How to get a job abroad?

[ThousandCows]

DH and I both spent time living abroad as children and would like to give the same opportunity for our DCs. Since he is more senior in his job, and more ambitious, it seems to make sense to try and use his career to get us somewhere.

He's in a competitive industry, but I think he's pretty good at his job (hopefully not too biased). He's been applying for roles since around July, and I believe they're decent applications, but he's not even had the smallest nibble.

Speaking to a friend who's just returned from SE Asia, it seems that you either have to get yourself out there and THEN apply (not an option with two small children, mortgage, etc) or you have to know the right people in the right places.

Wise folk of MN, is that the case? Any advice would be much appreciated

Does the company your DH works for now have overseas offices? Often an internal transfer is the easiest thing to organise. Otherwise I would suggest he talks to agencies specialising in his industry to see if they deal with overseas positions.

The right to work in another country is the biggie. Have a think about which countries you would ideally like to live in and research from there.

Hi Snows, thanks for your response. Nope, unfortunately an internal transfer isn't an option. He also doesn't work in an industry that really uses agencies - I'll double-check though, in case there's something.

We're not being too picky about where we go, really. Ruled out applying for opportunities in India and China based on air quality indices (our DCs are only 3 & 1). I won't go the States at the moment for various reasons (!) and don't fancy Aus/NZ but would quite like to do a stint somewhere in SE Asia...

I (perhaps wrongly) assumed that if you were successful in applying for a job somewhere, the company would then be able to 'sponsor' you/sort out a visa or your right to work... If that's not the case then we need to go back to square one and start again!

Try and imagine how many people apply for the jobs and how many people from abroad pull out because they change their mind. Applying from abroad seems very unlikely that he’d get a job.

Does he have a skill set which isn’t available from more local employees? When I’m recruiting additional members for our team, I look at the local employment market first.

Really depends on the skillset. We got jobs in Dubai in Real Estate Investment and HR (though i’ve since retrained) just by sending CVs to local recruitment agencies. It was some time ago. The easiest way to work abroad always seems to be teaching!

Sorry that should also say that we were still in London at the point of applying

Hi
We've just come back from a 4 year stint abroad in Dubai and Australia. In both countries I got the job outside the country and and then my employer sorted visas etc. The first job in Dubai I got via a recruiter advertising in the UK and the second job in Australia came about via a contact I had made.
In terms of regions / countries Dubai is easier to get a job in as there is a strong culture of an immigrant workforce. Countries in SE Asia used to be relatively easy, but in recent years there has been a drive by the Governments to reduce dependance on a foreign workforce in favour of locals. So, for example, in Vietnam and Korea, (both countries I considered taking up opportunities in) employers now have to prove that they are employing a foreign worker only until a domestic worker can be trained up to do the job. Unfortunately protectionism is increasing the world over making it harder to move around but I hope you get the opportunity as it was great!

Interestingly, talking to the recruiter in Dubai relatively few people do pull out before they get there - although some do. They do try and get you out there as quickly as possible though to reduce the chances of cold feet so prepare to panic if you decide to move there!

Parker, I completely take your point. I would say there's probably a limit on what the local employment market can offer, and I would imagine his experience working in the UK sets him apart somewhat. Always worried about revealing too much on MN but he works in journalism - so in an ideal world, hoping for something with one of the major international news agencies.

TheAirbender / Puppy - I lived in the ME as a child for a while and loved it, but since it's not renowned for press freedom I would be a bit hesitant... I work in a field where international jobs seem to be ten-a-penny but I don't think I'm experienced/senior/driven enough to get us abroad using my job. Ironically, I used to teach, but you could not pay me enough to return...

Actually Dubai has thriving local newspapers (e.g. Gulf News) that employ English speakers / journalists almost exclusively. If your DH could cope with covering a fairly lightweight news agenda, it could be an option.
I would, however, counsel against assuming that UK experience is highly regarded in overseas employment markets. In the regions I worked in, local experience was seen as much more important and some employers could react negatively to assumed Brit superiority!

Hi Puppy - apologies, I didn't mean to convey any sort of Anglo-centric superiority/arrogance!!
DH works in broadcasting at a national level, so working on a local newspaper wouldn't really be a step in the right direction for him. I guess we'll just have to keep plugging away with applications and cross our fingers

@ThousandCows teaching in the UAE in a private international school is very, very different to teaching in maintained schools in the UK. Don't rule it out!

