persuading DH to move to Australia

[ceedub]

I was born in the UK, but moved to Australia as a baby, and grew up there. I came over to the UK in 2005 for work, and met DH, who is British. I returned to Australia, and he and I had to choose who would make the longer-term move to make the relationship work. As I have dual nationality, it was easier for me to come over to the UK - and I was in my early 30s and up for the adventure and opportunities this presented. in doing this, i walked away from a high-flying career, but was a bit swept away by the romance of it.

After a couple of great years living in london, DH and I moved out of London. we had our two DCs and I gave up working in London, and eventually managed to find a job working from home.

DH continued to work in london, making the daily commute. His career has flourished and mine has pretty much gone down the toilet. I tried to kickstart it late last year by going 'in-house' with my current employer, and it hasn't been successful. My daily commute is at least 5 hours and I'm exhausted. There really isn't a local alternative so if I want a career (which I do), this is how it has to be. Moving back to london isn't an option.

I've made some good friends, and feel like I've spent the last 8 years trying to settle here.

then last year, my mum - who lives in melbourne - was diagnosed with cancer. she's in remission at the moment, but i was utterly devastated at not being able to be there with her. we don't know how much longer she has - if the cancer some back it's probably a year or two, otherwise she could expect to live a normal life.

I so want to move back home. DH has the opportunity to do a one-year secondment in melbourne next year - which I've jumped at - but i know that once i get there, i won't want to come home. I want my children to have the childhood i had and I want to be near family and friends who really 'get me'. I also want the chance to do all the things I haven't been able to do in the UK, and which I know I won't do if I stay here.

problem is, I know DH is deeply resistant to the idea of a permanent move. His parents are quite elderly here and would be very upset - but my poor mum has had to get by on seeing my children every other year, which as been so hard for her. he acts as though I'm unreasonable for asking it - but he always knew that one day I would want to go back. I feel like he's had the lifestyle and career he always hoped it would - but that it's come at the expense of what I've wanted.

I've been so homesick, and probably depressed for about 18 months - ever since the cancer diagnosis. i can't see this going away. How do I get DH to realise how important this is - that if we don't move, I know i will be deeply resentful and bitter towards him.

sorry for the long read. any advice very welcome.

Do you realise that if your DH can't be "persuaded" and your relationship broke up, you might not be able to take any DC back to Australia?

of course i do.

The point about us breaking up isn't about it being any sort of threat to underscore a demand to DH, but an indication of how important this is to me. I already feel very resentful of how my life is turning out vs how DH's life is turning out (i.e., his life is exactly as he hoped it would be, largely because of the sacrifices I've made). I don't think this is unusual - relationships will struggle where one partner feels that way - whatever the sacrifices are.

I would imagine this would mean i would stay in the UK, unless the children want to move, and making the best of it. But getting angrier, and more bitter about the situation. Not very appealing!

I can't help the way I feel. I've been here 8 years and I don't feel settled. I have genuinely given it a real go - I have made friends, I have tried to re-establish a career, I have always been polite and friendly to DH's family. But I don't feel British and I don't want to stay here. There's no point in trying to rationalise this - homesickness is a very deep-seated emotional response to being away from family and familiarity. There are good things about the UK, but I don't feel I belong here, and after 8 years of trying to settle, I don't think I ever will.

That many people love living in britain and that others have tried Australia and come back is a reflection of their personal preferences - not mine. I look and sound british and most people probably think I've adjusted very well, but culturally I'm australian and I don't want to spend the rest of my life living somewhere that feels alien to me when I have an opportunity to live somewhere which feels right.

The disastrous trip back home- I am very familiar with that one!! Went back when dd1 was 6 months. Discovered we had lost a large amount if money on a property we bought with my DPs and brother. This resulted in a stressful holiday, lots of arguments and me feeling very down. The pressure on a trip back home is huge.

I think it is less about persuading DH and more about giving life in oz a chance. The secondment sounds like a great opportunity to spend some precious time with your mum. You will never regret that.

