KL help needed.

[ScarlettAlexandra]

after lots of tears and deliberation we have decided to move to KL for a year or two, depending on how we like it.

i have two small dc's and would like tips on how to fly long hall with them.
what do i do about car seats, high chairs and other baby stuff i will need.

how do i find out about jabs like mmr that my youngest will need but she will be there.

and what about malaria jabs for them.

my heads spinning and can't seem to get any answers any help will be appreciated.

Copied from your other thread:

I live in Bangkok, moved when DD was 2.

Lots will depend on the circumstances of the move - are you being relocated by your employer, because if so, most will offer relocation advisory services.

If you are doing it independently, then you have more to figure out yourself - eg do you want to ship stuff, or only bring what you can take in a suitcase?

Re jabs, I kept my red book from the UK, and put vaccinations in my diary, so that I could book the same ones in Bangkok - cost is high on medical sometimes though - do you have decent cover?

Speak to your GP about jabs - you really only need the same ones you would have if you were going on hols. Malaria I don't think is needed - KL is malaria free (and its not a jab, its tablets, so you would have to take them all the time, which is not good for you - insect repellent is far more appropriate).

Some things you will want to think about might be, for example, cost of schooling - if you are not sure of whether the move is permanent, you will need to keep DCs in the UK system, and British schools in Asia can be eye-wateringly expensive.

Do you have jobs lined up? Its a goldrush in Asia with lots of people trying to move out to escape the EU recession, and an increasingly skilled and educated local workforce, so don't assume jobs are easy to find, they aren't.

If you do have jobs, then ask the employer concerned to provide you with contacts in-market to help with relocation/local advice whilst you are planning the move.

There are no jabs for malaria, only tablets, but am not sure you need them for KL. We moved to china from Austria and a specialist in tropical medicine advised us re jabs. Imagine you need all the childhood ones plus hep a and b, typhus and possibly rabies. all the jabs can be pretty expensive, so check if covered by health insurance.
Re shipping all your stuff depends what your allowance is and how much is Ir freight and how much sea freight. Dd was 2 when we moved so bought a car seat in China ready for when we arrived. We flew business and had a luggage allowance of 120kg for 4 of us and used 80. Our sea freight took 2 months (just to give you an idea of time scales, but can be affected by customs clearance ) and our air freight took longer (don't ask!).
Good luck with your move.

there is no relocation services. we do have free schooling, medical, for us all. and a housing allowance which seems more than we need really.

how do i find out about shipping?, would it be cheaper to buy there?

2 months omg that seems like a really long time.

i like the idea of it being an adventure I'm just stressing now.

Contact an international shipping company. We used Interdean. They will come to your house and give you a quote. You need to find out what prices are like in KL for baby products, as may be cheaper to sell your stuff in the uk and start again.

Shipping can be very expensive if you have to pay for it yourself, but so can buying stuff abroad - we sold almost everything we brought for DD from the UK at a profit in Bangkok, because the cost of western-centric baby items like high chairs and car seats is so high (no-one local really uses car seats here).

I think its quite unusual for shipping not to be offered - are you sure?

Asian Tigers is a good shipping agent, Pickfords also do international.

Have you actually been to have a look yourself? Or are you going to go before the move? See if you can find an expat group in KL online to make contact with - we have something called BAMBI here in Thailand, which was helpful at providing me with local answers to the kind of questions you are asking.

Jabs - you may also need Japanese encephalitis (sp?) - we had it for DD.

Some other things you may want to consider re the package:
Do you get a flight home every year?
What happens if a member or your extended family is I'll or dies - will you get a flight home?
What is the standard of medical care in KL? we live in China, but for serious medical issues we have to go to Hong Kong.
Schooling is paid from what age?
Do you have your salary all paid in KL or is it split between KL and UK?
Do you get free tax advice and completion of tax returns?
Is dental care covered?
What is the cost of living in KL?
No trying to stress you, but just a few questions to consider.

i will need to ask there hr but i don't this so.

as for your other answer i don't know about healthcare allowances etc need to find that out.

i won't need the schooling i dont think. dc's are under two and the contract/project is for two years only.

ill be back in the uk before they need to start school.

Even if the kids are not in school you may want to send them to kindergarten, so I would find out about costs.

Scarlett - don't assume you won't need school, many expats have their toddlers in pre-school early as a way of:

1. creating social contact and play opps (may be no playgroups for toddlers, may be nothing like soft play - Bangkok is bigger than KL by a long way, and there are only two proper soft play centres in the whole city

1. creating a social network for mum.

1. Hearing English spoken by native speakers (v important at early years)

So you may find your children are very isolated, as are you, if you don't go with the local norm.

In BKK, it is extremely unusual for an expat 3 yo not to be in pre-school or nursery for the morning, and when I say it can be expensive, I really do mean very very very expensive indeed.

we get four return flights a year. not much but its something. emergency flights aren't covered.

i don't know about the medical over there. its seems ok from what i can see, need to find out more.

salary will be paid in KL.

tax advice etc is covered by their hr.

dental is included with healthcare.

we have a budget of 2000pounds

a month for housing. even the most expensive i can find is around 500 to 800 pounds a month furnished with bills included.

No flights home is crap - is there a way to renegotiate that? Even economy, a trip home (and you will want one a year for sure, unless you want your children to completely forget their home and struggle to resettle when they return) can run into 1000s for a family of 4.

