I can't handle my ex and don't know what to do with my daughter!

[Underdad]

So, this is my first ever post on mumsnet and one of the few times I have ever posted on a forum but I feel I could do with some collective advice and opinion. I am a single dad and my daughter has recently turned 6. I would like to say that my daughters mum (MM) and I have a good relationship but we don't.

Recently MM has started telling me that our daughter is older now and should be allowed to make her own decisions on whether she sees me or not. My D has recently decided that she doesn't want to see me at my house but will happily see me with MM. I suspect that this has to do with the fact that after 5 and a half years of being single and just being a dad, trying to get a decent career, I have started dating. I think my D is uncertain about it and she has made it clear that I am 'supposed to marry mummy'!

IMO, my daughter should come and spend time with me when I am not at work. In her MM's opinion my views are old fashioned and 'of course this is the way I would choose to parent as I came from a childhood of being seen and not heard'. I feel this is definitely not the case. It may be true that my parents were somewhat the disciplinarians, however I was always allowed to express myself. With regards to my daughter, I feel like she is being allowed to manipulate the situation and feel that this is in part because MM is using her in order to punish me for recent arguments and this is not a new thing. There have been occasions when I can't see my D because she's 'not well' or other 'more important plans' have been made that D shouldn't miss out on.

I just feel that my child is not my child. I have been marginalised. I genuinely feel that left to do things my own way, I am a very good parent, however MM won't let me be that. So anyway the latest little restriction regards the impending weekend. Firstly it has been cut short, because one of MM's friends is coming to town and said friend gets on really well with the kids so I cant see my D on the Saturday. Secondly, my daughter doesn't want to come with me on a day trip that had already been planned and agreed with MM, shifts at work changed, agreed with my new partner and her ex. So what do I do? Go without D? Turn up on her doorstep on Sunday and try and persuade her? (Which wouldn't go down too well with MM I don't suppose) Or accept the fact that MM has control over whether I see my D or not and can change her mind at a moments notice. Also sending the message that my 6 y/o is perfectly entitled to manipulate the situation. Thoughts, comments and questions welcome. Maybe I am looking at this from the wrong perspective.

Thanks

How long have you been in a relationship with your new partner ? How soon after starting a relationship did you introduce your daughter to her ?

See a solicitor and get contact sorted properly. Maybe also have a chat with your dd, she needs to understand you and her mum are not going to be together.

I think it is awful for a 6 year old to be placed in that position. She is a child and shouldn't be under this sort of pressure.

In your shoes I would take a twin track approach.

1. I would put forward contact proposals and offer to discuss them at family mediation. Frame the arguments in terms of you feeling compelled as a parent to maintain a proper relationship with your daughter. Offer to try and defuse any concerns she may have. Be 'nice' avoid escalating conflict, but do not stray from the core principle that you are an equal parent, your child deserves a relationship with you, you need proper parenting time.

1. In parallel to the above. I would complete a C100 court form and apply for a contact order. Try to minimise the backlash from the ex if you can. Perhaps say that obviously you hope agreements can be reached at mediation but if thats not possible then getting a third party to look at things seems sensible.

Two other bits of quick advice.

ACT NOW. Your dtr's 6, you have a chance to alter the status qou and be a parent in her life. If you wait, in a blink she'll be 10/11 and your chances are going to be sharply reduced.

JOIN FAMILIES NEED FATHERS. A support group for parents going through the same stuff as you. This is the single most important step you can take to improve the situation.

Dear all, I think some of you have got to the heart of the matter. Thanks for your responses. I have replied to most of your comments below. A lot of the advice is good but maybe knowing a bit more would enable you to give me further advice! Thanks.