I used to work in recruitment and we never looked at applications from people abroad unless there were no other suitable applicants. We generally found that receuiting people who weren't in the country just wasn't worth it as it was more expensive and time consuming and often the candidate dropped out at offer stage as they found they had underestimated the cost of living, relocation expenses or had found a job in their home country. Also tge whole process of organising aa visa can be long and drawn out depending on the country. We only really recruited from abroad in highly specialised roles where there were no candidates available locally.

I've moved abroad a number of times and o nly twice had jobs lined up. The other times I have only been successful in getting interviews once I was in the country.

I (perhaps wrongly) assumed that if you were successful in applying for a job somewhere, the company would then be able to 'sponsor' you/sort out a visa or your right to work..

You really need to look into the sponsorship process for each of the countries you're looking at. It'll vary by country.

Not much point in sending off applications if you don't understand the process that the potential employer will have to go through to hire you/your DH.

I recently relocated to SE Asia with family. Applied for my job from London, but in different industry/ have specialized skills needed for the job not easily found among locals. My advice would be to look also for opportunities in international organizations/ multilateral agencies/ development banks etc, as there are a number of those active in the region and they employ internationally a lot

I think your issue is there will be a massive amount of competition in the fields and areas you're working in. Not the same sector but local experience has become key in my industry. I can't think of the last time we took on an external hire who hadn't already been in the region for years. It happens but the local experience trumps the sake experience from the UK.

I think you need to keep at it but also explore more broadly. Unless he's the level to get headhunted, a job at Reuters probably isn't realistic. I also would expect it's massively about who you know as well. Again different industry but it's rare for us to take someone who's randomly applied to a job advert. If they're in the market and good we already know them!

As with someone else mentioned don't underestimate teaching in an international school to get a move to the country you want. Very different to UK schools and a lot of active recruitment from UK.
However if you are determined to go off DHs job, he needs to network like crazy with UK based contacts who have overseas contacts. Can he pick up SE Asia oriented stories in his current role? What expertise does he have on region (or if he's a specific area outside general news ie business what expertise does he have in the regional version of that) and if none how can he start developing that?
Different industry but based in SE Asia, we don't recruit from ad hoc interest from overseas or overseas recruitment and would always look for local experience or at least a strong local interest (language, spent time here). It shows more commitment to the region rather than just a place to land for a couple of years then move on.
And just as an FYI nor does my company offer expat packages any more, they might fund relocation but gone are the days of schooling, rent and flights home. So many skilled people are actively looking and willing to work abroad so the incentives don't need to be as generous as before.

Having said that, it may take a bit more effort but it's a great experience for families, good luck!

In my field (teaching) if you are already in the country you are often offered a local (less good) contract/package than those recruited from abroad and relocate ie no annual flights, lower salary

You seem a little bit fussy if I may say so. Teaching is the best way in but as others have said, it won't offer any kind of amazing expat package. Can your dh do his job from anywhere ie; keep his job but live abroad? That might be another way in as you could make local contacts once there. I would imagine broadcast journalism needs local knowledge- unless it's a more technical role in which case he'd need very specialist knowledge to be in demand in SE Asia. In all cases you'll need £££ initially to relocate - it's very expensive.
Try the British Council or look on the ex pat boards here for a flavour of the jobs in demand - seem to be mostly teaching, banking and law.

Thanks everyone for your responses! I think my mention of teaching has given a bit of a red herring - I only did it for a few years, have spent many years since doing something quite different, and it's not a career I'll be going back to! Although I do appreciate it would have offered us more scope for moving abroad. C'est la vie!

somewheredreaming You're definitely right about the competition being an issue. DH obviously lacking in any local experience (in terms of overseas) but that's hard to remedy, so something for us to think about. Need to strike the balance between letting the right people know he's looking, but without getting anyone worried at his current workplace. And it's a small world!

@DarkMutterings No real way of getting any overseas news into his current role, unfortunately, but he does have a specific brief (ie environment, politics, etc) and therefore certain expertise - but no success even in applying for a parallel role overseas... I've told him to up his networking efforts as I think that's the only way he's really going to get anywhere!

@Lightsabre Can't do his current job from abroad, unfortunately. When he becomes a YouTube sensation maybe that'll be an option I hope we're not being too fussy, but will try to broaden our criteria where we can. I only mentioned SE Asia as somewhere that appealed - it's by no means the only place we would go. As long as it's not a warzone, and the numbers stack up, we'll consider most places. At the end of the day, we are happy in the UK, so it's not a case of Must-go-abroad-at-any-cost. Just a 'nice to have' experience if we can manage it