Struggling hard –really need a hand hold.

[monsterastuckiosa]

Name changed because this feels particularly tender.

I left the UK in 2011 and spent a few years travelling, living in different countries for 6-8 months at a time.

Then in 2016 I arrived in the Spanish islands where I now live, intending only to stay for a few months as usual. But I was tired of travelling, and ended up staying longer, and longer. I met my partner, and this year I moved into what's basically a dream of a house. I adopted a dog. To look at my life from the outside you'd think I had it made.

But I'm not happy here. There's no culture. Bureaucracy is a nightmare and people's mentality is really "if it takes effort, I can't be bothered". There's a cultural laziness and "as long as I'm OK" attitude that's really hard to be around.

There's a very transitory population – lots ofpeople coming and going, and even of the people here permanently, I've struggled to make friends. I've been here 4 years and I only have 2 people I consider real friends –people I'm happy and proud to know, and who I feel stretched and loved and challenged by.

I know long-term if I stay here I'll wither away –and I'm only 33.

But my partner is from here and has a 14 year old daughter who lives here, and despite him 'in an ideal world' really wanting to leave (he's sick of a lot of it too), he can't. Which means if I want to stay with him, I can't.

I went on an ex-pat 'supermarket' website last night – the kind where you can order British stuff when you live overseas. I looked at a picture of a tub of Paxo and suddenly just found myself sobbing. Paxo, for Christ's sake! It's not Paxo I miss, it's the familiarity of it.

I miss belonging. I miss just KNOWING what things are and how to navigate them. I miss being able to make jokes about Wotsits or Neil Buchanan and people knowing what the hell I'm talking about. I miss things feeling effortless. I miss decent customer service.

I don't want to move back to the UK, I don't think – the darkness and cold used to make me feel so low. But I don't know where else I'd even go –if I left here now, I'd be starting completely from scratch again, completely alone, with no guarantee of being any happier.

I have everything I should want - a lovely partner, a beautiful house, a great job, a wonderful dog... but I'm miserable.

I'm just so fucking sad and I don't know what to do.

Where are you?

It seems to me like you're feeling down but blaming the wrong things.

"I've been here 4 years and I only have 2 people I consider real friends –people I'm happy and proud to know, and who I feel stretched and loved and challenged by."
That doesn't sound bad to me - that is a very high bar for what counts as a real friend. Two friends like that, a partner and a circle of good acquaintances is good going for most people.

"I miss belonging. I miss just KNOWING what things are and how to navigate them. I miss being able to make jokes about Wotsits or Neil Buchanan and people knowing what the hell I'm talking about. I miss things feeling effortless. I miss decent customer service.

I don't want to move back to the UK, I don't think – the darkness and cold used to make me feel so low. But I don't know where else I'd even go –if I left here now, I'd be starting completely from scratch again, completely alone, with no guarantee of being any happier."

I really think you're looking through rose tinted specs. You want the familiarity, but not the crap sides of the UK.

I think sometimes we imagine that we will be happy once we tick X, Y and Z boxes, and then have a kind of crisis when we get it and are still not happy. Then we go looking elsewhere - but elsewhere will have its own disadvantages. This has been a tough year for everyone, it's not surprising you're feeling miserable. Can you work on small things that would make you happier? You wouldn't have moved abroad in the first place if you weren't inspired by that - can you try and reconnect with some of the things you love?

But what are the right things to blame, then?

Because after 4 years of trying really bloody hard, the right things had better not be 'my attitude'. I cannot spend any longer beating myself up for not trying hard enough. It shouldn't be this hard. And I really don't mean that to come across as snippy – I know you're trying to help. I'm just so tired of trying to 'stick it out' and 'make the best' and 'put the effort in'. At some point, surely, you have to accept that maybe something's just not right?

This isn't just about this being a tough year. It's about the 'small things' not balancing out the rest, no matter how hard I try. And there's no 'circle of acquaintances', either – I literally have 2 people I could call if I wanted to go out for a drink or to hang out.

I'm living on a small tourism-focused island where there's very little going on even outside of COVID times. It's a backward-thinking cultural deadzone, where people come on holiday and think "gosh I'd love to live here" but have no idea of the reality of what it's like.

And it's honestly not about thinking the UK's great, either –I know it can be a ballache of a place. You're right, I did leave for a reason. But after 9 years of living in multiple countries that aren't my own, I'm tired of feeling like I never belong. Everything's always that little bit harder, and more confusing.

I don't want to be one of those posters who just won't listen to the advice they asked for – but it does feel more complex than a matter of rose-tinted specs.

I think you need a plan. Where do you see yourself in 5 and 10 years time? (not physically but job, relationship, DC etc).

Unfortunately it doesn't sound like where you are is going to get any better.

And its a really shit time to move countries even if you did know where to go.

What job do you do? Can you do some online studying to move into another sector?

I love abroad and totally get the lack of cultural references- especially from childhood. My kids are going through the local school system and it is sooo different to what I did.

I reckon it takes 10 years to fully settle in to a place. It takes time to really get to know people, and get through the different stages of culture shock (which isn't always apparent) and accept a place for what it is.

Besides - you're only down the road - fly back for a month or two - in winter. Get a feel for what it's really like. You're lucky to have such nice choices.

I left the UK in 1988 and moved back to Europe in 2010. Believe me it was a shock, and definitely not the place I left in the 80s.

@InvincibleInvisibility I think you're right, I do need a plan. I feel very much like I've spent so long hoping for things to get better that I've fallen into this trap of treading water and focusing on here and now, rather than where I want to get to.

I do enjoy my work, and it's all online (has been for the last 8 years), so that at least is as flexible as it can possibly be and enjoyable, too.

