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Original poster

Edinburgh independent schools

60 replies

maggiethecat · 13/01/2011 20:51

Have considered a lot of the advice given here (Dh refers to it as 'gospel according to MN') and have shortlisted a few state schools to see when we visit Ed in just over a week.

I thought that it might be useful to look at a couple of independent primaries as well since there is no guarantee that we'll get our chosen schools (esp since we've missed application deadline) or that both girls will be together.

We've heard that St Georges is good academically but that's not all that matters to us - also still not sure if we want same sex school.

Watsons has been mentioned as being very nice and will have a look at that.

Any others recommended?

OP posts:
bairn24 · 20/01/2011 12:36

Is it this week you're up maggie? Hope some of the comments here have helped.

Not wanting to hijack thread, but i've found it really interesting to hear people say that they wish they could afford to send their children to a private school.

Of my friends who haven't gone private it seems that half are at pains to point out that they "could afford it if they wanted to, but choose not to". And the others go totally OTT about how good the state school that their children goes to is as if to demonstrate that I am wasting my money.

DH says it's sour grapes. I'm not sure. Why do people do that ??

bairn24 · 20/01/2011 12:41

Actually, to be fair, it's not as bad as I am making out (in that it's not ALL my friends who seem to have a problem - more like just a few!). But I do have a bit of a bee in my bonnet about it.

Why is it Ok to have, for example, a 60 inch telly, a £50k car, designer clothes etc (all things we don't have), but it's not Ok to pay for your kids to go to private school?

carolscotland · 20/01/2011 16:25

In my experience there are some people who think that if state school was ok for them it will be ok for their kids. There are also people who would much rather have their 3 foreign holidays a year, 2 cars, etc etc than invest in their kids future. Yes I did say invest because that it how I look at it. There are also some who are just to scared to put their kids through the entrance test (in case the little genius fails!). Yes there are a lot that don't get through the entrance test. A friend got some unofficial figures a couple of years ago for s1 entrance. heriots only places for about 1/4 of those doing test. Watsons places for just under 1/2. Stewarts just over 1/2. Perhaps someone with actual knowledge of this could verify.

As to Maggie's question about why the private schools are so large it is because of demand. Also due to economics. There were other smaller private schools which just have not survived. Most recently St Serfs which combined with Cliftonhall out at their campus. Also another school to not survive was St Margarets, but that is another story.

Scotland does not have the option of grammar schools that many parts of England still have, so the only way to give our kids the best education we can (for those of us who care) is to go private. Edinburgh is extremely fortunate in the number of private schools that it has and I believe a disproportunate % of children in Edinburgh are educated in private schools because of this.

And bairn, next time someone brags about how good their kids state school is, show them the exam tables, none of the Edinburgh state schools come close to the private schools.

scotgirl · 20/01/2011 16:49

There are also some who just can't afford it. £20k a year for 2 kids in secondary school - so you need to know you will have a minumum of £100k spare to commit your kids to a school.

Lots of us would like to invest in our kids future - but it is simply outwith our financial means.

AMumInScotland · 20/01/2011 17:11

carolscotland - I don't mean to hijack the thread too much with generalities, but you have to see that the exam tables for schools which are academically selective can't be compared directly with the results for state schools in a "that proves they're better" kind of way. If you take only the top 50% of applicants, it's hardly surprising if they go on to get higher exam results on average. That doesn't in the slightest prove that, for any given child, their results will automatically be better at the private school than they would have been at a "good" state school.

iKiTi · 20/01/2011 20:37

DS loves his school (Heriots), is doing really well and was truly appalled when I suggested he goes to the local school if we moved into a property in a good catchment area in future. Well, we had the choice of buying a higher priced property in Edinburgh in the catchment area of a good school or a similar sized property in another area and spend the extra money on school fees, but judging from DS's reaction, I guess we made the right choice! :)

DuplicitousBitch · 20/01/2011 20:42

independent schools should lose their charitable status. this thread has enraged me, esp carol you nobbo.

carolscotland · 20/01/2011 22:06

Sorry my post doesn't read how I intended it. I was just replying to Bairn's question:

"Of my friends who haven't gone private it seems that half are at pains to point out that they "could afford it if they wanted to, but choose not to". And the others go totally OTT about how good the state school that their children goes to is as if to demonstrate that I am wasting my money.

DH says it's sour grapes. I'm not sure. Why do people do that ??"

I was just stating what I had heard / experienced and not necessarily my personal view. Apologies again Maggie for hijacking the thread.

Bookswapper · 20/01/2011 22:16

god carol you should hear yourself really...even if you are not spouting a personal view, parents whose views you are parroting are the reason why many parents cannot stomach an Edinburgh private school for their children...

And anyway, my children are clever and will do well anywhere Grin

GoodChristianaRejoice · 20/01/2011 22:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

carolscotland · 20/01/2011 22:53

GoodChristianaRejoice I am rather confused at your post. If you felt that your dd would do well wherever she went why did you apply to St Georges? You do actually need to apply to the school to be offered a bursary. Confused

However I am glad that she loves st peters, yes I agree that we do have some excellent schools in Edinburgh it is just unfortunate that not all schools are the same and that the good ones are usually very over-subscribed.

GoodChristianaRejoice · 20/01/2011 23:01

She was offered it it as she went to preschool there

GoodChristianaRejoice · 20/01/2011 23:03

Given edinburgh's disproportionate attendance at private schools, do edinburgh pupils do, on the whole, better than other pupils i general? Uk wide? Just wondering

bairn24 · 20/01/2011 23:09

Jeez,

Book, Amum and Duplicitousbitch. There's not need to be so nasty!!

