Has Brexit/last year of politics made you change your mind about going home?

[DeliveredByKiki]

We've lived in the US for 4.5yrs. I want to go back to the UK at some point. Last summer I was desperate to move home asap, since then I've started to work again which has helped the feeling is unfulfillment and worthlessness so I'm not in so much of a hurry but still want to go home.

When Brexit happened my immediate impulse was to go home to "my people", like an instinctive need to be muddling in the all the shit together. DH is convinced it's a reason not to move back. Obviously political situation here is even worse - but I just wondered if any of you were thinking of going home in the immediate future and we're now putting plans on hold?

FWIW I'm still planning to us to go back once we have citizenship here....

Before the Brexit vote I had no intention of returning to the UK.
I am making plans to ensure I can stay in my adopted home of Luxembourg.
I am very sad that the Country of my birth has taken this decision.
As many people have said.
"Not all those who voted for Brexit were racists, but all racists voted for Brexit"

might I add regarding the Nuclear Threat - for a fraction of the cost of renewing trident we could build nuclear fall out shelters for the entire population.

Our government doesn't care about protecting us at all

in Switzerland every single house has to be built with a fall out shelter

Lorna and Eleanor The Cold War never really stopped, don't kid yourselves, and all we have done is cut defence. Trident renewal had to be voted on to get the new hulls in the water in time for the current V boats to be phased out. You can't just magic up new bombers in a week; the procurement and build take time.

MAD works for a reason, and if anything, it'll be Iran or N Korea as both are batshit, as opposed to Putin who is not.

Claudia Presumably radiation poisoning would get you eventually. I would rather it was quick.

I slightly doubted what Claudia said was true (sorry Claudia ) so I googled it and got this, in case anyone wants to move to Switzerland and prepare for nuclear war (why are all the post apocalyptic type sci fi series set in America not Switzerland?) :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallout_shelter

Apparently you can leave your shelter for an hour per day after 2 weeks to start the work of sweeping up the radioactive dust from absolutely everywhere, which is nice.

yes although this subject is a bit of a tangent trotz it's the first 48 hours that are the worst, then you can leave your home for minutes/tens of minutes at a time

at the height of the Cold War the only thing our government offered us was a leaflet telling us how to lean a few old doors against a wall with a few bags of potatoes on top and hope for the best.

Meanwhile it was spending many 1000's of times the cost of building adequate fall out shelters on nuclear warheads in our name. /rant

Hi Scaryteacher,

I don't think I'm "kidding"myself about the reality of nuclear weapons or the "Cold War". The fact that political & military tensions are currently extremely strained between Washington US & the Kremlin, is a matter of fact. Frankly there is scope for many dreadful scenarios.

As for the endless arms race i.e "Trident" etc. I don't believe for a moment there can be any "winners" in the aftermath of a nuclear conflict, even a limited one! The real balance of power has shifted & this is causing real concern among the superpowers (& hopefully the public)!

Indeed there are far too many nuclear capable nations. Who poses the biggest threat is a matter of opinion. I'd rather not get too political.

Agreed the idea of "life" after a nuclear war is so grim it would be unbearable! I'm not even sure the biosphere would ever recover.

Lorna I said the Cold War never stopped, my dh has spent all of his career fighting it, so I think I'll take his advice on the likelihood of nuclear war thanks.

Relations between the U.S. a.nd Washington have been at breaking point before, Cuban Missile Crisis, etc and we are all still here. That relationship ebbs and flows.

I would be more concerned about Iran making nuclear weapons on the side, and what N Korea are up to. Putin couldn't have any influence in his 'near abroad' if he'd nuked it.

MAD works, and has demonstrably done so over the last decades.

Hi Scary,

I've never suggested the "Cold War" did stop. The facts speak for themselves. If you are not concerned regarding aggressive Foreign Policy, weapon deployments, and ongoing Kremlin statements, you are deluded.

Stability is being eroded by all the above & there is no assurance that mutual assured destruction, will continue to prevent a conflict. Think about it, there never has been... Why stability is being eroded is another topic all together. I don't want to get in to political specifics.

Despite your claim to having "inside" knowledge, the facts tell a different story... Hopefully there will not be an incident that escalates to a nuclear response. I wouldn't rule it out, nor do I believe the Russian government wants one.

Lorna I think you are deluded. I don't think the UK has an aggressive foreign policy, and I don't think the US actually has a foreign policy as the current POTUS is very good at speechifying but actually doing very little.

Weapon deployments happen all the time, if you are referring to the Russians moving weapons in Kaliningrad recently. It's part of how the military operates. Be it on the back of a truck into Crimea, or on a submarine, or steaming on an aircraft carrier up the channel, or on a fighter jet, weapons need to be moved so they are in position.

The world has never been stable, we just know more about it now with the 24/7 news coverage. As for MAD, the mutual destruction part is why it works...why don't you think about it?, Brehznev, Andropov, Gorbachev all understood that. The Mullahs in Iran probably don't, but I think Israel will soon put them right.

Which 'facts' Lorna? Yours? Where are yours coming from, and why are you so sure of what the Russian government actually wants, and why don't you want to go into political specifics? If Putin decides he wants to play games with the Baltics, then yes, there could be problems, but that is down to him not to play silly buggers isn't it?

