Moving to Germany

[XelaM]

I'm originally from Eastern Europe and throughout childhood my parents moved quite a lot, but eventually settled down in Germany where I spent my teenage years and finished school. I've then moved to London for university and ended up staying for over 20 years. However, I've always regretted leaving Germany and my parents behind and have wanted to move back for awhile.

Things have been going pretty rubbish for us in the UK recently and I want to move back to Germany pretty much asap. My parents and best friend are in Germany and I miss them. Plus, my parents are not getting any younger and I want to be closer to them.

However, I have a teenage daughter who is going into year 11 and although she's a German citizen (because of me) she doesn't speak German. She would have to try to get into an international school (only one feasible option where my parents live) and do the IB instead of A-levels, make new friends etc. Although she's fully onboard with the move, I'm nervous about her settling in and learning the language, making new friends. Although they plan has always been for her to go to uni in Germany (as it's free!).

The added complication being that we have 3 horses that she's competing on in the UK, and we would need to find a new yard/trainer/break into a completely new circuit etc etc. All a big worry!

Of course I will need to find new work (I may be able to continue working remotely from Germany, but probably will need to find a new job in Germany especially to get state health insurance).

Anyway, has anyone moved to Germany from the UK recently and has any wisdom to offer?

Not from the UK living in Germany, from a third country and lived in both the UK and Germany, the latter recently.

I would say it varies massively where in Germany you go! Are you going to Berlin, North-Rhine-Westphalia, Bavaria? Big city or small town?

@Zezet Thank you - we're going to NRW (Dusseldorf/Cologne) area

The first thing to check is whether the international school has places in the year group in question. You need to check with your employer if you are allowed to continue to work from Germany remotely and the (tax) implications that has. At one point your employer will be seen as a "german employer" and they may not be happy about this! What about your partner/husband?

Not lived there. I love Germany and its people, but I was truly shocked at how bad their railway system was when I last visited. I wonder if it is indicative of a general malaise to be concerned about.

Most bachelor degrees in Germany are taught in German (there are masters programmes in English but few state university bachelor programmes) and your daughter will need to prove C1 German proficiency aas well as have at least three languages (i.e. English plus two others) and maths on her year 13 qualifications. So moving to Germany sooner rather than later is important if attending free university in Germany is important to you.

On the other hand private school for three years will cost you more than three years of "home" university fees in the UK.

The private international school pupils I know who speak English at home learn German as a foreign language at school but often don't achieve native speaker German/ C1 even after five years, so she'll need to be integrated outside school into a local native German friendship group to boost her language skills if genuine near native fluency by university age is a goal (perhaps the horses will be a way in, but avoid English dominated enclaves).

Making friends at international school should be okay as there's a lot of movement, but some can be cliquey so not having a choice of alternative schools to move to is a worry.

I wonder whether you've thought the finance of paying private school fees through though as you're worried about qualifying for state health insurance and free university and not being relocated by an employer. International school is generally very, very expensive for the older school years and most pupils are paid for by a parent's employer as part of an "expatriate" contract negotiated or offered as part of a recruitment or relocation package.

@SunriseOver Thank you, that's very helpful. Just on the point of school fees - my daughter is currently at a private school in the UK and the cost of the international school in Germany (we know the school as my brother is an alumni) is significantly cheaper than her current school. Online school is also an option (much cheaper) but I'm not keen on that for lack of socialisation reasons.

I have friends' kids who ho attended German universities and took an extra year to learn the language (a foundation year of sorts - will need to look into this further as the C1 German proficiency sounds difficult). There's an English-language program at the university in Osnabrueck I believe, but of course if she spoke German the choice would be much wider.

Can you not just hang on a couple of years until your daughter has finished school in the UK? It's maybe not ideal but it seems the least disruptive option. Make more visits to Germany in the meantime?

I agree with @butterfly1234 .

Thank you all 🙏

We've already decided to let my daughter finish Year 11 in the UK, as anything else would have been too disruptive, and we might also look into boarding colleges for 6th form to let her complete A-levels (my daughter's preferred option). I'm looking into this as the cost of boarding schools with equestrian facilities are insane, but there may be some very limited cheaper alternatives.

She won't be able to get into a German university with A levels because they are too specialised - have a look at the entry requirements and you'll see she'll need more breadth including but not limited to English plus two foreign languages and maths. International baccalaureate is the only option in England.

This sounds off to me, as in my Abitur I didn't have to study 2 foreign languages. My daughter speaks another foreign language other than English fluently and could take it at A-level, but not two. In any event, I believe there is a foundation year you can do if your school leaving qualifications are not deemed eligible. I will make further enquiries.

You do need two foreign languages for the full abitur now, if you don't have the full one it limits which university you can attend and what you can study. What does she want to do at uni?

Yep - you need German, English and one additional foreign language on your year 13 Zeugnis (speaking multiple languages is irrelevant if you didn't study them at school and right through to the end) for allgemein Abitur.

With only one foreign language you can only get a Fachverbünden Hochschulreife (for specific subjects at a university of applied science, not general university entrance).

Yes, you can do a year of Studienkolleg to make up missing subjects before university if your qualifications aren't accepted, but it would be an odd choice if you know years in advance that you want to go to a German university to take exams which don't qualify you for admission and plan to have to do an access course. Studienkolleg is taught in German and will offer German to C1 for university entrance - be careful if you pick one of the few taught in English as it'll be private and very few private ones prepare students for the exams accepted for entry to (free) state universities, but rather for fee paying private universities.

It's good you've decided to stay and let your daughter finish year 11. The school system here is brutal and it's not the same country it was 15 years ago (when I first came here). Kids are falling behind because their German isn't good enough these days. And the pressure on the kids here is extreme (especially in Bavaria, where I am). Maybe look into it when your daughter has finished school?

@CatchTheWind1920 Thank you. We would be going to NRW, so less strict than Bavaria. Everything is up in the air at the moment. The plan was to finish Year 11 and then either try to get into the international school in Neuss for IB or online school like Kings InterHigh for A-levels, but my daughter is now telling me she would prefer to board in the UK for sixth form, so we're looking at some boarding colleges at the moment. All very messy 🤦‍♀️

Is Uni in the Netherlands an option? Many courses taught in English and low fees, e.g. https://www.fontys.nl

The Netherlands are so close to NRW, is a move there an option instead? The border area is green and horsey.

I found the Netherlands much friendlier. Currently in Germany, but looking to leave. The country has changed a lot in the past decade and there is now a noticeably sad undercurrent of racism.