Hi Takeyourpick, In the past I have stayed away from solicitors because the general advice is that it's not great getting the courts involved etc for the kids and can make the relationship more difficult between parents. At one point when my dd was about 3 years old, my ex did stop contact and only allowed me to see her for a few hours a week, supervised by her mother and then by her directly. The solicitor advised me that it wasn't a good idea to take it to court, and that I should agree to any terms that the mother deemed appropriate in order to regain full contact with my daughter. That was that I would not take my daughter to see my family at any point in the future as my father has a criminal record and my ex felt he may pose a risk to my dd. In reality my ex just intensely disliked my dd. I think the solicitor was young (and inexperienced) but it was what I was offered with legal aid. I figure the solicitor felt that this would be the easiest solution and she would still earn some money from writing numerous letters to 'resolve' this conflict. With regards to me and mum not being together, she knows this and has done for some time. We broke up when she was not quite 1 y/o so she's not confused about our relationship status but with being at school she has started to see other parents and knows that mummy and daddy in their situation live together and are married and go home to one another at the end of the day. Essentially she is in denial and won't accept and does not want to talk about the fact that mummy and daddy aren't together. Other than to say that I'm supposed to marry mummy. My ex has made it clear in the past that she still has feelings for me so I'm not entirely sure what she says to our dd about all of this.

To daddyofone, As it stands my ex has point blank refused to attend mediation on several accounts, simply because she recognises that at the moment she has all the cards and wishes for it to remain that way. we have come up with several mutual agreements that have been abandoned with little or no notice on a regular basis.

As for the upset of coming to my house, this is a recent thing and similar to your own situation, my dd only makes a fuss when she is with her mum or nan, but is perfectly happy within 5 minutes of leaving. She has however recently developed what I can only describe as withdrawal symptoms. She often says she want's to go home, that she misses mummy or nanny.
I do agree that you're right a 6 y/o should not be allowed to make such choices and I'm pretty sure her mum recognises that too. However she is telling our daughter that it's up to her.

She also tells our dd that it is up to her if she wants to go to church or not. My ex has developed different religious beliefs to me and in spite of the fact that she doesn't believe in God she has raised our dd as a vegetarian. When my dd asked why she is a vegetarian MM told her God made her that way. It would seem what mum says goes, what dad says can be ignored! With my disciplining style being directly veto'd in front of me by MM on numerous occasions. It is perhaps little wonder my dd doesn't see me as a father figure...

To DarkKnight, I think you get down to the crux of things. Maybe it is time that I face facts that my ex partner is always going to be unreasonable under a thin veil of being amicable. My worry is that if I were to go for a court order, she would make it very difficult for me.

I have never been offered the opportunity of having my dd on her birthday, xmas or any other special event to myself. This has always been something her MM has been adamant about. She will celebrate there, if I wish to attend that's up to me...

My greatest fears as I stare at this c100 form is that if I apply for a contact order, she will in turn apply for a residency order and will then be able to take my daughter out of the country at any time without notice. I also would not put it past her to apply for a prohibited steps order as this was threatened by her solicitor the last time we had disagreements. My EXp has made it quite clear that 'she doesn't want to make life difficult for me but that she's glad we can get along and this has never had to go through a court' she has stated she 'would be willing to play hardball and I would lose'.

Apart from my ex throwing every possible curveball at the idea of me standing up and taking what I should have rightfully - an active role in parenting my dd including the responsibilities and rights of a parent I am concerned about the practicalities of applying for a contact order. Currently I am in training which involves periods when I am in placement and periods of school/uni. To set a contact order stating who takes our dd on her birthday next year and what days of the week I have my dd on would make it impossible for me to continue my training as I don't have that much info in advance. Further to that, does anyone have any experience of how a Contact order works with applying for jobs? I will be rota'd on for work and only know what my shifts a max of 6 weeks in advance. Do employers have to work around my contact order or do I just lose out on that time with my dd if work makes it impossible to be free? If thats the case I highly doubt my ex would be willing to be flexible.

I know all of this sounds a bit negative but to me it seems quite complex and I cant see a way out/ at least I think my options need further consideration. I don't want to jump into anything and make the wrong choice. DarkKnight, you are not the first person who I have seen recommend FNF. I have checked them out and looks like they are worth joining.

Thanks again for all your advice.

A lot of fathers faced with the option of court action or making do with whats on offer face the same dilemma. Its easy for me to be an arm chair general and say you should fight for your childs rights. I understand the reality is much more complex and the fear of what your ex might do is very real.