Hi Scary,

Do you really believe: "I don't think the US actually has a foreign policy"?!

I certainly do...

Lorna I think POTUS has lost the plot, but that Syria is a proxy war and no-one can do much about it. I think POTUS should have kicked back much harder at Russia over Crimea, and I think he should be raising Cain about Turkey atm. I hope the NATO air policing of the airspace of the Baltics will continue. Spain need its knuckles rapped as well for even thinking of using Cueta to help the Russians refuel.

I think if Trump gets in, then we may see an isolationist US, and if Clinton gets in, who knows?

Back to the OP, I'm working & living abroad & am extremely unlikely, post Brexit, to consider moving back to the UK.

As pp have said, I don't want to be part of that society - & the education system is going to be absolutely fucked, so that's my doc's education & my livelihood gone...

Crowy I don't notice any difference when I go back, and I am looking forward to moving home again.

I think whetgerbyiu see any difference it not depends a lot if on people and on where you live.
I'm not a Brit and I have noticed things such as people asking me where I'm coming from within minutes meeting me whereas no one was before. I have noticed a change in the atmosphere too avdcsi gave my dcs (both in secondary). But people I talk to who are British and live in London haven't noticed any change at all.
Same with the area you are working in etc...
Bar the slight increase in price, it's very easy to think nothing has changed.

But going back to the uk is more about making a gamble on what the future will be for the uk. And I don't think anyone actually knows what it will be.
I personally think it will be very very hard in the next 5 years after Brexit (so 2019) because getting new trade agreements will not be easy. And just that will have an impact on the economy.
But I also think the country has been fractured in two and to heal that will take a lot of time, esp as it is not following the labour/Tory divide but us happening across parties.

As a 'foreigner' I am looking at leaving the uk.
But only you can tell how homesick you are and whether this can compensate for economic hardship iyswim

ANewStart I don't think anyone knows what the future would have been for the UK had we stayed in the EU, as there was no status quo. The EU will be changing all the time with QMV and further enlargement, and the Acquis ratcheting up, so with either result the future was uncertain.

I'm happy to go back. I miss it. I'll have been away for 13 years by the time we return.

Oh I'm not saying that staying would automatically have very rosy.
More that we do know that its not going to be easy going out of it!

And we will not really have an idea of what we will be missing (good or bad) because Brexit will changed a lot fo things for the EU too.

What I am saying is that saying nothing has changed is wrong. A LOT has changed with Brexit, and it's not just the economy.

This is my trouble I suppose - preBrexit I felt that politics went up and down and I suppose before last year's election I was feeling quite positive about a sea change in our political system, also my industry I feel has been doing better in the last few years, friends are finally making a living, or maybe it's just we're all getting older and wiser?

But I do fear the long term repercussions - one of my big reasons for moving back was so the DC had the option to attend British Universities, and you have to be resident for 3 years prior to application in order to be counted as a domestic student...will our universities still be held in high esteem by that point (DC are 5&8). I am so proud we have an NHS, but will that disappear before my DC reach adulthood? I want them to be British, which for me (based on my experiences and upbringing) means multicultural, open, liberal, socially aware and responsible, anti guns, anti war, anti racism and homophobia (you can't escape the fact that while American politicians are allowed to get away with inciting hatred, DC will inevitably see that and assume it's ok)....but is my "Britishness" more about the way I was brought up and the friends I chose to surround myself with than the country itself? Nevertheless, that family and those friends are still in the UK....

I suppose the trouble is I don't live in a Utopia here, whatever you say about the UK - be it nuclear worries, rise of fascism etc the same is happening (arguably to a greater extent) in the US, where we're currently living. I don't know where else we could go, we haven't discussed it really....and my personal feeling is I just want to go home in the next 3ish years

Delivered I don't know where you get the anti war from for the British. Whilst I am not pro war, I do believe that we need robust and readily deployable HM Forces, and that we need Trident.

I am not entirely convinced about the rest of your list either!

In 3 years, yu will have a much better idea if Britain is changing that much or if it will be more the Britain you remember and love.

Or that it might be a bit of mix of all of it.
It might well be the universities will still be very good. But there will be no NHS (it's very clearly set on the paths of being privatised and it has been so for a few years now - Brexit or not).
It might be that all this talk against immigration will calm down and Britain will become an open and accepting country again. This, I believe, will be shaped by the way Brexit is handled in the next two years.

Which means that, by the end of your 3 years, you will have a much better picture of which path Britain is going down and whether this is what you want. (That and the result of the current elections in the US)

Tbh, I had no intentions of coming home, nor claiming British citizens9for DC.

Alls changed and we are planning to be home by 2018.

What changed for you Amalfi?

scary I did caveat my list by saying it may well have been my particular upbringing and friends as opposed to general British sentiment. My brother is in the army, I understand the need for defense. But I disagreed with Iraq, and marched with the million of people who agreed

I don't see the problem in the NHS changing. There are other health care models out there that work very well, and don't necessitate following the U.S. route. There does need to be a discussion around this, as in the current form the NHS is unsustainable. I would like to know how much each trust is paying for PFIs each year.