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Original poster

Laying the ground work... North America

60 replies

WindyMiller1020 · 05/01/2020 00:57

I was looking for help on living and working in North America, either the USA or Canada.

Me and my DH know that we eventually want to leave the UK, no rush to move immediately but we want to start laying the groundwork to open up the option to go.

My DH works in a niche area of IT and I work in marketing. In your experience would the best way to get the visas needed be to get a job at a company that has offices there so that we could then look at transferring?

We'd be happy to look at going on either a shorter secondment or on longer contracts but I'm not really sure how it all works, I've looked quite deeply into Canada and have come across IEC visas but it seems we'd have to apply independently from each other which wouldn't be ideal.

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

OP posts:
Original poster
WindyMiller1020 · 05/01/2020 01:55

@BillieEilish sorry I missed your comments as they are separate, no we dont have any DC - just us two

OP posts:
BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 02:00

I was just being realistic, if you are ruling out the largest province in the country and capital city with no job offer and sponser from the company in a niche job you are going to find it hugely difficult.

IMO. But I hope I'm wrong.

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 02:01

This is as bad as wassap!

Well, that is really in your favour that you don't have DC's (I didn't want to say that before)

Original poster
WindyMiller1020 · 05/01/2020 02:07

Sorry I'm not trying to ask how to move there right now with no job offer. I may have miscommunicated or you may have misunderstood me, but I was asking the best way to open up options to get there in 2,3,5 years, by eg getting a job in the UK at a company that has offices in the US/Canada, and then requesting a transfer, if indeed this is the best way to go about it.

I'm not trying to immediately move with no job offer and get permanent residency or anything like that.

OP posts:
BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 02:13

Oh well if this a long term plan then yes, get a job with ability to transfer that Candians can't do and have the money in the bank and no dependants and leave out Toronto and Quebec province and fingers crossed you'll do it!

I think I thought USA was impossible, but Canada is just as hard, it really is!

Just need to have your eyes wide open and be prepared to really work at it.

Sorry, it's late here and I probably did misunderstand!

bettythebutterfly · 05/01/2020 02:18

You can 'prove' you speak English by having a degree from an English-speaking university. As to PP comments about French, I am quite surprised to hear this. In my experience, the only jobs that you must be bilingual for are in government, unless, of course, it's a requirement for that position. I worked in Toronto for 15 years with no French, and can't think of anyone off the top of my head who used French on a day to day basis in their job (also entered on a spousal visa).

We now live in the US (came in on L1 two years ago, currently have Permanent Residency through Green Cards).

Good luck!

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 02:18

Also, you have to bear in my mind my DH lived and worked in Montreal and Toronto and had done for donkeys years, although I had a job from my company in either Toronto or Montreal, I was totally stuck to Quebec province and Toronto really, I didn't have the option of the rest of Canada.

Plus my job more or less anyone could do if they could speak French!

I had 10 years experience but it was hardly 'niche' Grin

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 02:21

My DH worked in the civil service so maybe that's why? I honestly can't remember too clearly but I 100% needed to prove I could speak French.

But I did, so the point was moot.

Anyway, things change a lot in 10 years.

Original poster
WindyMiller1020 · 05/01/2020 02:22

@bettythebutterfly ah really, if you dont mind answering are you from Canada or did you move to Toronto from the uk? If from the uk did you transfer with your job?

I'm not just looking at canada, the usa would be great too!

OP posts:
bettythebutterfly · 05/01/2020 02:26

I am British, DH is Canadian. We moved with his job each time. He is a very specialized engineer, with PhD and multiple years experience.

Expressedways · 05/01/2020 02:32

Quebec has their own version of express entry that is fairly new but you’re unlikely to get enough points if not fluent in French and English. Not relevant to the OP though since she’s ruled out Quebec but we’re provisionally looking into it as we don’t see ourselves in the US forever, DH is French and we have friends there.

I should add that for the US, your employer needs to have blanket approval to hire foreign workers for it to be a realistic goal- big companies will almost certainly have this, small ones may not. So just something to bear in mind!

bettythebutterfly · 05/01/2020 03:16

I've found Facebook groups useful for finding out more about the process etc (there's a really good Canada to US one, not useful to you Smile but there will be similar for Brits to Canada/America - definitely worth taking a look). And as Billie said, a lot can change in ten years (and one).

The tricky part is securing a job offer. If they really want you, you can then be in a better position to get the visa that allows your spouse to work. For example, we could have come to the US on a TN visa (as a Canadian with a profession in the 'approved' list and a job offer you can basically just show up at the border and be admitted), but I was not willing to come (and therefore neither was DH) unless I could work.

And FWIW, I like where we live in the US, but I'd move back to Canada in a heartbeat.

vivapuff · 05/01/2020 03:19

I'm Canadian. I don't know how the immigration process works but I can confirm the French proficiency is absolutely not required to live comfortably and work in Canada. Lack of French would be a major barrier in Quebec, but most other parts (including Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto), English is the social and work language.

There are some rules around bilingual requirements for government jobs (ie civil servants of a certain rank but have proficiency in both official languages) but this does not extend to the private sector.

In the most recent census, 18% of Canadians were identified as French/English bilingual. It's a great skill if you have it, but not necessary to work in Canada

www.cbc.ca/news/politics/census-family-language-highlights-1.4231841

FlowerArranger · 05/01/2020 03:31

OP
Google Britishexpats. There's a lot of information about immigration there, as well as useful information about living in the US and Canada and things to bear in mind before you emigrate.

crustycrab · 05/01/2020 03:37

This is where these forums can be so misleading when pps are adamant that they are right.

