schools & neighborhoods

[Char1y]

Dear mums,
I have read through the postings on the subject of schools and have formed some initial ideas of what is ahead of me, however I felt it best to describe my particular situation in a separate post.
It is very likely that we will be moving to Edinburgh as of September 2012. DS is 9 now, which means he will be P7 as of next academic year (am I right?).
DH and I feel that his education is our priority and we will adjust the home (rent/buy, neighborhood) decision after choosing the best school.
When we moved to the UK 2 years ago, we had a hard time with the first school we picked for our son. It was the top ranked primary state school in the county (we deliberately rented a house in the catchment area) but it was huge (600+), the adjustment to the new system was difficult on DS and we were extremely frustrated by not knowing whether to move him or to pursue other options. Some helpful friends we met here told us about another school and we decided to move him, so now he is doing fantastic. His current school is really small (100 pupils), all teachers know all kids, he has made wonderful friends and he goes to school with desire and enthusiasm.
I would like to avoid this hit and miss situation if possible when we move to Edinburgh.
I understand based on my initial research that if we take the state schools option, he will have to go to a primary school for one year only (P7) and then move on to a high school. In this case he will have gone through 5 different schools altogether and I'm afraid this may be too traumatic.
On the other hand, if we try the private schools, we cannot afford Cargilfiled or Fettes or Laretto. So I am looking at George Watson, EA, Clifton Hall, George Hariot's or Stener-Waldorf.
It seems to me GW is a good option with its sports facilities (DS plays football), but you say it is very large and we were burned by a large school before. It doesn't necessarily mean that it will be a problem this time around, but something to keep in mind. EA seems smaller by your posts, does anybody know roughly the count?
I also realize that he will have to apply and take exams in all of these schools if we want to maximize his chance of being admitted anywhere. He is doing great scholastically in his current school but that might not be enough to be offered a position in a private school. Sitting for 5 different exams might also be too much for him. Not to mention that we will have to come to Edinburgh at least twice if not more.
On the other hand, changing schools may not be such a problem as I fear. Here in England, he is year 5 and it is his last year in primary school and all of his friends will be moving to the same middle school. In this case a change in schools does not seem so disruptive.
Please give me your opinions. Thanks for reading.

I'm not in edinburgh so can't be much help with the schools, he may not be in P7 next year if he's only 9 now. When will he be 10? If he turns 10 before the end of February he'd be going into p7 (I think. Disclaimer: my DC are younger, but I think that's right). If he turns 10 between March and August, he'd be going into p6 next August (the cut-off is different from England).

Thank you midnightexpress. This is very helpful, he turns 10 in April, so will be P6 then. Could other informed mums please confirm this for me. Thanks.

Char1y - yes, he would go into P6. I would advise against the Steiner School unless you subscribe to that particular philosophy. I am not sure Edinburgh has many small schools...

Good luck!

If you're concerned about the impact of changing schools for secondary level, then you may want to stay away from Cargilfields and Clifton Hall, as they're prep schools. The other private options you've mentioned would school him through to S6 level.

Seriously avoid Steiner. Plenty of threads about it on here.

Did you know steiner schools are based on a religion / philosophy called Anthrosophy? I didn't until DP explained it to me - he's got friends who went to steiner schools. I just thought they were just schools with a creative agenda. Not so. Not I think they're dangerously bonkers and I wouldn't touch one with a barge pole. They won't do much for your DS's academic development either IMO. (Sorry it's late at night I'm too tired to be diplomatic!) Search for the steiner threads on this forum - they're an education!

Thank you all! I will read on Steiner schools, didn't realize.

Dalmeny out South Queensferry way is a lovely small school. There are less than 100 in the school but they have a lot of army children from a local base so change can happen a lot. But there are also parents who travel to get their children in.

If you are staying long term in Edinburgh, I'd choose a high school. My daughter is in P7 (she'll be 12 in January) and despite wanting to go to Craigmount originally she's chosen the smaller high school of Forrester where they have 900 pupils less than Craigmount and no more than 20 in a class at any time and the staff are enthuiastic and vibrant. I found the whole school to be much nicer than I'd expected as my sisters went to the school in the 1970's.

Edinburgh is so large but maybe sometime to visit may be on the cards and contacting schools to see what they can offer etc. The exams for GW are in November as my friend's children go there.

Without wishing to ignite the Steiner debate on here, I know several people who went to the Edinburgh Steiner school and they are all perfectly well-adjusted, normal people! All of them work in the creative industries (a couple of actors, a photographer, a film-maker), successfully. However, if you are looking for a rigorous, traditional education, Steiner is probably not for you. It's not my cup of tea for various reasons, including some of the philosophical ideas behind it all, but you might feel differently if you're looking for something alternative. Cargilfield and Steiner are poles apart. I'd suggest you read up on it and visit for yourself.