But at least if I had something I was working toward I'd be able to align my choices with that.

@Nandakanda what you said about stages of culture shock is really interesting –what did you notice about that in your experience? What were those stages for you?

You're putting your love life above your actual life. Sometimes we meet someone who seems perfect but he lives in a place that we'd never be happy - it makes no sense to stay, in that situation, given there are men in every country in the world we'd be happy with. You have to look at the full picture. If you stay there you won't be happy.

You could move back, have a LDR for four years, until his daughter's 18, and then he could come here. That's one option - could you consider that?

Just Google the four stages of culture shock - it's well documented.

If I remember correctly, the second stage is when you get disillusioned and find everything a chore, which lasted years in my case. After 20 odd years I decided to move back, when I realised I'd finally settled in...

Don't sweat it too much unless it's really pissing you off. Everywhere is a pain to some degree, but it's all good, and it's all part of life's rich tapestry.

You said you miss belonging: UK is the country you have lived the longest so moving to another country will make it even harder and you will have to start again. You also said you miss culture, familiarity, jokes that people can understand, effortless of things. It seems to me you are homesick but don't want to put up with UK weather. Nothing is ever perfect and there is always a compromise/sacrifice you have to make. What is more important to you?

Could you perhaps live in the UK and live the winter months in Spain? It seems that you can work from anywhere; not sure about your partner.

@monsterastuckiosa
I've never posted on mumsnet before, I only joined to be able to reply to you. I found your post while looking through the Living overseas section: we're in a sticky situation ourselves and need help too.

Really I'm just posting to give you a big hug and a hand squeeze. We lived in Spain for nearly 6 god-awful months last year. I've lived in 7 countries now, some for years at a time, and without doubt Spain was the worst place I've been. I understand what you say about the (lack of culture), about the "as long as I'm OK". The laziness and the rudeness blew us away. Nevermind the attitudes toward animals!

People are saying you need to stick it out, etc., but if you're really unhappy, you just are. There's no way round it. Some things may change for the better, but if it's fundamentally not your place, that's just the way it is.

But it's hard, especially with your family situation. I don't know what to tell you, and (given our difficult predicament) I have no advice to give. But just know that I get it. I get wanting to know stuff. I get wanting to understand and be understood. I speak the language of my current country and I wasn't bad in Spanish or one of the other languages where I've lived either, but it's not the same. It's never the same. You always feel like an alien and never feel at home.

And yet ... we don't want to go back to the UK either. So ...

I don't know.

This post is rambling, I'm sorry. I'm not very well at the moment (stress doesn't help!) and so not the most coherent. But my heart went out to you and I just wanted to let you know that you're not alone. I don't know if you can do private messages here, but if you can and you want to, please feel free.

Hugs and care and lots of strength to you.

If you want to stay with your partner you need to know you are on the same page about the medium to long term future. Eg. his partner is 14. In 4 years time will she be going away to university? Could you have a joint plan to travel together and live somewhere else at that stage? Those sorts of conversations will reveal whether you are compatible in the long term. If you can't wait 4 years you need to leave and get on with your life. If he doesn't want to leave in 4 years then you also need to leave now and get on with your life. If you can have a shared vision of the future then investing in this relationship sounds more worthwhile.

@monsterastuckiosa I'm in a similar situation but in France. I really relate to what you're saying - especially about missing belonging and knowing how things work. I don't have any advice in particular but just wanted to let you know I'm in a similar boat!

Have you joined any of the Facebook groups focused on the Islands. It can be a way of connecting and sharing,
This group below covers the EU27. There are only Brits who live in the EU. You may find you have something in common with them. Have a look. It is a private group but you can read the description.
www.facebook.com/groups/704637150153964/?ref=share

Hi there, I could have written this myself, it also sounds as if we might be living on the same island. I came here in holiday and met my DP who worked here, moved over but have never felt at peace here for my of the reasons you describe. I've been here 8 years and the thought of growing old here makes me depressed. I don't know what to do, I'm very much in love with my DP. I feel like it's a no win situation.

Hi OP

I also traveled a lot after uni and then spent a bit more time in a spanish speaking country where I met my partner. I had a fixed contract which meant we had to talk about what would happen when it ended and fortunately he was willing to move back to the UK with me. He is still there but I am in the UK applying for the spouse visa. We’ve been apart for a year now and its been hard but there was no way I could stay there. Like you said, people were unfriendly, there was only a drinking and dancing culture, stray animals treated appallingly, lack of green space, so much corruption etc. Towards the end my mental health wasn’t good.

When I left UK at first I thought anywhere else was more exciting and I hated the weather but being in that place made me appreciate the UK more and now I love it here. I even love the crazy weather because it’s what makes our country so green and I love how people have so many interests and are quite quirky but kind.

You need to talk to your partner and make sure he understands how you feel. Maybe you can reach a compromise as suggested by other people here or maybe not. If not then you can explore your options and find a place that makes you happy. Where that is only you can decide! Feel free to PM if you want x

It sounds as though there are fundamental things about where you live which you are never going to come to like or accept. It also sounds as though nothing will fill the 'not belonging' gap for you except living in the UK. Yes, there are downsides to the UK like there are downsides to any country, but those other countries won't have any of the little (or big) thinks that make you feel you truly belong.

I've never lived overseas except for 8 months as part of my language degree. The feelings you describe about belonging are the reasons why, in spite of being a linguist who really enjoys using my languages abroad, I have never wanted to live anywhere other than the UK. Having cultural references, experience and language in common with the people you spend every day with is just something I wouldn't ever want to be without. Only you can decide if that's worth ending your relationship over, if your partner truly cannot move with you.

Feel free to pm me op if you would like to chat. It sounds as though we are in the same place.