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Am I mad to move to France while pregnant?

64 replies

Anonymous111 · 07/03/2022 10:24

Hi everyone

Would so appreciate anyone’s advice.

We are in a unique situation where we could potentially move to France for between 12 and 15 months. My husband would keep working for his London-based company, and I would be on maternity leave from my London-based company. We have a daughter who would be 2 1/2 years old, and we would aim to move when I’m six months pregnant. Unfortunately it would not be possible to move any earlier due to work.

The idea that we’ve come up with is to live somewhere like Bordeaux or Lyon, set up my husband can commute back to London maybe once a month for meetings, and we would really enjoy the French lifestyle and finally finally learn proper French.

I’m very much aware that the admin is going to be a nightmare. My Hope is that one of our HR teams will help us with some of the paperwork at least.

My question is, to what extent am I absolutely bonkers to try and do it while I’m six months pregnant? I’m mostly concerned about getting into the French system to deliver the baby. I have an EU passport but no french paperwork . Online forums that I’ve researched say things like most French women register with a gynaecologist in a hospital within days of finding out they are pregnant, and because of the way the system works I would not be able to do this until I am six months pregnant.

Does anybody have any experience of moving to France while pregnant without all the paperwork established.

Does anybody know of any ways to streamline the admin process before you move? As I said we might be able to get our HR teams to help us

We very much feel like this is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity because of various factors including our children being young, my husband being able to work from home as a hangover from Covid for a period of time, and my being on second maternity leave. We feel like if we don’t do it now, we won’t be able to do it.

Thank you so very much for anyone’s suggestions

OP posts:
FinallyHere · 08/03/2022 18:01

DM who moved around quite a bit as a trailing spouse used to reassure new arrivals that 'the first year doesn't count', that is to disregard the first year of living in a new country, before deciding whether it is for you.

I'm afraid you might be underestimating the impact of disrupting your existing snd potential new networks.

It might not happen for everyone, but lots of mothers make lifelong friends at baby glasses, NCt etc courses. Even if you do manage to meet people at the same stage as you are at, you will be planning to leave them all behind in a year or do.

Do not underestimate the impact that will have on your networks.

If your baby is an easy one, you may be lonely and not building good networks. Imagine if this one is a bit refluxy and you are alone in France with a baby that cries day and night. And a toddler.

I've been very happy moving around places. I hope you find the thing that works for you.

Anonymous111 · 09/03/2022 11:19

Thanks so much everyone.

It sounds like nobody thinks this is a good idea. This is quite a surprise to me!

It would be one thing if we were leaving a network of friends and family in London, but we have no family here and although we have friends we hardly see them. So for me for a year of living abroad it feels like the logistics although they will be very painful, will be outweighed by an opportunity to live somewhere new and interesting, but it seems like everyone agrees that’s an overtly romantic idea

You have all broken my heart 💔

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thisplaceisweird · 09/03/2022 11:32

Unfortunately moving abroad is a romantic idea in theory - ask anyone who's done it and they'll say what a challenge it was even for people with a network, job set up and language skills.

Maybe in a few years?

Erinyes · 09/03/2022 12:01

@Anonymous111

Thanks so much everyone.

It sounds like nobody thinks this is a good idea. This is quite a surprise to me!

It would be one thing if we were leaving a network of friends and family in London, but we have no family here and although we have friends we hardly see them. So for me for a year of living abroad it feels like the logistics although they will be very painful, will be outweighed by an opportunity to live somewhere new and interesting, but it seems like everyone agrees that’s an overtly romantic idea

You have all broken my heart 💔

What exactly is it that you see yourself doing during that year? What kind of activity/location/daily life attracts you? What do you mean by 'enjoy the French lifestyle'?

I say this as someone who has moved around internationally a fair bit, and used to live in Paris, but without children, and a very long time ago, and already with good French, so I'm not of the 'same shit, different country' philosophy I so often see here.

However, what strikes me in your posts is that your husband works 8 am till 10 pm daily and at the weekend is too tired to do anything but nap and take your older child for a walk?

That just sounds to me like you, heavily pregnant and with a small child, dealing with connecting utilities and other bureaucracy, leading a potentially very isolated life in a language you don't speak well. That sounds in many if not most ways like a less attractive version of your current life -- and I get how isolating London can be, when your friends are too scattered to see easily and you have a baby.