Groovee, thanks for your input, exactly what I was looking for. I will look into Forrester.
Midnightexpress, thanks for this, I have been convinced numerous times that the right school is a matter of fit and there is no single best school.
We will definitely be coming to visit the schools, I realize that there are factors which cannot be observed without a visit in person.
I found the information on the number of pupils on the SCIS site (where I should have looked first) and was astonished to see 2,328 in George Watson's and 1,620 in George Heriot's whereas EA is 545 and Clifton Hall is 297. I am beginning to form a very positive opinion of Clifton Hall having read the Headmaster's blog. It is a bit out of Edinburgh though. On the one hand, it being a private school, it wouldn't matter were we live, and they offer a bus service from Bathgate and St. Margaret's. We don't necessarily mind living in the suburbs, but Edinburgh is such a fairytale place, it is a shame not to experience it to the fullest.
Thanks again.

Though the traffic is a nightmare, so do bear that in mind if you're thinking of crossing town on a school run.

Just realised my son would be in the same year as your son as he's just turned 9.

Char1y, your figures for some of the schools are slightly misleading, your figures for Watsons and heriots also include their junior schools. For Edinburgh Academy if you add in the junior school it takes the figures up nearer to 1000 I think.

Clifton Hall is a small school and until about 3 or 4 years ago was only a junior school. It combined with St Serfs which was an all through school that had rapidly diminishing numbers. I remember looking at ST Serfs for mine and while the small classroom numbers looked fantastic the reality was that they just couldn't offer the range of subjects and facilities that some of the other schools could. I am guessing that while the numbers have gone up slightly at Clifton Hall it would be worthwhile checking the range of subject choices on offer for senior school exams. What is your ds interested in, does the school specialties fit in with his interests.

Don't be put off by large numbers because in a well managed school it really shouldn't matter. The feel and ethos of the school are far more important in my opinion, and which school is best suited to your child. From experience you will know when you visit a school if it is suited to your child and from talking to the head and perhaps meeting some of the other kids.

crazycarol, thank you for this perspective. I am keeping an open mind and will visit all. It is interesting how SCIS reports the numbers separately for EA and their junior school, while for GW and GH they are all together. But thank you for pointing it out, and also the fact that Clifton Hall cannot offer as many classes makes perfect sense and should be considered carefully.

I would just add that although a small school may be appealing consider the possibility of a small school closing because of financial difficulty (it may be that CH merged with SS to avoid this). Although it may be a remote possibility just be aware of this element. As someone said - a big school if well run can deflect the negative aspects of scale and is more unlikely to go under in uncertain economic times.

I viewed GW and did not like it (lady who showed us round did not know all the children's names and the plyarea though well maintained did not I feel have much going in terms of equipment for the (I think) circa 800 primary school children .

Have you thought of outside edinburgh and the villages heading towards the borders. They have some delightful (small) primary schools with great reputations.

Sorry should have read what I posted !

I viewed GW and did not like it. The lady who showed us round did not know all the children's names and the playarea although well maintained did not I feel have much going in terms of equipment for the (I think) circa 800 primary school children .

DS is at GW, and we like it. It is a very large school, but it really doesn't feel like it. The children are split into P1-3 in one playground, P4-7 in another. The senior school is on the other side of the campus. So you rarely see all the children together.

I'd say from your point of view the advantage of GW (and some of the other independent schools) is that the junior and senior schools are on the same campus so the transition to senior school is not such a large step.

Ditto what Chrysanthemum5 says DS is at GW and I was worried about it being so large, but it really doesn't feel that way, Ds's nursery assistant still asks after him by name every time I see her although he is now in P1. I was very impressed at parents evening as the teacher had a full A4 sheet written up about DS.

It is true that there is not loads of playground equipment but they play football at their break time or run around.

I would go and have a look, hopefully that will give you more of a feel for the place.

I have been looking at the private sector for some time as I want a school where my son can do primary and secondary. I felt the same with GW, it was so big,I came from Lomond school in Helensburgh which had 500 pupils from p1 to s6 at the time, if not less! So I wanted my son to have a cosy family environment.
We chose EA and George Heriots as our favourite. He starts EA nursery in August and I have his name down at George heriots as well, if I get in that's great but if not I am extremely happy for him to stay at EA.
Edinburgh has such a large choice, but I liked these schools in particular as when I went to visit the teachers knew the names of the pupils :) it was personal, and I like that alot.