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Original poster

maintenence. Based on gross or net?

23 replies

justjuanmorebeer · 20/01/2015 22:28

Please clear something up for me. Having problems with my ex and him paying.

He is a high earner (60k) but has increased everything he possibly can to make his take home pay as small as poss.

We have a private arrangement currently that he changes his mind on frequently (wanker) but I am thinking if I go through the CMS I will end up with so much less.

Am I right that they take this off net pay not gross?

He has increased pension to the max, joined every share save and scheme his company do, even giving 100 per month to charity.

I know this from a screenshot of his payslip.

Any advice so welcome.

OP posts:
STIDW · 20/01/2015 23:26

It's rather confusing because existing cases are under the old CSA rules and child maintenance and the paying parent's net income is used for assessments. However the CMS rather than the CSA handle new child maintenance claims and under the CMS rules child maintenance is paid as a percentage of gross taxable income. There is a calculator at CM Options that you use to find out how much he is likely to have to pay if you apply to the CMS.

The CMS gathers information from HMRC so the initial calculation is based on the latest tax return. The rates of the gross income scheme are slightly lower than the CSA scheme e.g. for 1 child the CMS rate is 12% compared to the CSA rate of 15%. IF there is evidence the paying parent has additional taxable income not taken into account or is diverting excessive amounts into a pension to reduce child maintenance payments the recipient can apply to the CMS for a variation.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 20/01/2015 23:31

Thanks. Hmmm so it is 12% and then I lose a further 4% per month on top of that? How awful. Read through all the sites and everything this week but I am still confused.

What would the calculation be if his gross monthly is £4100?

Is it 12% of that, minus 2/7 (the nights she spends there) minus 4% of that figure?

OP posts:
Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 20/01/2015 23:40

If so I have worked that out as £340 ish. God that is shit isn't it.

OP posts:
HeadDoctor · 21/01/2015 09:18

You only lose 4% if he refuses to pay you and the CMS has to collect it from him. He then has to pay 20% on top of his maintenance payment to the CMS. Even the CSA where they collect on net pay would disregard certain deductions. When they say net pay they mean tax and NI.

Does he get any taxable benefits? Company car? Private health care? My husband has to pay maintenance on this as if we received them as cash.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 21/01/2015 11:17

Yep he gets all of those benefits plus a bonus too. His basic is about 50k then the other stuff makes up the rest.

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HeadDoctor · 21/01/2015 11:53

CMS annual HMRC figure to get a weekly amount to calculate from. Bonus is definitely included. Benefits on his p11d also included. Speak to CMOptions if you're unsure. It's not just basic pay.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 21/01/2015 12:47

In that case I will wait until May to go to CMS probably as he will have had his bonus by then

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cestlavielife · 21/01/2015 15:08

I just got letter from CSA this saying "your current arrangement will end in july" - and i can now go to cms and pay the fee £20... he was assessed as zero ... ...however I know he is now working at least 16 hours per week and receiving money from lodgers so I intend to go back and re claim from cms. I am bigger earner but it's the principle.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 24/01/2015 08:44

Yes absolutely the principle. I am a very low earner and rely on this maintenence to eat and clothe us and anything else. My wages and tax credits only just cover my rent and bills to the pound then there is nothing leftover.
He is being seriously awkward.

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HeadDoctor · 24/01/2015 14:25

Apply now, tell them there is a bonus coming. Don't wait, they cannot back date it.
Did he get a bonus last year? They go on last tax years figures unless they have changed by 25%.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 24/01/2015 19:02

Yes he got a bonus last year but as we have been broken up since a month after that I don't know exactly how much it was or anything

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HeadDoctor · 24/01/2015 22:40

You don't need to know. They'll get the entire amount he earned last year from HMRC and calculate it from that.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 25/01/2015 10:10

Thing is I think he might have had a payrise since then and this years bonus will be bigger IYSWIM. He is paying eventually each month just after a whole lot of messing about.
He pays over the amount now but dangles it like a carrot and uses it to control me which is why I was thinking of going official.

Does anyone know if my calculations above look about right for the monthly amount?

OP posts:
HeadDoctor · 25/01/2015 10:24

The CMS always use the HMRC figure unless either party can prove the actual amount differs from that by 25%. So this years bonus will be used to calculate next years maintenance.

Yes, for one child and using just the £60k, that figure looks correct.

If he's paying but messing around then next time he's difficult I would just say "If the money is not in my account by xth of this month, I will apply to the CMS and they will include not only your basic salary but also your bonus and any taxable benefits in their calculation" and then stick to it. I'd also be careful relying on his money - what if he gets made redundant or cannot/doesn't pay for some reason?

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 25/01/2015 10:38

I don't really have any option other than to rely on it as my rent is really high but we are stuck in a contract for the time being (his fault).

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meglet · 25/01/2015 10:44

try and get the maintenance going through the CSA. more watertight for you and if you ever want to apply for or remortgage you will be able to include the money as income. private arrangements count for nothing in the eyes of the bank.

LadySybilLikesSloeGin · 25/01/2015 10:44

I had to go to court for maintenance as the ex isn't in the UK, but they only allow deductions for pension, tax and national insurance. Not for charity donations etc. I'm pretty sure bonuses are classed as income too so they should be using that.

Original poster
justjuanmorebeer · 25/01/2015 19:27

Thanks for the tip re mortgages meglet I had simply no idea. I hope one day far off in the future I would be able to buy somewhere.

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Sickofthisalready · 07/05/2017 08:28

Does anyone know what to do if HMRC have given CMS a salary from 2015? My ex earns £64,800 but HMRC have told the CMS its £49,000!!!! This leaves me £200 a month short of what he should be paying and what we need.

Ive told CMS this and they said I'd have to appeal it. Will this ever get sorted???

jacketej · 14/05/2017 20:41

The salary is always from the previous tax year, so now in 2017 it is from the 2015/2016 tax year. If there is a 25% decrease in wage you can challenge it. So I'd imagine you can with an increase as well.
The wage increase would there be reflected for 2016/2017 in the maintenance for next year

jacketej · 14/05/2017 20:41

The salary is always from the previous tax year, so now in 2017 it is from the 2015/2016 tax year. If there is a 25% decrease in wage you can challenge it. So I'd imagine you can with an increase as well.
The wage increase would there be reflected for 2016/2017 in the maintenance for next year

Zampa · 14/05/2017 20:44

Have you used the calculator on this link?

www.gov.uk/calculate-your-child-maintenance

Sickofthisalready · 16/05/2017 08:08

His actual wage is over 25% more than it was in 2015, so CMS have said i could appeal. Just wondered if anyone had been successful at this?

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