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Alexandra Infants and St Paul's Junior School Changes

8 replies

kingstoncherry · 14/07/2014 21:33

Talk about big changes from 2016 due to 2013 bulge entry year. What are your thoughts on this?

Alexandra Infants and St Paul's Junior School Changes
Alexandra Infants and St Paul's Junior School Changes
OP posts:
McG1888 · 14/07/2014 22:52

Wonderful if we can get more spaces for local children and to spread the benefit of having two outstanding schools next door to each other. However, I think the council needs to spend more time talking to parents about how this might work. As they have already pointed out, the devil is in the detail. Seems they would be wise to involve parents ... we might have something useful to contribute.

lgroves · 15/07/2014 13:05

I think it's a good solution to the current bulge issue in Reception, and provides more choice and more places for local parents in the longer term. As said above, the devil is the detail, and people tend not to like change, but we are very lucky to have two outstanding schools in the area offering places to local families.

Jane054848 · 15/07/2014 18:16

In case anyone hasn't got the detail of the plan, this is the notice that the school has just emailed.

 	Subject: IMPORTANT NEWS 	 
 	 
Meetings for the parents/carers of children at Alexandra Infant and St Paul’s C of E Junior schools.

14.7.14
The meetings were led by Matthew Paul, Head of School Place Commissioning.
He outlined the current issues as follows:
• Four classes in current Alexandra Reception year-group, but three classes at St Paul’s in Year 3 in 2016
• No obvious location for additional Year 3 places elsewhere in North Kingston along with
continuing forecasts of excess demand for Reception places in North Kingston
The proposed solution:
Conversion of both Alexandra and St Paul’s into all-through two-form entry primary schools from September 2016 onwards.
This solution would create a fourth Year 3 class for September 2016 (and onwards), and it would create a fourth permanent Reception class - 60 Reception places per year at each school, i.e. 120 in total, compared with the current 90.
How would the solution be enabled?
St Paul’s Junior school would expend on its current site, with two new classrooms and some minor modifications required.
There is not enough space to expand Alexandra by the necessary 4 extra classrooms, so it is proposed that Alexandra expands onto a second site: Barnfield Youth Centre, Parkfields Road.
Reception to year 4 would stay on the Alexandra Road site, and years 5 and 6 would be accommodated at Barnfield in new purpose-built buildings that would be designed to accommodate classrooms, offices, a hall etc. Some minor modifications would also be required to the buildings on Alexandra Road.
What are the benefits?
• Certainty of 120 places per year in two excellent local schools.
• Enables both schools to forge new identities as all-through primary schools, on the same basis as Fern Hill, Latchmere, St Agatha’s and St Luke’s
• Better choice for parents of children due to start Reception, enabling them to benefit from one ethos from 4 to 11
• Removes the anomaly of a community infant school feeding into a Church of England junior school
Parents would need only to apply once per child for primary school admission. Larger budgets, enabling more staff, a broader offer and more economies of scale in each school
Having more staff would provide increased opportunities for:
• recruitment
• collaboration on planning and developing the curriculum
• sharing of skills and ideas
• staff development
• specialisms
• extra-curricular enrichment
Probable timescales
Autumn 2014: full feasibility studies for demolition and new build at Barnfield and re-modelling of Alexandra’s and St Paul’s current sites
Autumn 2014: statutory consultation process; submit planning applications
Spring 2015: demolish existing buildings at Barnfield and start building new accommodation there and at St Paul’s
15 January 2016: parents apply for Year 3 places
By spring 2016: complete work at Barnfield
17 April: Year 3 application outcomes known
Summer 2016: re-model Alexandra’s and St Paul’s current sites
Year 3 admissions 2016 to 2018
There would be a three-year transition, during which each Year 2 cohort would have to be split between the two schools: in 2016, 60-60; in 2017 and 2018, 60-30 and 60-30 (to be confirmed)
Published admissions criteria would be applied as necessary.
Year 3 allocations would be run before Reception allocations
Split-site issues for Alexandra
We recognise that there are issues related to split sites, and we are currently identifying all the potential problems so that we can overcome them. Some are quite straightforward organisation issues, for instance:
Drop-off and pick-up times would need to be staggered, children could be delivered to Alexandra and then taken by walking bus from Alexandra Road site to Barnfield. A 20 minute walk is a good start to an active day for 10 and 11 year olds.
Children could still be dropped off and picked up at the school’s wrap around care on one site.
Staff can use bicycles between sites – we are all looking forward to getting fitter!
Regular whole community assemblies would be programmed in at St Paul’s Church, and separate Infant and Junior assemblies in the school hall.
There would be a lead teacher at the second site, and also admin and cooking facilities: the funding formula would include a split-site element to enable this.
Other issues are more complex, and relate to the quality of children’s educational experience. The leadership team is exploring both the risks and the benefits that the split site offers, and aim to make sure that this is an opportunity which enhances our offer rather than detracts from it.
The schools’ views
Both schools’ governing bodies, and the Diocese of Southwark, have given their in-principle approval, subject to:
• Full involvement in, and subsequent approval of, building plans
• Approval of fully-developed transition plans
• Financial projections during and after the transition period
• Approval of proposed building designs and available capital
There will be opportunities for discussion, consultation and debate over the coming months, and we anticipate that our communities will be very interested and involved in this process.
Kevin Edmonds and Rachel Carr.