DB - I'd be really intrigued to see how the state sytem coped if the private schools lost their charitable status, were forced to put fees up or close, and the state sytem had to undertake to educate the 25% of children who would be entitled to opt back in. It would be chaos. It's interesting that you want that to happen. As GCR says - every child who doesn't take up a state place must be a benefit for those who do?

Amum - most of the chdilren at the Edinburgh private schools are there from age 3 or 5. There are small intakes after that, and S1 places are rare (and are therefore selective including academic ability). Therefore how you can say that their results are inevitably good is not valid - you cannot tell at such a young age what children are capable of.

Book - it's not about the parents it's about your child. My childrens' experiences have naff all to do with the parents at the gate. it's about what goes on between 8.30 and 3.30. Your attestation that the private schl sector in Edinburgh is something that some parents cannot "stomach" backs up what I said before - it's a really emotive subject. But I just don't get why it gets people's backs up so much. Do you get riled when people spend their money on a holiday or a car or jewellery?

Mssoul · 20/01/2011 23:09

Wow, lots of mners in Ed by the looks of things. My eldest went to Floras and I couldn't fault it - loads of after school activities, good after school club and, of course, the music school. Just my tuppence worth Smile Met the new head too and she was lovely, but didn't experience her as head for long.

Original poster
maggiethecat · 20/01/2011 23:21

I know that this can be an emotive topic as evidenced on other threads but was not looking to stir things up.

All the comments have been useful as I can kind of look at things, for the moment, through long distance lens.

I get the feeling though that generally education is of a good quality in Ed so I am not as anxious as I could otherwise have been.

OP posts:
Original poster
maggiethecat · 20/01/2011 23:28

Mssoul, we are considering Flora as an option bcos of music. Did you find that the children had good music experiences even if they were not part of the specialist school?

Dd1 plays violin and I would be happy if her music was able to help her to settle in nicely at new school.

OP posts:
Mssoul · 20/01/2011 23:57

Very good music facility. Except when dd took up the chanter Grin She played mini bass for a while, but didn't stick it - more interested in sport/dance. If a child wants to play an instrument at Flora's (my friend's son fe - good violinist and not in music school) they are encouraged and have opportunities to contribute to school shows and benefit from tuition. Obv my dd not there now, but that was my experience. FWIW, My dd2 will also attend Flora's...

Mssoul · 21/01/2011 00:00

BTW The chanter thing is only because of the horrendous noise, nothing wrong with the tuition; surely a bagpipe is designed to be heard from a far off glen, not your front room Smile

GoodChristianaRejoice · 21/01/2011 09:02

I don't think it is that hard to get into private school when you are older! I managed it, for secondary, so did lots of people i know. Private schools do quite a recruitment drive at s1 entrance level so it can't be that tricky.

Mssoul · 21/01/2011 09:09

Agree GCR - quite a few of the kids from my dd's year at Flora's went on to private school and none of them were especially gifted. Indeed, it is very common in Ed to swap from state to private at this stage and I have a lot of acquaintances who have. There is an exam, but I have never known anyone to fail it.

Original poster
maggiethecat · 21/01/2011 09:45

GCR, St Peter's is a state school being considered. Do you know if they have been more oversubscribed than usual recently?

OP posts:
carolscotland · 21/01/2011 15:06

Maggie,
this might answer some of your questions
www2.jpscotland.co.uk/EN/en02schools.PDF
Unfortunately it is a couple of years out of date but it may give you an idea as to how full schools are. Someone else may have an idea of where to find more up to date information.
About 3 years ago i put in a "freedom of information" request to the council for specific information on certain schools. Unfortunatly I don't have it any more, but you could go down that route if you really need to.
The first priority in out of catchment requests is for sibling admission.

Hope this helps

GoodChristianaRejoice · 21/01/2011 17:31

Hi Yes they are oversubscribed. We live within cathcment but are not catholic, and live about 2 miles from school. At first we received a letter saying we were on waiting list, but waiting list cleared within a few weeks and we got a place in May.

I know some people who got a place only a few weeks before. I don't know if the waiting list cleared completely but i think if you are out of catchment and not catholic your chains of getting in are low.

Priority is cathcment and catholic and then cathcment and not catholic, so if you are in catchment i believe you stand a good chance.

Bookswapper · 21/01/2011 21:53

Bairn...some of Carol's comments are quite objectionable, condescending and inflammatory. In particular the comment "(for those of us who care)" implying that those parents who use state schools do not care enough. I also find this paragraph offensive "There are also people who would much rather have their 3 foreign holidays a year, 2 cars, etc etc than invest in their kids future. " again implying state school parents dont care enough. Also, I find this comment is very offensive to parents "There are also some who are just to scared to put their kids through the entrance test (in case the little genius fails!)" implying the state school children aren't clever enough and the parents just wont recognise it.

Those sort of comments would always get parents' backs up because they are offensive. That's it really.

And parents do shape the ethos and culture of a school. The children do not live in a bubble within it. The school and parents form a community. Luckily a good head sorts the parents out Grin. I offer my example of Watson's, a few years ago now, when a homeless hostel was proposed for a neighbouring property. The parents were in high dudgeon about undesirable influences close to the school but the head went on record as saying the homeless hostel was welcomed and the school would not object. Contrast that approach with a recent story of Mrs Goodwin (wife of Fred) when picking her kids, shut the door on a pupil in a wheelchair when the pupil thought she was going to hold it open.

And, for the record, I thought my comments were quite restrained and even a bit jokey!