You absolutely do not need to speak French to be able to work in Canada. Nobody I know that works in Toronto speaks French all day or even most days and not speaking French does not rule out working in the capital city, which I'm assuming Billie knows is Ottawa since she doesn't mention it.

Quebec might be the largest province in area in Canada but seriously, it's very small compared to the rest of Canada as a whole.

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 04:05

I did not say you needed to speak French to work in Canada if you are Canadian, but in order to get a VISA to work and live in Canada as an immigrant if you don't have a work sponsor to expedite this. 100% in Quebec you have to speak French to get a visa

I speak French, I was actually highlighting that, despite this and being married to a Canadian and a job offer, without employers help I could still not get a visa.

Why would I bother to lie about my personal experience? As usual posters get nasty about people trying to be helpful and answer a query with their own experience.

Yes, I am adamant I am right, 10 years ago in Quebec which I have made clear WAS 10 years ago, which is helpful to the OP as it rules this province out as other posters attested to also.

This is a big thing and immigration laws could change again. Also, in the private sector elsewhere, it may not be 'obligatory' but for an 'un niche' job they will want you to be able to speak French as an immigrant visa applicant.

A visa application to live and work is not the same as already being a Canadian. I found this out to my detriment and was taking time in giving my experience to OP.

But I married and lived there for 3 years, half my family live there, what do I know?

crustycrab · 05/01/2020 04:09

I'm not Canadian Billie. Nor am I being nasty. I'm pointing out to the op, just as others have that it is not a requirement to speak French.

I'm not suggesting you've lied about your experience, but it's not an accurate picture and people shouldn't be discouraged by it

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 04:21

It's a totally accurate picture in applying for a Canadian visa.

Not a Canadian person, but applying for a living/working visa in Canada. 10 years ago. It may be more lax now, as I keep saying, but I really doubt it.

Niche job, employer support and sponsor. Proof of funds. Ability to speak French and English, the National languages, is a must. For a visa NOT a Canadian citizen. Not for a job. A visa

Anyway, OP good luck. Au revoir. (In Quebec they would say Bonjour... 'have a good day')

crustycrab · 05/01/2020 04:27

Sorry no it's not. This is what you posted

"You will absolutely need to speak French to get a visa for Canada. Sorry.
It is an official language and to work there you will HAVE to speak it."

Several posters, both Canadian and non-Canadian have told of their experience which counters this. It's just not the case! In Quebec maybe. (Why are they saying bonjour to say goodbye btw?) But not across Canada, not even in the bi-lingual New Brunswick.

Good luck OP, it's not as hard as it sounds here!

SiennaSienna · 05/01/2020 04:43

We moved to Canada from the UK 5 years ago. DH received his work permit via express entry and I received a spousal work permit at the same time ( this was negotiated as part of his contract). I have basic French skills but H doesn’t. We live in Ontario and became permanent residents within I5 months and are now Canadian citizens. It’s definitely possible to live and work in Canada without speaking French.
Quebec however, recently introduced Bill9 which makes it a requirement to be fluent in French (high school level, not just conversational French) for both Applicants and their spouses. Bill 9 only applies to the Province of Quebec.

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 05:08

Right, I am clearly not making myself clear in any language!

Sienna thanks for backing me up on the Quebec thing.

Elsewhere in the country however it is different, yes. But your DH had an expedited work visa via his company?

I am talking about and have always been talking about if you don't have/do not have a niche job with company support for the visa

Then, you need all the bells and whistles ie to speak French to get a visa Honestly, obviously in Canada they all speak English. Clearly, to work and live there you do not need to speak French

To get a visa there, without a niche job and reason to be there you do. Because, to their mind, you may end up homeless in a place where you are unable to work.

OP just needs to get a job, a transfer, support from the company for her visa and all will be well.

I think, they will always choose a person to transfer with the most skills needed for that country and OP should brush up on French in order to be a viable candidate for a costly transfer within the company and not limit where she can go. That's all.

Bigredumbrella · 05/01/2020 05:10

Quebec may be different but you definitely dont have to speak french to get a visa, permanent residence or Canadian citizenship. There is a lot of paperwork inc labor market statement showing that there isn't a Canadian that can do the job your coming to do.

BillieEilish · 05/01/2020 05:16

I had to send photos of my wedding! I kid you not, a scene out of 'Green Card' the film. I had to explain why only some of my family were there.

barmyarmy1 · 05/01/2020 05:25

You won't get a US work visa unless you or your partner are working in a UK company (that has a US presence) that can sponsor you for an L visa - proving specialized or management skill. Then you can move across as a transferee. I've just done it and it's an onerous process. But moving here and looking for work isn't really an option as far as I can tell. Even an H1B will require an offer. Good luck though, Canada might be more straightforward.

crustycrab · 05/01/2020 12:20

I believe you Billie about your experience. In Quebec. I didn't disagree about Quebec but you were talking about Canada. OP has confirmed she's not considering Quebec.

Repeatedly different posters have told you that you do not need to speak French to get a visa, niche job or not in the majority of Canadian provinces.

Browsing through the living overseas forums I see that you had a terrible experience in Canada, the most boring place you've lived with rude and unwelcoming people apparently. You were corrected on the French thing there too. Maybe this experience is skewing your answers slightly.