Jane054848 · 15/07/2014 18:27

So, to summarise my views on the above:

  • This seems like a terrible idea which will tear both schools apart
  • The idea of a split site school is ridiculous and impractical for anyone with more than one child. Barnfield is a really long way away at child walking speed. There is currently a 15 minute range for dropping off kids - so they hang around for 15 minutes, and then at 9am, they walk 20 minutes (optimistically) to start lessons at the new site - then they finish lessons and walk 20 minutes back. So are they going to have 40 minutes less school, or are we supposed to pick one child up 40 minutes after the other? And how exactly does this work with after school activities? They arrive half way through?
  • No-one is going to want to go to a split site school with all the related problems, when they could go to a normal one. This is likely to lead to it becoming a 4th or 5th choice and losing its motivated parents, students and teachers. If I had known about this plan, I certainly would have chosen one of the other local schools in preference to Alexandra - and I will be seeing if I can get them into another school now (unlikely).
  • What is the advantage to doing this instead of just starting a new one-form school (like St Lukes) at Barnfield? In terms of location, Barnfield is not a local school for people who currently live in the Alexandra/St Paul's catchment.
MumOfN · 16/07/2014 13:25

While I agree there need to be more school places in North
Kingston, the current reception children need a local place to go to in year 3 and both schools are excellent, this proposal seems rushed and not thought through.

Both schools have only just been extended to 3 form entry - and now staff and pupils are put through more upheaval.

My main concerns are:

  • There is a (optimistic) 20min walk to Barnfileds site: How will this
work in reality for drop off/ pick up, before and after school care, in rain or winter?
  • what steps are taken to ensure the split site does not impact on the education? This is also identified as an issue in the email from school above, but not answered.
  • There is low traffic/ dedicated/ safe cycle route between the sites
  • Park Road is already busy with traffic in the mornings and afternoons
  • There are already a lot of parents driving to the school. It will only get worse with the additional classes and split site

There doesn't seems to a plan B and other options didn't seem to be considered enough:

  • a separate primary at Barnfields site
  • prioritizing a new primary school at former gas works, opposite sainsburys.
  • Extending Alexandra into Children Center/ nursery (ruled out on the basis of Childrens Centre was funded by SureStart and would need to be paid back)

There was a suggestion to hold a parents/ community meeting this coming Monday, before schools break up, to organise information gathering and possible freedom of information act requests. Details TBC.

KingstonDad · 16/07/2014 15:55

My concern is around the one area which was explicitly not revealed in the meeting this week - what changes there might be to the admissions criteria to St. Paul's when it becomes a through school. At present, Church attendance is third behind geography, sibling and SEN, but the diocese representative in the meeting and the head both acknowledged that this would be reviewed, and made no promise that it would remain the same.

Should it change, with Church attendance slipping ahead of proximity, then it would mean that the intake area would enlarge greatly for St. Paul's, and that would inevitably put pressure on local families trying to get into either primary. Alexandra's available local family intake will shrink from 90 to 60 places, and whilst St Paul's will also have 60 places, what proportion of those will be available to local families who'd currently be assured of a place if the catchment area is widened to include church attending families?

The diocese was keen to stress that it is the board of governors of St Paul's who'll own that process, and by law they can change the criteria in this way.

My daughter is entering reception at Alexandra in September, and our youngest will enter reception in 2016. I have a real concern that our eldest, if she misses out on a yr 3 place at either school, will end up at the Kingston Free School which, whilst a location has not yet been decided, will certainly not be in North Kingston or the short walk from home we currently have.

So I'm very worried, and I think there should be as much pressure brought to bear on the governors of St Paul's as possible to ensure that the needs of local families are given as much consideration as the desire to provide a faith based education.

That aside, I think the proposal is an elegant solution to some thorny issues, although I share the concern of parents about the realities of moving between two sites nearly a mile apart, and it's a source of regret that my daughters' primary education will be coloured by the disruption and bedding in of new schools.

Either way, the cynic in me thinks that St Paul's will see its Sunday attendance swell once the new policy becomes clear...

MumOfN · 16/07/2014 20:53

@StuartForrest
My understanding at the meeting was that Reception2014 children would go to y3 in Sept 2017, where st. Pauls would take 30 and Alexandra 60 children. So all 90 children from Alexandra should have a place at either school. As your eldest has a place at Alexandra you can use the sibling rule to apply for your youngest for Sep2016 there.
Which in turn means your eldest should be able to keep her place at Alexandra when moving to year 3 based on the sibling rule - as long as you state your preference that way, if that's what you want.

Btw, St Pauls is already a vibrant church with lots of families (not necessarily related to the school). I don't think they need to fudge the admission criteria to boost attendance on Sundays.

KingstonDad · 16/07/2014 22:15

@MumofN - agree with the point about St Paul's having a vibrant community. Our two have been to the wonderful infants groups, and we've been to services there many times. We've seen and experienced first hand the amazing support they provide to the local community.

If anything, a change in the admissions process won't be good for the church either because, like it or not, what would happen is "fake christians" turning up to get their kids into school. Look at St. Luke's church - prescriptive policies on attendance at least twice weekly, and signing in AND out, because the church knows that without such policies abuse would take place.

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