over 90k from his company! IN the meantime his new girlfriend is bragging about the films he is making

The courts have listened to the kids now and things are so so much better. Despite money worries we are all happier and now I have residency things are on a much more even keel as the kids are no longer frightened he will take them away.

I have a friend whose husband is threatening her with the same and her kids will be desperate as soon as they find out. IN my opinion the only thing whihc keeps kids sane in these circumstances is a strong relationship with their mother. Mums have been sidelined in all the fathers for justice nonsense and thier role demeaned but I have pulled my kids through this and been there for them at times when they were really low.

Blimey you ahve started me on a rant now!

God don't get me started on 'fathers for justice'!!! That to me doesn't seem remotely connected to trying to make the kids feel better...just an outlet for the most part (sure there are some fair cases) for male pride and aggression. I could be wrong...

Sorry that sounded funny, what I meant was I don't think FFJ is about the kids - not that your mentioning it was unconnected! Hope not misunderstood.

Just read this thread & to be honest most of the men who did the stunts for ffj were later proven to be crap fathers or violent partners. Why is it that kids have to suffer cos these dads who know that they wil destroy their kids lives are still allowed access even though they're only doing it to control their x partners & still be able to terrorise them & their kids.

No idea Kellogs and as far as I am concerned men who dont in any way support their kids financially also ought to have a better system in order to sort them out.

Contact is for the kids not the parents and some people dont seem to get their heads round this. If the kids dont want to see that parent or have anything to do with them then that should be respected. There is always a reason that children say this stuff as mostly they want to love their parents and have a good realtionship with them both.

Anniemac, I agree that it's very difficult to decide what is right for kids - especially if, unlike my Ds, they actually had a relationship, and a good one at that, with the absent parent before their parents split. I have no experience of that.
What you say makes sense, but I suppose my original question was 'why' and maybe you've answered it.
I was having a rant because I seem to know so many women like myself, who are on their own mainly because their child's father was a tosser, and messed them about, and still does - or worse. They all share the feelings of desperation at having to handle such a man in their life, it makes THEM stressed and sick (not the kids - that's not what I said) and the kids seeing their primary carer in this state has led many of them to resort to AD's or whatever (I was prescribed beta blockers) in order to try and keep it together when access was happening. That seems wrong.
BTW it isn't (IME) a case of making no attempt to hide the dislike of the other parent. Of course any good mum makes that effort, but my point was really that often it is impossible to hide all the symptoms, mental and physical, from perceptive kids - they tend to know when you feel like that, however hard you put on a brave face.
All of this probably doesn't apply to many cases - the ones I'm on about, particularly my own, are when the parent with care has suffered emotional or mental abuse by their ex partner, which the courts seem not to really recognise although in a case of such with no kids involved, action could probably be taken to remove the presence of the ex partner and let the woman get on with her life. Hope this clarifies.

I meant the parent resorting to drugs, not the kids...

Gosh I didn't realise about that case. Sounds pretty extreme! I guess each family, or ex family, has its own circumstances.
Ditto the criticism thing - I just wish there was an easy answer. Great to talk it through.

am going through the 'i am his father i can see him when i like' thing at the momement. I feel indifferent to my ex now but do have serious concerns about his ability to safely care for ds.... ie letting him (at 2) play with plastic bags, leaving bedroom windows open that are only 6 inches off the floor, leaving medication in reach, big family history of sexual abuse etc my anxiety will be caused by the fact that i am not convinced he will be safely cared for and i will spend every minute that people keep telling i should be enjoying away from ds (what is that all about!!) worrying about what he is up to. My solicitor scared me when she talked about alot of custody cases going 50/50 shared care now which i refuse to believe is in the best interest of the child!
On the other hand ds loves his father and enjoys the time he spends with him,so i can not take that away.
This is always a difficult one and no one is ever the winner really.

I agree anniemac and am sure that if something can be worked at which is amicable and suits all then that is how it should be.

But a man who is violent and refuses to look after his children's emotional and economic welfare in any shape or form needs something to make him see his behaviour is not acceptable and it can often feel that the courts are not listening as it is often hard to prove.

Ultimately you are right everyone gets frustrated by this process but the ones who seem the most frustrated and powerless are often the kids and only by really listening to them and making them feel that they are being listened to can we see how things should be.

can i moan about my ex as tomoorw is the dreaded day he picks up dd age 3 from nursery!!!!

every morning she asks who will be picking her up and i have to distract her to do something else because i cant tell her that he will be picking her up as she sobs,

i think she is fine when she is there and have no worries of him looking after her, i just hate the fact that she doesnt wnat to go and would rather be with me

Snowwonder, that must feel awful. It makes me see how lucky I am that Ds1's father took off completely. Our visits could not be agreeable as I was so very angry with him, for constantly messing us about and lying about where he was going, even where he was parked, (he had a new girlfriend I didn't know about - nothing wrong with discretion, but blatant, constant lying - no) so I just had no idea where he took my child, who was too young to tell me himself. I ended up having to accompany them, sometimes with his older children - he resented me being there and the atmosphere was terrible. Eventually he said he couldn't understand why I wuldn't let him have unsupervised access, to which I replied that for all I knew they went to a pub for two hours and also that he'd forgotten I knew about his constant drink driving with his other kids.
He had no answer for that and drove off in a huff - I never saw him again.
Yes, I feel guilty - but a man who lies and drinks then wants to take your kid away - I'm sorry but I couldn't just hand him over.
I have tried to contact him ever since but he never answers. I think my disrespect was more than he could handle. But it tore me to pieces every time he took Ds away and I knew I couldn't believe him about where they went or what they did.