Advice on nursery fees

[AKP79]

So, my ex isn't the most pleasant of people and is a pro at manipulation and lying. To cut a long story short, he recently took me to court for extended access and through further lies and manipulation I have ended up with a court order whereby he has our 2 year old for half of all school holidays. I'm not happy, but that's another very long story.

However, our 2yo doesn't go to a term time nursery, so doesn't have any holiday. My ex contributes £20 per week maintenance (another area he's successfully lied in but that's yet another story). I pay for full time nursery fees and I have about 10 days holiday for DS which I can book off and use to coincide with my annual leave. My ex is now obviously having our 2yo for a lot of time when he would actually be in nursery and I am left paying for these days even though they are not being used.

The order also stipulated that I have to meet my ex halfway for handovers (he lives over 2 hours away from us). This means that the trips dropping off and collecting DS cost me £40 petrol. DS has just got back from a four night stay with his dad and with the petrol and nursery fees it has cost me over £90. I have ask my ex to contribute, but as suspected he has just ignored me.

Has anyone got any advice? Is there anything I can do?

Your ds doesn't have any school holidays as yet. In another couple of years he will. So maybe you can point out that as he's not at school it's not school holidays for him or you.

When he starts school then sure, he can have half the school holidays with his dad. Until then ds is at nursery and the nursery doesn't close for school holidays. So if your ex wants him to miss those days he needs to pay the nursery fees for them as they have to be paid regardless because he isn't old enough for school holidays to apply yet...

If he doesn't like it let him take it back to court.
Unless you are happy with the arrangement. Which it doesn't sound like you are.

Is your ex able to take such a lot of time of work himself? If he's simply sticking ds in a nursery or holiday club while he's there you could argue it is better for ds to go where he already knows and is already paid for.

Incidentally it is more usual for half the main holidays (easter/xmas/summer) and alternative half terms.
And at least that way you'd not be traveling every half term.
Of course you may prefer to share each half term, in which case you're going to have to put up with the petrol costs of that option.

Unfortunately it is normal for the costs of facilitating access to be paid by yourself. At least you are meeting half way and not having to do the whole journey.

School holidays equate to what 6/7 weeks a year? While your DS is under school-age, would his Dad be happy to take this as a day week then you could not put him in nursery for that day? So instead of having the holiday weeks, Dad could have him each Monday or each Friday (not sure what your term time access schedule is but if it's EoW it would make sense to tag the day onto the weekend and so reduce travelling costs).

Thank you both. Some really really helpful suggestions.

Storm15 - I'd never considered that before and may actually help with the anxiety I am having about the long term stay arrangement. I don't feel it's appropriate at this age for DS and he is displaying some really upsetting behaviour before and after going for long periods. I could potentially suggest something along these lines and then a longer break in the summer for a holiday.

However, I fear this will be refused and that I may have to take the route of refusing the holiday access unless he starts to contribute.

One of my biggest concerns about all this holiday is the issue of where will DS be or who will he be with. The court order is for DS to be spending time with his father not to be cared for elsewhere. At the moment he is insisting he will be taking it all as holiday, but in court stated that he only gets two weeks holiday from work. My problem is I don't live nearby and have no way of knowing whether he is with DS or not. I ask and he says he is, but he is a compulsive liar and his fiancée isn't much better. So when DS goes off I am 100% in the dark.

I have resigned myself to the fact that I am having to incur travel costs despite the fact the maintenance he provides weekly only just covers the cost of meeting him every two weeks to drop off and collect DS.

I'm surprised the court has ordered 'half of school holidays' to a child that isn't school age. It seems totally illogical. How have they stipulated you divide the holidays up?

*how you divide...

Storm15 - I know, it's totally ridiculous... It states that they should all be divided equally and that the extended stay starts with whichever parent DS is spending the first weekend with. Eg - half term just gone he was with me at the start of the holiday, so he went to his father's on Weds afternoon until Sunday afternoon. This is also crazy because I have Friday's off so had to change my working week to accommodate taking DS to the meeting point.

To be honest I felt the whole court thing was a bit of a farce. Ex was bringing out the crocodile tears and he enlisted a barrister who tore me to shreds. It felt like I was up for murder not access and I hadn't done anything wrong - I've never withheld access etc. Whilst he had lied, abused and thrown completely false allegations. All such a miserable mess.

It was in front of magistrates not a judge and they summarised that he appeared to be honest and genuine. He didn't say one truthful thing the whole way through.

