Moving to London...advice on where to live and schools?

[janet75]

Hi
We are relocating to the London early in the new year and I am trying to research where we should live and information on the UK schooling system.

We have a 4yr old and 1yr old so want to live somewhere that is suitable for families but not too far from Canary Wharf. We've been looking along the Jubilee line and Greenwich Blackheath. I would really appreciate some comments on the areas and what life is like with Kids.

Also would like some info on the best way to select schools my eldest, turns 5 in August 09. Here (Australia) he would not start formal schooling until January 2010 but from the limited information I have been able to find on UK schooling I think that your education system starts a year earlier?

Also I am a little confused over the classes of schools public, private, independant? And how to choose between them?

Any comments would be much appreciated!

Thanks,
Janet

I recently found a good site based on school league tables which allows you to search on school type by area www.timesonline.co.uk/parentpower/ For each school, as well as results, it links to their website and their inspection report (though links to Ofsted for state school reports seem to be broken)

We have friends in Blackheath and they're very happy there.

Where is Australia are you from?

Thanks for all the comments.

Its very difficult to decide on an area, but I agree that we have to and then research it. As we arn't there to walk the streets its a very touch decision as to where to focus the search. We are hoping to get the 'london' experience, but then we will be in London for a long time so we need to also be in a place that is suitable for a young family.

I'm from Sydney Australia and live about 10 minutes from the city in an area that has lots of parks and is great for children. So I guess I want to have the best of both in London, close to everything but good for the kids - if thats possible??

Thanks for the school website as this currently is our main issue, getting a spot in a good school.

At the moment I think we've favoring Maida Vale and Blackheath areas.....

Janet

Janet, I'm from Sydney too. Where abouts were you? Mosman? Miada Vale and St Johns Wood are def worth checking out. If you have any friends here it is worth being somewhere near them as you will simply never see then if they live too far away. Londoners have the most warped sense of distance, but it is contagious. Just North of Maida Vale is Queens Park which is also lovely and slightly less expensive.
Lots of people also commute to CW from Clapham way as well. It's a leafy suburban area with nice streets and good schools. You would possibly get a house there for the price of a flat in Maida Vale. It's more Roselle to Maida Vale's Woolhara.

Not all private schools operate waiting lists - some accept applications only in the year before entry and others at almost any time.

Janet - can't really write about this on here as I work at one of the private schools in one of the areas mentioned above, but happy to e-mail privately and off the record if you want some advice - margotmaynard at gmail dot com

I also have done an expat assignment overseas with my DH's job, so am feeling your pain!

Forgot to say also for private schools try

www.isc.co.uk

Blackheath is amazing. I live in the cheaper border bits to it and wouldn't live anywhere else. There is a huge community feel to it, a real cafe culture and a good mix of people.

as well as schools you probably ought to look at your housing wishlist - eg how much does the size of garden matter, do you want a house or flat, etc

it might also be worth finding out where your husbands future colleagues live - I live in Blackheath and don't think there is a sizeable Canary Wharf expat community there - it may exist and I'm just not aware of it but I don't think it's an area of London that really registers on the expat radar. I've never really worked out why - I think it's a lovely place to live.

If you are interested in buying a house in Blackheath my neighbours sale just fell through so there is a family house with garden just off the heath that is not on the market because of the current conditions but which is available for sale.

Thanks everyone for all the comments.

As for feeling safe in the neighbourhood what is Blackheath and Greenwich like? or Maida Vale / St Johns Wood?

I guess i'm looking for an area more like Crows Nest in Sydney ... if anyone can suggest a similar that would be great.

Clapham is pretty Crows Nest. Maida Vale/St Johns Wood feel v safe, but are more high density than you'd find on Syd North Shore.
For me the main benefit of Maida Vale was that we were on a communal garden, so people's back doors opened onto about 2 acres of totally enclosed garden where children could play safely. No matter how nice a park is, you can't just let your kids run off and play by thmeselves in London, so this was a huge benefit for families IMO.
I don;t think there are any suburbs in London that will feel as safe as Crows Nest I'm afraid. It's v different, but there are benefits too. Better to embrase the new than try to replicate what you had before.

Sorry about spelling!

