How to deal with ex lying to child?

[jenrose29]

Aside from having an extra night during the Christmas holidays, my daughter (aged 4.5 years old) has never had any extra contact with her father during school holidays. We have been seperated for almost 3 years. We don't have a contact order, though at mediation he said he wants 3 weeks of extra contact during school holidays. So far I have usually contacted him at least 2 months in advance of any school holiday to ask if/what extra contact he would like. He usually leaves it until the weekend before the school holiday and then says he doesn't want any extra contact. We went away for a week at Easter and I'd asked him months earlier if he wanted any extra contact during the Easter holidays, to which he said no. Then last time she went for contact he told her that he took his girlfriend and her brother to Disneyland for a week (even showing her it on the internet) and that he'd wanted to take her too, but that I'd said no.
He collected her last night and he has been promising to buy her a Nintendo DS for over a year. He'd told her last time that he had ordered it so she asked if it had come yet. He said he had sent it back, because I'd said she wasn't allowed one (again, not true.) He then asked if he was having her until Monday instead of Sunday as it's a bank holiday. I'd asked him about this three/four times in the past 2 months and received no response and so went ahead and made plans, which I pointed out to him. He started complaining about this, then told our daughter that it would give him a chance to pack for his holiday. She asked where he is going and he told her he is going on an aeroplane to the beach etc and that he would've loved to take her but I won't let her go. He is going on a week long stag-do to Vegas!! Obviously I don't want to argue in front of her, but I also don't want to continue to allow her father to lie to her and paint me as the bad guy. What can I do?

In the US, this behaviour is described as alienation, and considered to be a form of child abuse, as it ultimately can result in the child being alienated from the parent who is being badmouthed by the other.

In the UK, the term is fraught with controversy - but there is no doubt that this type of behaviour is damaging to the child.

You could try mediation again, or see if there are any separated co-parenting courses in the area that he would be willing to attend?

Otherwise, there is little you can do to influence your ex's behaviour, but there is a lot you can do to support your DD. Try and get hold of a copy of the book Divorce Poison by Richard Warshak; which is an excellent guide for parents who find themselves in this situation - with proven techniques for minimising the impact on DC's and practical advice for dealing with the other parent in a non-confrontational way - and explains the reasons why that is so important.

Thanks, I will look into that book. Mediation was useless first time around; he admits that he doesn't discipline her, lets her eat/do what she wants etc but plays the 'it's because I love her so much and miss her' line when realistically it's because he's lazy and selfish. I would back him all the way if he implemented my routines/rules and she said she didn't want to go, but as it is he does the complete opposite of what I do and she still doesn't want to go, but it does cause lots of problems here. At the moment she doesn't resent me for all these things she is supposedly missing out on because of me, but I know it will get harder as she gets older. I have been honest with her that I don't stop him doing anything with her but she then asks me outright if he is lying. Of course, if I say yes then she tells him I've said he's a liar he'll say something about me and poor DD will be stuck in the middle. So that leaves me trying to keep the peace and say nothing bad about him but it is getting increasingly difficult with the more lies he tells. The difficulty is that he is extremely confrontational and I am the opposite. He will happily argue in front of DD whereas I completely refuse to. I prefer to communicate by email/letter if there are issues to discuss so we can resolve them logically, after thought. He, however, will only talk in person/on the phone where he often gets so cross that he storms off/hangs up despite me saying things as nicely as possible.

You do need to correct him in front of her, because otherwise she has no reason not to believe you are a contact blocking bitch.

I don't have to deal with anything like this, but when I have a similar issue, I don't say "You're dad's a dirty liar", I say "Maybe Daddy got confused, because that certainly didn't happen. He is welcome to take you on holiday/buy you a Ds, so why don't we talk to him about it together?"

I do correct him, but then he starts arguing/shouting which isn't good for DD to see so I promptly ask him to leave then worry that he'll drive like an idiot with her in the car because he's angry. She doesn't want to go on holiday with him, it's just the fact that he's telling/showing her where she could have gone then saying it's my fault that she hasn't gone that is confusing for her and will get harder as she gets older.

Shouting would mean he leaves WITHOUT the child, and I would explain to her that when someone is too angry to control their voice, they are too angry to control a car, so it's not safe for her to go in the car until he can speak without shouting.

I get a milder form of this and also DD is seven which makes it a bit easier. I just look a bit puzzled and say things like 'no, I never said that. Hmm, I don't know why Daddy said that'. I also keep it calm and low key, do the internally raging thing later. I guess it's good that the two of you have a strong enough relationship for her to tell you. I have more trouble with him getting her to keep secrets from me because if she tells me 'she'll make me sad'.

However tedious as it is, I would keep a written record of this. I have it in a long e-mail saved in my drafts. It was useful earlier this year when I very nearly ended up in court with my ex getting a Prohibited Steps Order against him as he was bringing her into contact with my estranged family against my wishes and telling her to keep it secret. Grrrr.

Colditz The sad thing is she is used to his not being able to hold his temper so doesn't see it as anything unusual.

Queenofwhatever My ex tries to get her to keep secrets from me on the 'making me sad' basis too, pathetic isn't it? Like you, I am estranged from my family and he asks her every single time he sees her if she's seen them/if not why not and causes her to be confused. I wouldn't be surprised if he tried to do something like your ex and get her in contact with them. Fortunately I don't think they'd be interested so he wouldn't get very far. I do keep records of everything, it's just frustrating when they can turn around and say the child/mother is lying and get away with what they're doing.

I would also take the 'daddy must have been mistaken' line and keep it low key. I had this situation for several years and at the age of 9 my DS managed to work his dad out for himself (with absolutley no intervention from me) and decided off his own back that he wanted no more to do with him. Not ideal but my point is that children aren't stupid and as long as your message to them is consisent, they'll work out the truth from the lies in the end.

Thank you. I do feel harsh on her sometimes when I maintain consistency no matter what he has said or done but hopefully it will all pay off in the end!

Yes just be honest.
In any case you can safely say that daddy is right you would not let her go to Vegas as it was a holiday for a group of grown men to go together and she would have been the only child there so s it would not have Been a good idea.

The Nintendo ? Well he could have kept it as his for her.
When she is there is up to him really.

You can't necessarily expect all your routines to be followed by him but there are limits of behaviour as shown in your other posts.

I use the dad must have got confused line and when the ex blames me about something that looks like blocking contact, I ask DS to ring him pass me the phone and in front of DS I tell him that I don't mind if DS x, y or z.

If she is comfortable with him screaming and shouting and losing his temper, it is even more important that you reiterate to her that it isn't acceptable behavior.