Good things about living in Germany?

[beginnersluck]

I've just found out that we'll be moving to Berlin next year for DP's work, for 4 years. With our DS, who will be just over 1yr by then. I'm sure it'll be great, but I'm going through a momentary worrying phase (esp. about my career!)

So to help me through it, can people please remind me of all the GOOD things about living in Germany?

(I've read a bit of the 'cake' thread and will hop on there nearer the time)

Different German states are hugely different from each other, more so than different parts of the UK I would say, definitely far more so than different counties of England. So I think maybe you need answers from people specifically in Berlin, as some of the pluses and minuses of other states just won't apply.

As your DS will live there from 1 til 5 years of age the huge advantage would be he will be the perfect age to pick German up fairly effortlessly if you chose to expose him to the language lots through playgroups/ nursery/ Kindergarten etc.

I find Germany a better place to bring up kids than the UK, but that has a lot to do with them being outdoors loads and loads, playing out, calling for friends etc. etc. and in school less hours, which may not apply to your situation in Berlin, I have no idea tbh.

I lived in Berlin when I was little and it was amazing.... Obv it will be different for you but I am immensely jealous!!!!!!! My parents and brother go there as often as possible. I am sure you will have a brilliant time.

Agree that you need to ask opinion of Berliners - i'm in rural Bavaria which i can imagine couldnt be more different from the bright lights of Berlin.

But things I like about Germany - like that dc are encouraged to be more independent but also like (altho this may be a rural thing) that they are also encouraged to not grow up too fast.

I also like the efficiency of the country as a whole but without over-riding health & safety nonsense.

There are quite a few MNetters who live in Berlin or who have lived there so hope they come along to help you.

Feel free to come onto the living in Germany thread - we're a friendly lot .

Lower crime rates. High standard of rental accommodation. Family friendliness. Great medical care. Affordable tickets to concerts, operas, etc. Much less binge drinking among adults. Builders don't make comments when you walk past. Less pressure to dress smartly (!)

Feeling better yet?

Frikadellen and lebekuchen! Sausages and sauerkraut! Beer brewed according to the Reinheitsgebot!

While we're on a food theme... eiscafes with 40 flavours to choose from for less than a euro, very cheap wine and beer, free samples from the deli counters for the DC, seasonal stalls in the towns with asparagus, strawberries or corn on the cob, depending on the time of year. There's also free parks and things for the children to do everywhere, even in the middle of towns and cities, plenty of chance to bike instead of using the car, Christmas markets which are fab, and Sundays are a proper family day where none of the shops are open.

I live here! That's a good thing

I lived in Berlin for four years, my children were one and three when we arrived, and I can't think of single bad thing to say about it. I'm so jealous - we all absolutely loved it. Housing is very cheap so you'll be able to afford a lovely place (compared with what you'd get for your money over here). It is just the most amazing city with it's huge parks and lakes - where you can swim in the summer - parts of it are very urban and yet you can have the feeling of being in a huge forest without leaving the city. It never seems to get crowded - we would regularly drive into the city in the evening and park outside the door of the restaurant (visitors used to ask why it was quiet - it was just always like that). Fantastic public transport - frequent, clean and never crowded and, most importantly if you have a one-year-old, easily accessible with a pushchair. Loads of great stuff to do - museums, parks, concert halls - all very cheap, as is eating out (or even just stopping for a coffee). Fascinating history - the war, the wall - you can feel the weight of history in practically every street. Also I absolutely loved the Berliners. We had the most wonderful neighbours who practically adopted the dcs as surrogate grandchildren we were never made to feel anything other than completely welcome. I would go back in a heartbeat - I loved everything about it and so did the children. Lucky, lucky you.

Thanks everyone - you've made me well up!

I realise things will differ in other parts of the country, but I was inspired to ask after I saw someone's comment about fruit and vegetables tasting as they remembered them to as a child - not like UK supermarket ones.

So i guess now I just have to sort a job out and I can start to get excited...

I have lived in Germany for nearly 25 years. My husband studied in Berlin and loved it.
As for food, definitely find out where your local markets are. It is so much nicer to be able to choose fresh, local vegetables etc. Also scout around for local bakers and butchers - they exist here :-)
Have a fantastic time!

I am taking dictation from DP, who is German... we live near Cologne though and as people have said, things do differ from state to state, however...

"Its a safe country, everything works, that's why things are sometimes a bit complicated and hard to get your head around, but at the end of the day, they work...

like dealing with the authorities, setting up your life, renting a flat

On the whole people are friendly, even in the big cities, and helpful. They can seem rude sometimes because they are direct, but they don't actually mean it.

Of course there are arseholes everywhere :)

The beer is the best in the world, at least outside of Berlin (they have one big brewery called Schultheiss, there's a reason why people call it HultScheiss... :)

For a capital city Berlin is dirt cheap, especially accommodation.