Afraid I don't know Sydney at all, but Blackheath & Greenwich are mostly quite safe as far as London goes. Like everywhere in London, the dodgy areas are only round the corner from the nicer ones. With children of only 4 and 1 you won't be letting them out alone yet, so in the light of that, my comments would be:

• I'm comfortable walking around any of these areas (and plenty of less nice ones) during my children's waking hours.
• There aren't terrible rowdy parts of Blackheath and Greenwich at night. I'd be more careful in neighbouring areas eg. Lewisham, New Cross, Peckham, Woolwich (though I'd go to these in the daytime).
• All over London (and the UK!) you need to lock your home up properly, not leave things visible in your car etc.
• There are very few places in London I'd walk alone at night if there aren't other people around me.
• Most places are very near to a train or bus route so getting home alone isn't that difficult - I don't go out late often, but usually call DH for the last few hundred metres.

Are there other aspects of safety you're concerned about?

Thanks, its difficult to get an understanding without having some opinions. My main safety concerns are:

• at night in the house / apartment as my husband will have to travel a lot and the potential of break-ins (which of course you get everywhere, but if I feel safe in the day then the nights should be ok)
• daytime on the streets, gangs of teenagers etc

I have also been thinking a fair bit about St. John's Wood area, the tube time to canary wharf says about 25mins in peek hour do you think that is realistic?

Also as St John's wood etc is more built up are there things fr the kids to do? Local parks, indoor play centres, kids classes like music, dancing, soccer etc in the area and am I likely to meet other like mums in the area?

Thanks,
Janet

You will be very very safe in St John's wood. The high street is very posh. The American school is there and you can trust the americans to pick a safe spot.
It's affluent so if you have the budget definitely go for it!!
There are quite a few of the bigger red brick mansion blocks that remain quite affordable and deliver a bit more space.

Stretching west of St John's wood tube is the poshest bit of maida vale.
Maida vale and it's garden squares is lovely as described but s*t for transport tbh.

Down the road from St J W is regent's park and lots to do for kids.

Couple of streets east is primrose hill and the likes of kate moss/Kate winslet in the playground.
A short walk further is very quirky/sometimes dodgy Camden.

A couple of bus stops north is the very cosmopolitan shopping/leisure hub of finchley road. Lots of free kids playgroups in community centres as well as all the usual gymborees etc)
North of that ( that a 10mn bus ride from St John's wood tube) is the jewish community of Golders green with fab. food shops
West hampsted (area around compayne gardens is great with red brick split townhouses with little gardens). Finchley road tube station is next after stjw.

Buses 13/113 take you south into oxford street in 10mn and north to finchley road in 10 mn
274 goes to hide park in 20mn

I am just a sucker for regents park you can tell.I lived south ( marylebone village ) and north (St J W) and thoroughly recommend it.

as for tube journey sjw-canary w DH confirms 25 mn

One last piece of advice, wherever you go avoid the big estate agent whose name starts with F like the plague. Their rentals are always outrageously inflated (trust me I almost used them as a landlord).

Have to disagree with Slim re transport in Maida Vale. I found the tube to be v handy, excellent bus services and its about a 10 min walk to Paddington Station for the Heathrow Express (V useful if you travel for work).
Agree, that Regent's Park is brill to have on the doorstep as is Hyde Park.
From MV you can walk along the canal into Regents Park, which is lovely, or you can catch a barge to the zoo.
The thing I found most different about London is that even in the nicest areas there are big council housing developments so until you actually turn up and look at a place you can't see if it's in a lovely leafy boulevard or sitting opposite the local crack dealer/dog fighting ring.
Still, JSW and MV are both good places to start your search.

Thanks. What is the traffic like in SJW, Maida Vale, Regents Park? I imagine that I'll need to drive my son to school on occasions, and grocery shopping etc.

Its the council developments that concern me, I guess I'll just have to deal with it.

Janet

Hi janet75, I live in Blackheath/Greenwich.

You want to live near your school (especially if it is state in order to fall within catchment) but the bottomline is affordability re: housing.

The good primary state schools in Blackheath (Lewisham council) are as described by MrsJohnCusack. Bear in mind All Saints is Church of England so helps to know the vicar plus regular attendance of course .