If your DH is unavailable 5 days a week from 8 am to 10pm, who will look after the children while you take French classes and have any kind of lifestyle at all outside the house?

I think it would be different, and I'd be far more likely to say 'Go for it' if it weren't for the fact that from what you say, your husband is really only available at times when you will probably both want to be asleep, if he worked compressed hours over fewer days and you could travel a lot and explore France.

Anonymous111 · 09/03/2022 12:52

@thisplaceisweird

Thanks - we’ve done it before we moved from Australia to U.K. 10 years ago.

A few years from now won’t work as I said this is a kind of a once in a lifetime chance. In a few years our kids will be in school…. 😞

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thisplaceisweird · 09/03/2022 12:55

I actually don't think it's a terrible idea to do it while they're in school, at least while they're young (under 10). Kids are so resilient, just throw them into school - would be tricky at first but they'd pick it up and they'd grow up bilingual. Also means you could make friends with mums.

I know a few families who've done this across Europe and has gone well.

botharna · 09/03/2022 12:59

Can you do it for say a season - head off for the summer / spend the winter in a ski resort ? It's the giving birth and being a full time resident while working for a third country that I think are the main challenges.

Anonymous111 · 09/03/2022 12:59

@Erinyes

Thanks for taking the time to post!

Good question. As it stands husband has become obsessed with work - partially due to covid demands. His view is he wants to try bringing more balance into his life ie finishing earlier. He will currently work while keeping eye on monitor if I go out after bedtime and has no issues doing this. Once baby 2 hits 3-4 months I can’t see it being a problem even if he did keep his current hours which he swears not, or at least if it is once we will deal with.

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Anonymous111 · 09/03/2022 13:01

@thisplaceisweird

Really? Very good to know.

Our situation is we are currently renting so easy to move & I’ll be on mat leave. My company has a firm no overseas work policy but would make an exception for mat leave.

Again done huge amounts of thinking and it feels like the stars align now… just a question of whether it’s worth it in general rather than timing

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Anonymous111 · 09/03/2022 13:01

@botharna sigh I wish. That would be great but we have to give up our London house ( rental).

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Oriunda · 10/03/2022 14:25

Can’t comment on the pregnancy side, but I moved to Paris this year with my EU husband. Got to run for school now, but happy to give you an idea of what’s needed for your (UK?) husband as he will need some paperwork doing/putting together both before and after the move. Plus my thoughts on our move.

miltonj · 10/03/2022 14:31

Honestly, I wouldn't. I'm almost half way through my pregnancy living in an EU country and because of all the ridiculous red tape in the system, I haven't managed to get on the system yet even though I'm fully entitled to it. It's incredibly stressful and worrying. Have gone private so far. Not France but things will be similar I imagine. Husbands HR department did very little to help us become residents and there was hours spent outside in the rain with a toddler outside the police station in the immigration line. Your EU passport will certainly make it a bit easier though (assuming it's not a British one).

rifling · 10/03/2022 14:41

It sounds like nobody thinks this is a good idea. This is quite a surprise to me!
I say go for it! You only live once, so why not? It's not like you're selling up and burning your bridges. Why not give it a go? And I think it definitely would help you to learn French. Quite fancy it myself, actually.

NaerDoWell · 10/03/2022 14:45

I wouldn't do it - I moved to Paris for 2 years to work for the uk arm of my employer - oh my word the burocracy, jumping through hoops and sheer length of time it took to get anything done (electricity, rent, phone, bank account...) would put me off ever going back again! And that was as a single person with support from my company- I imagine with a new baby and toddler it would be v difficult and time consuming. And then you'd have to unpick it all when you leave - it was even difficult to close down accounts and pay final bills!

And despite me speaking v good French, being friendly and joining lots of groups, going to parties etc it was hard to make friends and I was v lonely. I thought that was just Paris or me but English friends who live in other parts of France have also struggled.

ouch321 · 10/03/2022 14:57

How much time have you spent there? Have you been there on holiday at least? Sorry if I've missed that as speed reading.