Its a clean country, lovely countryside, ummmmmm its very PC (I actually don't agree with this, I've encountered some fairly racist attitudes towards the Turkish particularly).

The bad things - tax and rules, but then that's the down side of everything working properly"

Overall I have been here 18 months and love it. I have found people are by and large friendly, helpful and accommodating.

Do you speak any German? It definitely helps! Good luck....

Thanks, cake (and your DP!), I don't speak German yet - I want to do a class but evening classes are out due to 5mth old DS and Saturday classes seem to get cancelled due to lack of people signing up.

Hi beginners, sorry I didn't see this thread before. I'm one of the few MNers who is currently living in Berlin - I've been here for 20 years and my kids were born here. Cake has given a good summary of pros and cons of Germany generally, but I'd like to add that Berliners have a reputation for being rude, even in Germany. They're actually proud of it - they call it 'Herz mit Schnauze', which has been brilliantly translated as 'big heart and a big gob'.

I'm not very fond of certain Germans right now as we're having a stupid dispute with our neighbours, a pair of horribly straight-laced civil servants. But generally Berlin is a city that Germans come to - especially the cool alternative districts - to avoid that kind of mentality. It's funny that a city as inherently anarchic as Berlin is the federal capital, and there are all these confused and frustrated Bavarian politicians who hate it here because it's so far from the German well-ordered, clean ideal.

Generally speaking, Germany is a brilliant place to bring up kids, as they are given more space and independence to develop - by comparison I find the UK horribly neurotic and psychologically damaging to children.

A few links that might help you further:

Toytown is an expat website with a specific Berlin forum - beware, though, it can get pretty aggressive, especially towards potential Berliners who post things like 'um I don't speak German but I fancy moving here and getting a job what can I do?'

There's an international women's group which could be helpful for new Berliners. I don't belong - it's very much a 'ladies who lunch' thing for accompanying spouses, but it would help you make contacts.

If there's anything else you need to know specifically, send me a PM. There's another MNer who is moving here in a few weeks, so I could possibly recycle some of the advice I gave her about education (OK, not so relevant for you) and healthcare, etc.

Thanks, Darrow, that's really useful. I may well PM you nearer the time (at the moment my coping mechanism is to focus on the fact that we're not moving until April, so it doesn't seem to imminent right now!)

I hope your neighbourly dispute is resolved quickly and easily.

Ooh, that would have been me posting about the fruit and veg tasting better in Germany! I think if you read on a few weeks later, I mention the little friends I have found in my fruit and vegetables! So I guess they are better about not using pesticides here, which is a good thing, apart from a slight increase in bugs in fresh produce! Nothing a good wash and a keen eye can't sort!

Was also going to mention Toytown but got beaten to it.

Come join us on the cake thread! :)

Berlin is a great city to live in. I really enjoyed it there. Each suburb has its own character so it depends on where you live and where your DH works but I would suggest Lichterfelde West, Zehlendorf, Steglitz and that south-western area of Berlin generally for a family friendly lifestyle. If you're looking for a younger demographic though, a lot of young families live in Prenzlauer Berg to the east of the city centre. It's trendier and a bit more lefty, lots of organic shops, good bars and restaurants etc.

Berlin is a completely different kettle of fish to Germany in general, I would say. It has a very unique culture and feel to it.

Upsides of living in Germany generally, I would say, are:

1. Great public transport and infrastructure - cliche but it is true and makes life a lot less stressful. You probably won't need a car in Berlin depending on your husband's commute and where you live
2. Relaxed atmosphere for eating out. Expensive restaurants are formal as in the UK but it's easy to find relaxed, low-key places.
3. Very safe, even Berlin has a pretty low crime rate (apart from one or two suburbs)
4. If neither of you speak German, there are lots of people who speak English and they're only too keen to practice it (frustrating when you are trying to learn though!). It would be no issue to find a bilingual kindergarten for your child in Berlin.
5. Free, tolerant culture - it's very much a live-and-let-live attitude.

You definitely need to learn German OP. Berliners and ex-East germans were taught Russian and not English so don't rely on the older people being able to speak any English at all.

You'll love it, I'm jealous. Enjoy the Spaetzle while you're there.

This lot are excellent for learning German.

www.goethe.de/ins/gb/lon/enindex.htm?wt_sc=london

Thanks Fedup, that is good to know. I have heard others say good things about the Goethe institute classes - I'll investigate whether they do daytime weekend classes.

We'll get accommodation provided by DP's work - it isn't confirmed but is likely to be in Dickensweg. That sounds like the sticks to me!

Does anyone have any insights about that area?

Hmm, Dickensweg has a lot of expats living there, I think. I'm dont live there but many members of DHs workforce are in that area and have a nice little community going on. It's right by the British School. But I don't think there's much else there. Bus links into town are good, but it's quite a trek.

If my instinct is correct I may well meet you next year!

Oh Lordy, the sticks! Thanks, Peri, it's good to be warned!

See you next year!