I think your starting point for all decisions ought to be what do you believe is in the best interests of your daughter. From reading your post my fear is that when your ex says 'not now' what she means is 'not ever'. I respectfully suggest that your ex is effectively making your daughter fatherless and a parent you have a duty to challenge that. Unless you see yourself as an equal parent and an equal advocate for your child, no one else will. I also think by framing your position as being a parent compelled and driven to take action assists in mitigating against a backlash from the ex. Instead of it becoming a battle of wills between you, the issue is whats best for your daughter. You should make child welfare the only ground on which you argue upon.

Yes, the ex starts from a position of power over you. But I suggest that the more exposure her views/opinions/personality gets the more diminished that position becomes. Court can be a very stern reality check. Her views will be questioned and challenged. To someone who is used to being the only voice, that can be a stern reality check in itself.

Personally I think you will do well in court but the point is, as an advocate for your child, your there to stand up for her rights.

It sounds odd but perhaps the court process would inevitably reduce some of the conflict between you and your ex? If an authority figure like a judge or a cafcass officer were to explain the reality of child development and emotional needs to your ex, perhaps some of that would break through into her thinking? Indeed her own solicitor is going to be nudging her to a position that allows for regular contact.

Contact orders can be flexible. What the court wants is for the child to have a relationship with both parents. Some orders will state that parent A will supply parent B with available contact dates for example. Many moons ago I was at uni doing placements and lectures, it was fairly manageable.

There is no reason for a court to give your ex a residence order, but sometimes they do as a sort of consultation prize. It would allow your ex to take your child abroad for 28 days without your permission. Which at the moment I guess she would do anyway. You would still have the contact order, she would not be able to use holidays as a way of breaking that order.

Am glad your thinking of joining FNF. Great bunch of lads who have been through it all and can give you great advice.

Just wanted to say that the idea of wanting her mum and dad to be married could well be DD's. My DD developed an obsession with this at 6 in spite of the separation being unproblematic at age 2. I certainly was not encouraging her in this. She also didn't want to go to her dad's at around this age. You could really do with your ex's support in this IMO.
She doesn't sound too tricky - you say there is a veneer of amicability which is at least better than total hatred..
Playing devil's advocate - she perhaps thought that you and her were bringing up your daughter in a family unit. When you split, she was probably devastated for her daughter and worried as to how she was going to cope alone as a parent. One coping mechanism is to aim to be a self sufficient unit of 2 - I know I found that comforting - and then the father is seen as someone who is disrupting that. Not saying this is right, but trying to give an insight...
Could you try to talk to her again, emphasising how important it is for your DD to have a good relationship with her father - with articles if necessary - and point out that you really want to be that dad. Sometimes my feelings towards my ex are very volatile even now so this recent flare up might not be indicative of the overall tone of the relationship. (And lastly, I think the churchy stuff and vegetarianism are the least of your problems - you should perhaps think about backing her as a parent rather than picking at her decisions even if you disagree.)

What steps have you taken to reassure your daughter about the the changes you are making with the dating/ new partner thing?

It may just need some to resolve the issue.

Fwiw I'm the mother of a teenager who has refused to even talk to his dad for about 2 years now,I spent many years carrying him Kicking and screaming into dads car for contact and treating it like a thing that had to be done no matter what, it was very much the wrong thing for me to do.

It came to ahead 2 years ago and I ended up having to go back to court to get the contact order revoked,I don't regret going back to court under the circumstances it was the right thing to do and the only option I had left to me,I do however very much regret not giving my child a voice earlier (in all fairness to me,no matter what my dc needed to make contact work there is no way dad would have done it).

Some of the things in your post I can't see the issue with things like being flexible for unusual family visits or special family friends,and friends birthday parties that sort of thing.its quite horrible having to miss out on these special occasions because you have to go to your other parents and that's that. But it should work both ways.

One thing has made me want to ask for further info and that's the overriding your disipline methods,what was the method of disipline? Because tbh there are many disipline methods I would stop if I saw someone using them with a child of mine no matter how much I valued or respected the other parent or person doing it.

But that aside can you talk to your daughter and find out tactfully what her worries are and how you can resolve them it may be something really simple like no day trips with your new partner for a few more months or something like talking to her and reassuring.

I would try that before going down the court route (I have no issues with court in genral my ex was never successful with any of his repeated applications I always got exactly what I asked for order wise) court should imo be used as a last resort.