ex's mom, and now ex, smacking our kids

[butterflybee]

Hello amazing single parents!

I've got a bit of a dilema. For background: my ex and I split up a bit over a year ago and our kids are 3 and 5 years old. He's abusive, of the mostly verbal / controlling / manipulative variety. He's taking me to court for residence, although we just got a contact order for alternate weekends and one weeknight overnight the middle week. His mom lives with him and does a big chunk of the childcare when the kids are at his.

I don't believe in smacking, never have. I don't mean that as judgemental, just stating my position. His family grew up with smacking and see it as very normal. I've put a lot of reading and work into setting up other discipline methods and we were explicitly no hitting when we were together. My ex isn't very good at setting limits with the kids and making them stick.

My kids have started saying that they've been smacked at their dad's. It's always come out when they're calm and talkative, often right before bed. I don't probe if it doesn't come up, although I do ask questions if the topic's opened.

First it was grandma and that she tried to do it - the big kid ran away from her and was quite upset by it. Now it seems to be actually happening, and when I asked why grandma hit (i.e. what had big kid done) it seemed to be for saying the word poo. I don't agree, but at least I can understand the arguement for physical discipline when a small child is putting themselves in danger and other tools don't work. This doesn't seem to be that situation. The little kid just started talking about how both grandma and now daddy have smacked her. She talked a few times about being pushed on the bed and daddy hitting her bottom and it seems like she's trying to work out what it means. It definitely had a big impression on her.

I feel very stuck. I've made it clear to the kids it's wrong to hit and that I'm sorry it's happened to them. I don't feel like it's something I can talk to my ex or his mother about as we've got a very strained relationship. I'd ideally like it to stop, especially from his mother as these aren't even her kids and her son seems to be taking the lead from her. If that's not possible, I'd appreciate any advice on helping my kids deal with it.

Sorry this got so long..

It is against the law for there Grandmother to smack your kids. Only parents are allowed to do this (which I think is awful!) they aren't allowed to leave marks and they aren't allowed to do it across the head I think. I also think it has to be for a good enough reason and not for saying the word poo!

Contact social services also try and record them saying it without them knowing.

I am so sorry for and angry on your behalf.

That is fantastic information Happylander. I don't suppose you know where I could find that law? I'm thinking about sending an email and it helps to have an outside authority to blame. He might well confirm it in his denial ("she only does it when they're really naughty...") but I'll try to work out a way to record them saying it as well.

Saying the word 'poo' ?? I can't quite fathom how that would be naughty.

Seems like they enjoy hitting children and will take any justification tbh. I would be concerned.

It's the Children's Act 2004 that you want, or rather don't want, as the relevant section (58) does not make it illegal for grandparents to smack. Corporal punishment is illegal only in schools and registered child care settings.

It may be different in Scotland, where I think there is an absolute bar with regard to children of specified ages.

But as this stands, although you disagree with your ex's family about punishments, as they are doing nothing illegal, then your only way ahead is what you can negotiate with them.

Oh when I called social services about this once they said only parents could smack children. I must have got it wrong. I would call social services and see what they think you should do. I have found CAFCASS helpful when I have called them about stuff. As you already have a contact order I think it would be possible to get it written in that there is to be no corporal punishment although not sure.

Thank you Edith. I'm not in Scotland so it's legal, but it's good to know at least some social workers disagree that grandma's allowed.

I'm going to draft a solicitor's letter to both of them and potentially have a quick conversation with grandma before handing it over (& emailing it to him). Things are a bit less strained with her and I'd like to keep it that way if possible. I'll also try to get it into the court order when we're back at court in January.

Any chance someone know research or guidance I could site in my letter?

ps - I also posted this here because the relationships board seems to have more traffic.