No dental care is also not good - can be v v expensive to have even basic services by English speaking doctors

KL hospitals are not great - everyone I know in KL flies to Singapore or Bangkok for any major medical issues, so check if your insurance will allow for this.

Are there no other expat wives in the company your DH works for who could help with this? It would be good to have a friendly face when you get there - being an expat can be very socially isolating, and KL isn't the biggest expat city for Europeans, by a long shot.

Re it being an adventure - yes! Yes, it can be, and I woulnd't change it for the world! It is important to ensure that you know what you are walking into, and the package is good enough that you don't financially suffer (don't believe the bollocks about living being possible on a dollar a day, it isn't if you want any semblance of an expat life - and you will want those home comforts at various points, even if you eat from halker stalls for the rest of your time)

Cross post - that's great about the flights!

Will ask my friends how much they paid for housing if it helps - are you more keen on "expat" areas, or would you prefer local areas?

500 -800 sounds pretty cheap, but I don't know KL. If you don't spend the whole housing allowance can you use it for other items? Some companies allow expats to use the remainder of the allowance to pay for a car and/or driver.

i would prefer an ex pat area. that sound bad but i would need to make somefreinds.

i see the idea if the preschool. need to check the details on what's included.

what's a halker stall ? i really am clueless aren't i :(

I think KL costs are a bit cheaper than Bangkok, but I don't think they can be more than 10-15% cheaper, looking at our companies cost of living adjustment factors. So 500-800 sounds too low - we pay more than three times the higher end for a 3 bed central Bangkok apartment.

This is from our company expat info site re living in KL:

Expats looking for high-rise space will find the condominium market quite good; the average cost of monthly rent ranges from USD$875 (75 sqm) to USD$3,657 (300 sqm).

You will definitely want a larger apartment - the heat means you spend more time indoors than you might expect, as does the deluge in the rainy season. We live in a 300sqm+ apartment, which is huge, but the jump down from their is down to 150sqm apartments, which can be a bit small for play with little ones.

Halker stall = street food from carts on the street. Delicious, but you wouldn;t want to live on it for health reasons!

Have you actually been to have a look around - its a big move to make without a go-see? Many many people hate KL/BKK/SG when they come and have a look.

Here's some more info from our company - no idea how old it is, but prices may have gone up since they cribbed this (prob from somewhere online!):

Utilities

Electricity for a 100 square meter apartment costs approximately RM90 (USD$26.28) and monthly telephone bills costs around RM40 (USD$12). Having a cable television costs approximately USD$30 to USD$40 monthly.

Internet is widely available; broadband services cost approximately RM60-70 (USD$21). Internet cafes cost approximately RM3 (USD$1) per hour. Prepaid internet is available and denominations include RM10 (USD$2.93), RM20 (USD5.87), RM50 (USD$14.68) and RM100 (USD$29.36).

LPG (liquid petroleum gas) is mostly used for cooking in Malaysian homes that costs RM25 (USD$7.34) per canister and RM50 (USD$14.68) for the deposit. Some of the suppliers are Shell Gas and Petronas.

Domestic help is affordable; part time house cleaner rates are between RM15 (USD$4) to RM20 (USD$5) per hour. It is important to note that getting the services of Muslim maids will have some cultural considerations as Muslims do not cook pork and will not use utensils used in cooking pork.

Food

Dining out is relatively cheap. Dinner in a middle range restaurant costs USD$18.84 for two persons. Eating in fast foods like McDonalds costs USD$2.65.

Beers are relatively expensive since the majority of the population in Malaysia is Muslim. Buying a can of imported beer in groceries is cheaper; it costs USD$2.18 while in restaurants it costs USD$3.07.

A liter of milk costs USD$1.34, a dozen of eggs costs USD$1.16, and fresh bread costs USD$0.74.

Transport

Taxi fare in Kuala Lumpur varies depending on the destination and type of taxi. Red and white taxis cost RM3 for 2 kilometers and succeeding charge is RM0.90 per kilometer.

Owning a car is pricey. Expats can get a new Honda Civic for approximately RM110,000 (approximately USD$32,270) while a five year second hand car of the same brand costs about USD$65,000 (approximately USD$19,070).

And no, expat areas aren't "bad" - you will be surrounded by local culture, and it can be lonely having little to no contact with people with your own shared experiences and culture. Nothing to be ashamed of at all.

Have a look at Bangsar for living. Lots of expats.

You can buy everything in KL, there is an ikea so highchair, cot etc not a problem. Clothes for kids are a bit more expensive but there is GAP, M&S etc. I'm surprised you don't get shipping but you could ship a few boxes very cheaply. Toys are also more expensive than uk, but your kids are still quite little.

Do you have 4 flights per year each??? Or one return flight for all of you. 4 each is a lot!

Oh and you could easily get a fully furnished condo.

Also no need for Malaria and I'd be surprised if you are recommended Japanese Encephalitis. It is a bugger of a jab.

Kids will need BCG.

thisthread we had JE after the 2yo DD of a friend of ours here contracted it, and was left brain-damaged, deaf and partially sighted. It is a bugger of a jab, but DD is now immune, which i was grateful for after the flooding last year (JE outbreak, along with lots and lots of dengue).

Ah yes, the joy of Ikea. Ours in BKK only opened last year - life would have been a lot easier for us when we first got here if it had been around at the time! In which case, I wouldn't bother bringing the highchair and cot, but maybe think about the car seat.

Also, we never used a buggy in BKK - pavements too crap to bother.