Have been thinking of you today as I have just said goodbye to my parents who ate heading back to Australia. No idea when I will see them again. And I always have a horrible thought in the back of my mind that I may not see them again. My DH's parents are coming to stay this weekend. I don't think DH understands that thia can sometimes be difficult for me. I am so irrationally envious if the relationship his parents have with my DDs. Obviously very happy for them all and glad but also upset that my parents haven't had that chance to build that relationship with the girls. To a large extent all I really want is for my DH to properly acknowledge all of this, to understand how hard it is and how much I have missed of my family members lives. But I think he often feels to guilty about it to have a proper conversation.

I have no idea when/if we will look at moving there. But I think I am going to put a few 'rules' (not the right word but not sure what to call it) about things. I want my DH to start keeping an eye out for jobs in oz because if his dream job came up that could change everything. He doesn't even look for jobs at all at the moment. Also I need him to give me an hour minimum every weekend to Skype in peace with family (so hard to talk with newborn and 3 year old).

Sorry have rambled on about me!!

Geez, sorry for all the typos. Am feeding DD!

I don't feel settled here either. No real close friends. Get on well with MiL who is great help with DDs. But my worry is that we stay here a bit longer, then DHs parents get sick then we can't leave. I realise I sound like I think about people being I'll/ dying a lot but think that is the reality when you have family a long way away.

DD starting school in September. I worry that her school experience will be so different to mine- I never even used to wear shoes to school in summer.

I do worry now that we will struggle financially to move to Australia. DH has just got a good promotion which will help but we have to start saving more money if we want to buy a place in Oz.

Hi missing...i so recognise the envy of in-laws' relationships with DD and DS. I think that's been a big cause of tension between my MIL and I. She is also horrendously insensitive about it - there was a period when mum was sick when MIL would carry on at the end of every weekly visit about how much she would miss DD and DS. Thankfully DH put a stop to that as i found it very difficult to remain civil. My poor mum hadn't seen the children for two years at that point and didn't know whether she would ever see them again. Even now, I feel so upset about the grief that caused her at a time when she needed to feel loved and supported.

Wow I also have the same issues with my mil. I've never been able to explain what the problem is to my husband, when I try it just seems to cause an argument. Thank you for making me realise my feelings are completely justified! I also know the feeling of living in the wrong place, when really the only solution is to move.

This is old but I'm wondering if the OP is about still? I'm here because not that long ago, I could have been your DH! My DH is the male version of you...same story...he's got dual...we met in the UK in our late 20s...had DC in our early 30s...he's wanted to go back to Oz since the DC were born. They're 11 and 6 now.

It's taken me a long time to come to a place where I recognise how hard it's been for him and his family....all those years without seeing much of grandchildren etc. My family have had the early years...it's time to go to Oz and give DH a turn.

I came around after a holiday in Oz...the DC loved it so much, it's cleaner...the lifestyle is more social...the beach...the beach and the beach. Could DH and you have a holiday?

Of course...I'm going to be VERY sad about leaving my own Mum and family and friends but the pull is too strong now...my DC will also have a better secondary school...that was the clincher for me. Our English option is poor at best.

I can't give much advice as I emigrated to DH's country and wish we'd done it much earlier but I'm not a big fan of UK daily life style. I think you have the opportunity to go and try out life in Aus. Once there he might change his mind. I have elderly parents in the UK and there's no chance they will move as it's a different language, but would otherwise. Would your in laws consider Aus or is that too much?

You sound like me a year ago MrsNextDoor. I came through and you wouldn't get me back to the UK now. You'll be fine, its 1000x worth it!

I'm just back from Australia and all the money in the world wouldn't drag me back .... Maybe Sydney at an absolute push if I HAD to go. Lived there for 5 years, 3 states, the UK is fantastic relatively

Hi Everyone, thought it was worth putting in an update. Dh has agreed to a one-year secondment, so we're going out in January. Which is fantastic - it gives me time with my mum, my dc can get to know her better and spend time with their cousins.