The good primary school in Greenwich (Greenwich council) is Halstow. Bear in mind the catchment for all of them are tiny and you really need to live as close as you can to them to jump the waiting lists. I assume you will go on a wait list because you are joining midyear and the good schools are 110% most certainly oversubscribed. The priority on the wait list is (I think) by proximity so you leapfrog anyone on the wait list if you live, say, next door to the school gates. I would suggest renting to do this. As this is London, people always come and go and so there is a chance a vacancy will arise. If you really really want a place, the school advised me to keep close to them ie call them every now and then, speak to the headmistress ...

Check the Ofsted reports for their scores and write up (although Ofsted is not everything):
[http://www.ofsted.gov.uk/ here]]. For private schools, the Good Schools Guide book.

I imagine you would probably put your 4 year old in a less popular private school that has vacancies and on the wait list for a good state school or a 'better' private school. But this gets tricky in terms of where you where to live (assuming you want to be close the school) so renting is not a bad idea for a start and also in the current soft property market.

State secondary schools in Greenwich are generally dire bar one (I am not sure about Blackheath). So unless your dcs can get into the academically competitive grammar schools in nearby Bexley, Bromley and Dartford, which they will have to commute to, you are pretty much looking at private education for secondary.

Between Greenwich and Blackheath, as a broad generalisation, Greenwich is better for transport links to Canary Wharf, because it has the DLR. But Blackheath is generally closer to the good schools, both state (in terms of choice) and private. So you can decide which you prefer. Both would require a bus ride/drive to the Greenwich tube station (1 stop from CW station) so you always have that option from either location but will add at least 20 mins to the commute due to unpredictable traffic. Blackheath only has the mainline train (but a good line) - hence relatively isolated and more villagey. Greenwich has the mainline train and DLR, which brings the tourists, so more edgy and trendy.

I would prefer commuting to Canary Wharf from the south (ie from Greenwich/Blackheath) than from the North (ie from Maida Vale etc). The Jubilee line is jam packed from the north.

Traffic is not too bad by London standards. Get your groceries delivered though. I used my car about once a week in MV. You walk much more in London than in Sydney.
I found parking in SJW harder than in MV, but neither is horrific.

Forgot to add, you can also commute by river boat from Greenwich to Canary Wharf - which is slower and more pricey and scenic and a nice alternative if the DLR/tube fails. Always always plan for public transport failure in London - have fall backs and back ups to fall backs.

Did I mention I have lived in Bayswater (west London, not too far from Nottinghill) and Greenwich/Blackheath. I lived in Bayswater as a single so won't comment much for family living.

But I do absolutely adore Greenwich/Blackheath for a family. You get a house with a garden for much less than you would in Maida Vale or St Johns Wood with good transport connections into Canary Wharf, within 15 minutes of central London on the train and fabulous leisure facilities for families (Greenwich Park, National Maritime Museum, Arches Leisure Centre) and you could not walk 10 feet without bumping into a buggy. People are down to earth and friendly. It is safe (but stay out of neighbouring Lewisham, New Cross etc).

I cannot imagine why more people don't live here. I think it is the mental block of living south of the river - which is fine for me because we are looking to seriously upgrade in the next few years. Before the property market started falling, prices were going a bit dolally down here. So now is a good time to scope out the area if you want to buy in the next year or so.

Are you coming for a few years or is this a permanent move?

Thanks everyone for the responses.

I think that what we are going to have to do is look for schools around the sjw area(s) and Blackheath and Greenwich and then when we arrive check out both areas ourselves.

Unless anyone can suggest another area that we have not thought of that has good transport to canary wharf??

We are moving for 5+ years, so by then I can see it becoming permanent.

Is it a rule that people only use their cars infrequently and generally use public transport or walk? Must be hard to do with a newborn, thankfully were through the stage of having to pack half the house every-time we go out.

I see that not many places apartments or houses have parking as a feature. We will likely get a car anyway for travel on the weekends etc.

Janet

One of my cousins lives in Blackheath (in a lovely house) and she likes it because she is from the Sevenoaks/Tonbridge area originally and can get back down there very quickly. IF you like going to the beach and countryside in the summer, Blackheath is very convenient for the Kentish Weald (beautiful, prosperous villages and countryside) and the absolutely stunning sandy beach at Camber. Basically the whole of the Kent/Sussex border is great for weekends.