Shouldn't XH pay for childcare on 'his' days?

[lilac21]

My youngest is going into year 6 and has been going to an after school club daily. From September, she will be going to the childminder's after school Mon to Weds, and after school club Thurs and Fri. Our system is that he has her on Thursday and Friday nights. The reason for changing from daily after school club to part time only is that she will be the eldest child in the club by at least two years, whereas the childminder (who takes her to school Mon - Thurs) has a daughter in the same class as mine.

I will be paying more for the childminder than the club costs, but I don't mind as I want my DD to enjoy herself. We separated in April and I carried on paying the club fees because there were only three more and they has totalled the whole academic year and I paid 1/10 of the annual cost each month (nil in July and August).

The issue is that I asked the club to send XH the standing order form, and when I picked the girls up from him today I found the form was in their bag. I will already be paying more than I was from Sept, the child support is for five days a week, not seven, so surely I can't be expected to pay for childcare for the days he has DD? The club costs £80 a month, he pays £440 child support monthly and I will pay the childminder £70 a week.

I have also paid almost £150 for holiday childcare so far!

i think if the child support is for 5 days and you pay for all the childcare that are within those 5 days then it is only right that he pays for the club the 2 days he ahs them as he isn't paying maintenance for you for those days (rightly, because you don't have them) so he holds onto the maintenance to enable him to provide care for them in those 2 days which includes the club fees.

sounds reasonable he should pay the club - or he picks them up straight from school on those days.

so ask him if he can pick them up straight from school thurs and fri - otherwise he needs to pay and arrange the club - his days his responsibility.

Ok, i see where you are coming from.

Did you discuss this with XH before asking the club to send him the form directly?

From his point of view, he is paying a LOT each month for child support and now you are just assuming he will pony up more for after school club too.

The fact you have paid £150 for childcare so far, he will simply retort that he pays £440 per MONTH. You then end up arguing over it and moving nowhere as each of you get more entrenched.

The way I would approach it is like this. I would speak to the ex and ask him that you've changed DD to the childminder on Mon-Wed but since Thurs/Fri are his days, its up to him to sort out those days. He is the parent in charge those days so he's responsible for everything. Leave him to sort it out. Having the club send him a form directly may have just rubbed him up the wrong way.

That said....be prepared for the fact he will flat refuse. Then it comes down to working out if you want to make a stand over the issue and the effect on your lives if he starts playing silly buggers over maintenance or just bite your tongue and cough up yourself to avoid a scene.

I know there's a principle involved but years of being a LP have taught me that sometimes principles are a luxury we can't afford.

Does he get a reduction in maintenance for the two nights he has dd? If he does he should pay for childcare

There is no "should" about it. Who pays for your DC's childcare is entirely a matter of negotiation between the two of you.

My DP used to pay for the DSSs' nanny (and her accommodation) - the nanny worked at the DSSs' mother's home and was as much a maid for exW as a nanny for the DSSs.

He agreed to DD going to club those two nights. He often picks her up from school one of those days, but the club fee would have to be paid regardless of whether she attended or not. I emailed the club to send him the form, as no-one who deals with the admin actually works at the club itself.

£440 a month may sound like a lot, but it isn't to someone who earns around £80k a year and has a mortgage that costs £600 a month less than mine does.

He does pay reduced child support, he pays for 20 days a month. He does not pay any maintenance to me at all and I earn less than half his income.

Ift he agreement is that he collects her from school /after school club on the overnights he has her then he is responsible for her from the time school finishes. And that includes paying the club. He is chooseing not to pick her up after school finishes.

On the other hand if he collects her from youthen you are responsible up until the time he collects her.

I agree he should pay the child care costs on those day. But in reality is it worth the friction if he refuses.

How would you feel if arranged for a bill to be sent to you without discussing it with you first..?
The after school club has a contract with you. They can't suddenly send the bill to someone else without them agreeing to it first.
Also he may have thought that it was sent to him by accident and therefore passed it to your dd to give to you.

What would happen if he cancelled the after school club and then said he couldn't collect her from school one day (for several days/weeks). You'd be rushing round trying to sort out cover and juggling work.

I think you need to discuss this with him. Calmly and sensibly! Throwing in things like 'but you earn more than me and your mortgage is less' isn't really relevant.

You simply need to say something along the lines of - you've changed to a child minder the days you have her and if he wishes to continuing using the after school club on his days he needs to arrange that with them himself in future. If he doesn't want to use the after school club then he needs to collect her from school when it finishes, or make his own arrangements in future. And ask him what would be easiest for him.

You don't want to be burning too many bridges at this point when you're going to have a whole heap of new issues next year with secondary school looming and in all likelyhood no after school club at all...

Thanks, swallowedafly, that's good advice. I feel like being insistent on this one, especially as I have continued to pay ALL childcare costs for last three months, and I have just bought over £100 worth of new school uniforms . Luckily they are not growing too quickly now and don't need new shoes! I am also going to get their new passports this summer and that will cost over £150. That £440 gets used up pretty quickly!

I think it's also worth asking if lilac21 receives tax credits?

If you do, you should be claiming for childcare costs within your claim and could already be having 80% of the childcare costs paid by the government.

If that is the case then really you should only be asking ex for 20% of the cost on his days.

Thanks Sunshine, but I don't get any tax credits because I work full time and don't meet the criteria.

ctc kicks in for salaries below £40,000 now tho web says 50 still
www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/life/benefits/benefits_for_families_and_children.htm#child_tax_credit
Financial eligibility
The amount of Child Tax Credit you get will depend on your circumstances and your income. You can get it on quite high gross incomes, including incomes of over £50,000 a year. If you live with your partner, your incomes will be added together when your claim is assessed. Gross income means what your income is before tax and national insurance are deducted.

.

(not same as working tax credit)

presumably the cost isnt such an issue if you earning over 40,000 (or 50,000) anyway? which kinda defeats the object of querying whether he should pay?

might be worth checking re: child tax credit? go online or call them?

The child care element of working tax credit is separate. It is not related to Child tax credit, though you can probably claim both unless you are earning loads (but if you were why would you be worrying about child care costs!)

There is a much lower threshhold for claiming the child care element of working tax credits, but the main criteria is that you are a single parent working 16 hours plus a week. As always the government never make it easy for you to figure out how much you will get and where the cut off points are. You may be able to claim as much as 80% of the costs though. Look here for how to work out your eligible costs and apply to claim straight away if you qualify. You do have to use registered child care though. But presumably you after school club and child minder are registered. You need to check with them though.

www.hmrc.gov.uk/leaflets/wtc5.pdf