Have been thinking about the situation constantly. For me, the pull is not so much about lifestyle or opportunities, but family. I'm sure I'll miss elements of the UK lifestyle, and the friends I've made here. But nothing replaces family. I was always so close to my mum and sisters, we went through a lot together. having my DC has made me realise how much I miss their support and love. I'm sure it would be the same if I was a British expat living somewhere else, missing family here. Nearly losing my mum last year was too much to bear.

I'm grateful to dh for agreeing to the year, though who knows what will happen when we're out there. I'm hoping he'll like it enough to stay longer, but I'm not sure how realistic that is. He did a lot of damage to our relationship when I first raised the possibility of a temporary move. He had always said to me that if I really wanted to go, he would go for a year, but when I asked, I initially got a flat no. I think that was the influence of his parents, but it caused a lot of heartache and tension in our marriage, which hasn't really recovered. Again, I'm hoping the time away will give us a fresh perspective on our relationship...who knows.

But even a year would mean so much. I started looking up old friends, hoping to reconnect with them and had the terrible experience of discovering one passed away several years ago. Don't want to miss the chance to spend time with people while I can.

Wish me luck.

Good luck OP. FWIW I think your DH has been incredibly selfish in his attitude towards the issue, and I for one would find that hard to forgive. But at least he's agreed to do the secondment. I just hope for your sake that he can be open minded about the idea of staying longer. I think in your situation, with your mum's illness, I would have insisted on moving back much sooner, but I guess it's easier said than done! Especially when there are children involved.

Good news about the secondment, OP - are you going to use this as a chance to restart your career? My take on it, having read the earlier part of the thread, was that your DH has had a good run at establishing his career whilst you have made the sacrifice of location and childcare, and it seems reasonable to take turns (especially as it seems his career could actually also benefit from being in Oz).

You don't mention siblings I don't think - are you both only children?

thanks for the responses. tribpot, I have three sisters, 2 of whom live in australia, one who lives in London. I don't have any other family in the UK - or even in this hemisphere - and I don't live in London. I see my UK-based sister maybe twice a year. she doesn't have children.

DH has a sister over here, who lives in London near his parents. My father died several years ago, and mum lives on her own.

LondonZoo, I appreciate the depth of feeling - though the reality is that when DH and I agreed to have children, it was within the context of him previously saying he would live in Australia if I really wanted to go back. It's since we've had children - and his mother has become very attached to DD - that he has reneged on that undertaking. So the Hague Convention cuts both ways and at the moment, it operates to keep me in the UK - and i never got a say in that happening. so maybe I should go 'fucking apeshit' at the suggestion i'm being selfish for not wanting to be trapped somewhere i don't want to be.

takes deep breath

within 6 months of having DD i was begging to go back and got another promise that we would before i turned 40. which hasn't happened. I have sacrificed family, friends, career and the chance to give my children the childhood experiences I enjoyed. DH hasn't made any sacrifices at all thus far, in any aspect of our marriage or in his career - and this secondment is hardly a sacrifice for him! In fact, the only basis on which he is prepared to do this is at all is that it doesn't involve any sacrifice.

I'm not planning to dump DH at the luggage carousel and I do appreciate him agreeing to come out - though he only agreed when his work made it clear it wanted him to do a secondment - so it's not clear quite how much he's actually doing this for me! But at the moment, I'm being an optimist and hoping the australian lifestyle will win him over. if it doesn't, I'll deal with that when I have to. I do also think I need to wait and see how I react to being back - I love australia, but there were reasons for me leaving in the first place, and I'll be interested to see whether any of those feel relevant after nearly ten years being away. I'm not certain that I'll want to stay there forever, though at the moment, 1 year after nearly 10 in the UK leaves me feeling a bit short-changed.

I think he has been incredibly selfish - but it doesn't mean I'll be as unreasonable and selfish in return. Not much to maintain a relationship on though, regardless of where in the world we are. marriage is meant to be about supporting each other and mine feels pretty one-sided. i try not to dwell on it, and to look forward to being able to spend some time with the people i love while I can.

londonzoo
"that is the most outrageous thing I have ever read on Mumsnet"

You obviously haven't read much on Mumsnet

I think you might possibly be projecting just a little bit

OP I'm still with you on this!