Whatever you do, don't rely on watching Emily in Paris as being a good depiction of French life and what you'd be buying in to.

I lived there a while when younger, not sure I'd do it in your circumstances.

MintMocha · 10/03/2022 15:02

Is it legal for your DH to still use NHS services if he's not a resident? I'd be a little surprised.

And what about you? Private health care may not cover everything if things go wrong; what happens if the baby has health needs when it's born that require specialist care, long term support etc - would you want to be in the UK system to start getting that all set up, and would that be possible if they find out you'd been living abroad? Would you easily be able to come back immediately if you needed to for the baby's needs - you'd have to find a new rental, change your jobs back etc? Hopefully none of it would be needed, but worth checking out.

Is it definite your DH could work there without an EU passport, and does the fact that you're pregnant have any bearing on that - could they think that you are doing it for the sake of citizenship, for example? (i've no idea if being born in France gives anyone any advantages, but it does in some countries). Also with your own country/UK - are you also British? Does having a child abroad, if you are not, change anything about their citizenship? (probably not if your DH is British). Does it change anything about the child's status in your own country, depending on where it is born and how it's registered?

I think going when children are small is a better idea - they'll be involved in schools/nurseries, and can learn French easily; you'll have people to talk to as a result of their activities, and it's not that hard to slot back into school here, even after a year or two abroad. Harder at secondary school, but primary is much easier to adjust, and being bilingual is a big advantage. If you have no ties to a particular location, you might be able to find the schools you want and have spaces, rather than being dependent on places coming up - although I think that is easier in London anyway with greater amounts of churn.

Anonymous111 · 10/03/2022 15:33

@Oriunda

Thank you very much for your kind offer – I’d really like to hear your thoughts on your move!

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Anonymous111 · 10/03/2022 15:35

@miltonj

Oh my word that does sound horribly stressful, I am so sorry. My friend said that her company organised for her to have regular appointments with the police, but that didn’t involve lengthy queues or standing out in the rain.

Yes I have an EU passport, not a British one. I’m not British and neither is my husband.

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Anonymous111 · 10/03/2022 15:36

@ouch321

Good question – I think I’ve been close to a dozen times in the last 10 years? Both for work and pleasure in Paris, and then travelling around Lyon/Cannes/Champagne etc.

I really disliked Emily in Paris it’s so wanted to love it. It was such a shame that they made it that way. By the way have you watched the agency? It is absolutely excellent and it’s on Netflix

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Anonymous111 · 10/03/2022 15:44

@MintMocha

Such good questions thank you so much for taking the time.

If something went wrong, we would come back to the UK if we needed to in a heartbeat.

We have friends we could stay with, worst case scenario we would hire an Airbnb, and we have savings behind us in case of an emergency.

You are right that I don’t think my private health cover would extend maternity services, but the French healthcare system is world-renowned. If there was a problem I can imagine not being able to speak French to a high enough standard to understand doctors would be extremely stressful, and we would come back to the UK immediately. We also have several doctor friends who I would rely on for verbal support.

I absolutely think you and other posters are completely right going when the children are a bit older is a much much better idea. The problem is the only way we could do that is if I took time off work unpaid ( my work wouldn’t allow it - they will bend the no work abroad rule as I’m on mat leave) and quite frankly that becomes a very very expensive exercise.

As I said it kind of feels like it’s now or never scenario, but then now scenario does seem quite hard.

What I’m looking at is whether I can hire an Airbnb for say a year. Apparently other people have done this to avoid the nightmare of setting up electricity and water etc @NaerDoWell talks about. And I can now set up a bank account from the UK, it takes like a month, but at least I can do it from abroad with eg HSBC. So it’s still going to be a huge pain, but it’s possible to make it slightly easier.

I just went for a lunchtime walk in my area, and I was reminded again how the are near me is quite grim and polluted and ugly. Pounding the pavement and going to our local park for my year on maternity leave is seeming really unappealing right now when this is an option.

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eurochick · 10/03/2022 16:00

I had the same concern as @MintMocha - as a non-UK resident your husband is not likely to be entitled to NHS care.

I've moved countries a couple of times, including to France to study. Even with the support of the university, the bureaucracy was quite hard to navigate. The French make few allowances for English speakers so if you are not confident in French negotiating the bureaucracy plus accessing maternity care would be tough.