Did you have anyone with you in court?
Did the court appoint a CAFCAS officer?

If your ds is displaying behavioural problems then I would tell your ex and advise that you believe it is too much time away from his main carer at this age. When he is school age you will do the school holidays, unril then contact should be little and often and suggest that every other weekend from friday to sunday. Or even every third weekend.

Ask him to think of your ds's best interests and wellbeing rather than on his own personal desires.

If that doesn't work then let him take you back to court. Hopefully you'll get someone more understanding of a child's needs at this age.

I'm not an expert but I've been through the court system with my DH. Am I right in saying that for the summer holidays then, the court have said your 2.5 year old should be with his father for over 3 weeks in one block? That sounds very unusual to me if so. I think you could go back to court and get this order revised.

How is term time contact laid out?

Thanks both, I have been made to feel I have no options or choices on any of this. He's better now at handover's, but to start with I ended up taking him back home the first few times because my ex would of had to literally peel a screaming child off me. He told me I had to force DS into my ex's car and strap him in whilst he was screaming and begging me to take him home, but I refused to do that. DS came back on Sunday evening and I have had two nights of night terrors now, these will go in the next couple of days and return after his next overnight stay...

DS is nearly three and his language and understanding is pretty impressive so he's very good at communicating feelings (even at this age) with me. My ex is trying to create two separate lives for DS, so I send him up with his pillow from home, his PJs, his blankie etc and DS told me yesterday that daddy leaves them in the car. He often tells me that while he was at Daddy's house that he cried because he wanted his mummy. I know this probably isn't unusual, but it's hard. He also comes back saying unpleasant things that his father has obviously repeated over and over to him so that he will then say them to me.

Two week holidays such as Easter and Christmas are split, so one week with each parent and then with summer they state it's for us to agree how the time is divided. So I was going to very reluctantly suggest alternate weeks. The more I talk about this, the more ridiculous it sounds - plus how on earth is he going to have that much annual leave over a year to care for DS!?

Can you afford to initiate mediation? I think I'd go there as a first step. The arrangement you have seems unworkable and non-sensical. I'd offer your ex 3 nights every other weekend (either Thurs to Sun or Fi - Mon) plus maybe a week in summer so he can have a holiday and take it from there... Did Cafcass do a report?

I can't afford to go to mediation really, but anything that goes back to court needs to go through mediation first anyway apparently so it would appear to be my only option and I'd find the money if I had to.

Cafcass did a report, it was pretty useless though... they detailed my concerns, but because they ultimately concluded that there were no safeguarding issue, the report was ignored by the magistrates. Do you think it's worth raising my concerns with Cafcass again?

Yeah, i do, because he's so young. I'd give it a go. I've been through all this with my DH and I'm very pro-Dad but I don't think you've been given a sensible order. Just the fact that they've awarded half of school holidays to a child that isn't school age says it all really....

Thank you again for all the advice. I have just called Cafcass and they've said that they can't do anything because an order has already been put in place and that I will need to call the courts and go back through them!? No answer at the court...

There's a website called the custody minefield which has lots of helpful info about the court process. Also the FNF forum is fantastic for legal advice. Good luck!

Thank you I will investigate...

Like storm15 I am generally very pro dad and believe a child has the right to a relationship with both parents. However given the very young age of your ds, and the effects significant time away is having on him, I do think the order needs to be amended.

If you believe this current arrangement is harming your child's wellbeing and mental health then you need to find a solution asap.

Contact is about what is in the best interests of your child. You should both be striving for that. It sounds like your ex may have his own agenda and not be considering what your child needs.

Ask him to get a copy of the book birth to 5 matters.
Tell him that your ds is destressed with the current arrangement and get it changes asap. Courts generally tend to go with what is already in place, so you need to show this isn't working or in place asap.
The younger the child is the more often contact should be; little and often.

Offer your ex every other weekend 2 nights (so Fri to sunday, or Saturday to Monday). Ask your ex to consider your ds's wellbeing and also point out he won't need to take so much time of work for this arrangement.
Then as ds gets older you can include the half the holidays on top of the every other weekend. That is a reasonable suggestion and is what a lot of courts order, and children experience of contact.

Find the money for mediation. Your ds's long term happiness depends on it and will show the courts you are willing. If your ex refuses to compromise tell him that you propose mediation and that he'll have to take it back to court if he disagrees.

Good luck, it's a minefield and until you go through the court system it's eyeopening the decisions that are put on children supposidly with their best interest at heart. Good luck