One of the reasons ex and I divorced was because he wanted to live in Australia ( dual nationality)
I didn't.

Is your husband moving on a 1 year visa or does he have the option to stay longer?

Thanks AnotherEmma!

Londonzoo, what you seem to be saying is that's it's ok for me to have been vulnerable, taken advantage of and forced to stay in UK, but it wouldn't be ok for me to expect my husband to make similar sacrifices? Why not? It's a really difficult situation and there's no way we can both have what we want, but why would it be unreasonable to 'take turns'?

ceebub - I think what Londonzoo is saying is that you made the choice for the UK when you got married and had children here. Maybe as a couple you were not really honest with each other, and got carried away.

There are lots of people who for various reasons cannot go back home, and they make the best of it. It is tough when family are ill.

I have friends who were £10 poms and didn't expect to ever be able to afford to come back and see family. I have letters from a great aunt, who in her 80s was offering to try to return from Canada when her brother was dying, if it would be of any use.

I also have friends who when they left South Africa, had their citizenship taken away and never expected to be allowed back in the country. (Nevermind an ex-boyfriend's family who had property stripped from them in World War II.)

Now maybe you relationship is in difficulties - if so Australia may well be the end. But of what you have said, you cannot blame it all on your DH.

Vulnerable and taken advantage of? Is that really how you feel about your husband?

If I were in his place there is no way I would go for a year because of the risk that you split up and he doesn't ever get to move his children back to the UK, where they were born. Selfish? Yes but in this case you both are, have to be really.
I'm sorry you're unhappy but you made a choice and it's very hard to reconcile. You're fortunate that he will come for a year to be honest.

I'm with AnotherEmma on this - I cannot understand how you think her post was the most outrageous thing you've ever read on MN, Londonzoo unless you only read it once a year or something. I read and re-read Emma's post to find the outrage and couldn't manage it.

And I'm speaking as a UK expat with an Aussie DH, living in Australia, still wishing that I could go home to the UK to be with my own family, despite having been here 6 years and having carved out a relatively decent niche for myself (DH was fucking useless on the "friends" front, if I hadn't had DS1, I'd know no one here). I am stuck. DH did say, when we moved out here, that if I really hated it here, then we could go back after 3 years - but there was never any hope in hell that he would have done so, not really, and I guess I knew that. His pull from his Mum is apparently more important than my relationship with my Dad and sister and friends (as I said, he has none) - and so here we are and here, no doubt, we will stay.

I would really like to move back to the UK at some point, probably now when the DC have left school, because I want to do more travelling in Europe, and it's an awful lot easier to do it from the UK! DH might consider it, once he's retired or something (by which time I'll probably be dead as I'm older than he is).

It's a fucking horrible situation to be in, it really is - I feel for the OP, because she is also the one who has had to compromise so much, lost out on so much, and may still continue to miss out.

But the only thing I will say about her "dream" of the children having the same childhood that she did - that's unlikely straight from the off. Everything has changed so much - even if I took my DC back home tomorrow, I know full well that they wouldn't have the childhood that I did. It is an impossible dream and one that would be better let go of, to avoid disappointment.

Having said all that - you get the opportunity to try it out. And you get the opportunity to be with your family again, even if it doesn't turn out to be forever - I wish I could do that.

We do manage to go back to the UK every year, it was a condition I set when we moved out here, that I could go back whenever I needed to - and Skype helps enormously, but it's just not the same as being there.

Good luck with this - I really hope that things work out for you, it's a bugger of a thing to deal with.

I have dual citizenship and chose to move to London, all those years ago. Quite a few friends who did the same and also married Brits.

Some have moved to Aus and some have stayed but I also think that if you make the initial move and decision it isn't the case that you can demand someone move to Aus to make it fair.

So yes I also think your dh is putting himself in a precarious situation and I hope you can keep talking about coming back after the year if he wants to.

It is hard to miss family I know that, but your are being too hard on your dh.