TwoBlondes · 10/03/2022 16:19

I moved to France before Brexit and it took eighteen months to get in the healthcare system....

Woollystockings · 10/03/2022 16:32

A friend of mine took two years to get into French healthcare system. -went before Brexit. Was eventually given the card/permit/whatever you get the week after he’d returned permanently to the U.K.

Oriunda · 10/03/2022 16:43

This is the sort of thread I found very useful when we planned our move to France, so I’m typing this here as opposed to a private message. Apologies for the length!

Okay, so dealing with actual practicalities first, you already know that being an EU resident you don’t need to worry about visa etc. Your husband having an EU spouse is entitled to a carte de sejour (CDS) which is his permission to stay. This will involve several trips to the local prefecture to queue/apply etc. There will be certain papers he needs to put together, some of which should be gathered whilst you are still in the UK, for eg certified copies of his birth certificate and your wedding certificate; for your child you should obtain for them a copy of the certificate if born in the UK. I’m not sure what country you’re from, but many EU countries can issue an ‘act of birth’ certificate which is often in the home language and also in French (I got one for my son who was born in the UK but his father is EU).

Health - French healthcare system is excellent (so much so that husband didn’t get private healthcare included as part of the French contract). Appointments for doctor/dentist/pharmacy can be booked online via Doctolib app, even before you have your Carte Vitale. You will need a French bank account to apply for your CV. Your child can go on your card. Your husband will need to apply for his once he has his account and also his CDS.

Does your husband have settled status in the UK? If so, he’s still entitled to NHS treatment, as long as you don’t stay away more than 5 years.

Tax - as you say, you won’t get double taxed (that only happens after you’ve been in France for five years) so the tax situation is not going to be an issue.

A bank account can be opened up really quickly; I got mine opened within a couple of days of having moved to our rented property. You do need an address, so your idea of basing yourself in an Airbnb is not a bad idea, especially to start with. I opened mine with Credit Agricole Brit line, which is specifically for English-speaking people and it’s very easy. In the meantime Starling bank is a UK phone/app-based bank; you can open an account within half an hour and they have a very handy euro section where you use your phone contactless app to pay for things in euros even before a debit card arrives (absolute lifesaver for me for the first couple of weeks). Apply for this whilst still in UK so that you have the debit card (which you can use to pay for things in both £ and €). Fees are very low for converting £ to € and there are no subsequent fees for paying in €.

On to the less practical side by very important friendships etc …

People are right to say that you won’t pick up much French during the amount of time you’re planning to be there. You’ll get a little bit by watching TV, going to supermarket/going out for dinner etc, but not really much more than that. Your child will start school at three years (maternelle) so she will pick up some French. In fact it’s a good age for her to learn French but unless you keep it up when you return to the UK, she’s not really going to maintain it. You might meet some parents at the school gates perhaps if your child makes friends, but a lot of French parents work, and you’ll notice a lot of nannies around (plenty of Chinese nannies here in Paris). The friends I’ve met so far have mostly been expat; it’s just the way it is. Facebook groups are your friend. Search for ones in the areas you’re interested in, and ask questions. That is where I got my initial info from.

Talking of towns, bear in mind the logistics. I am in the western suburbs of Paris and it’s lovely; very handy for central Paris for my husband and best of all the Eurostar back to London is so much more convenient than having to fly. Paris also has a lot of activities and groups, particularly during school holidays. French parents believe in lots of activities and holiday clubs (stages) abound, often starting at 3yrs.

If you don’t want to be lonely, I do suggest you look for towns with expat communities/international schools/active English-speaking Facebook groups. I’ve met some nice French women, but they too are expats whose children are at the international schools. Realistically you’ll be looking for women who don’t work and who are free in daytime for meet ups and play dates.

To summarise, it’s doable, as long as you treat it as an adventure and a chance to experience another lifestyle/culture, and choose the area carefully.

Oriunda · 10/03/2022 16:54

Oh, and for pregnancy-specific info, get on the local Facebook pages. You’ll be able to get recommendations for hospitals, English- speaking gps, midwives etc. Another reason to choose your area carefully.