Denial

[Orangeblossom7777]

Is it denial when people keep saying they are getting better and looking for a cure when it is end stage? i think this is happening with FIL recently

End stage lung condition, elderly and low oxygen...keeps ringing an ambulance when it gets too much and going in, only to be discharged as coupe of days later.

I think they need palliative care but feel I can't bring this up as it would upset them and they are saying things like he will get better soon and looking for drugs etc to make him better.

The hospital have said there isn't much we can do, after another admission (GP sent him in with low oxygen again)

Why are the doctors not broaching this with him? It is awful seeing him struggling. Has anyone any experience of this please? they just keep sending him home then he ends back up in there again..

Some people don't want to hear it said and don't want to say it themselves because it is too unbearably painful.

There are some kinds of mental pain that are not survivable, so if talking this way is what enables them to cope with their horrific situation then leave them be.

Dying is the ultimate loss of control, let them take comfort from the little control they feel by talking and acting this way.

Palliative care won't make this any less awful, I'm sorry.

Denial is part of the grieving process I believe. I assume that he was told it's end stage cancer? Maybe this is his way of getting through it? My FIL was acting in denial as well, at one clear moment when we were alone he told me he had to believe in getting better or he couldn't go on living as he did feel so miserable. He needed the positivity and people nodding allong with it that he might one day get better if some miracle happened.

Who is doing the denial - FIL, or MIL/whoever is caring for him/his loved ones?

Apart from anything else it sounds as if the GP/hospital should have put an appropriate care plan in place - he shouldn't be being sent in by the GP if the hospital can do nothing to improve the situation.

Are you in a position to talk to his GP? Presumably not?

They'd be cross if I talked to the GP I think. Both PIL really... (denial) No, not cancer, end stage COPD...

Would palliative care really not help? I googled and it mentioned Oramorph could help with the breathlessness. Also the in and out of A&E is stressful

As frustrating as it is to see, I think you have to step back and leave them to it. They may have been offered support or treatment and declined it.

it must be very hard to watch, I don't underestimate how hard it is for you too OP

Thanks, yes it is hard. I do try and just listen and mention things like maybe they can help with the symptoms. Which is the main thing.

I'll explain a bit more about what is happening just in case anyone has any experience and can say if this is normal or not.

The GP came out and said oxygen too low, called an ambulance, advised if this happens again they are to call 999 straightaway. Paramedics concerned about low oxygen- said should not have been discharged with it that low

Hospital saying 'nothing much we can do' stabilising on oxygen, then day or two later saying he is discharged again, little info, discharge letter missing once and little written other times. This happens at odd times, evening, taken to the door due to covid by a nurse and collected.

This continues...because of the advice given and I think it may be worse due to the covid situation - perhaps- I have not experienced this before so not sure what usually happens in these circumstances.

I would have hoped for a bit more co-ordination, and support - also he said he did ask the doctors what was happening and they 'walked away' are they unwilling to discuss the prognosis? I would have thought they would be trained better to communicate difficult news.

I suspect you are not getting the full story here OP

Is he discharging himself, have you seen the discharge letters?

They keep sending him home. Like on a Sunday evening for example. First, no discharge letter - they will send it on apparently. Second time mentioned a UTI not the underlying conditions.

It's made worse by covid situation as only one visitor allowed in the evening- so no time to chat with the doctors- limited to MIL who is herself elderly.

She's really worried about suddenly being asked to collect him again- in the past they just wheel him out to the entrance because of covid, my DH has been there to drive them- but he literally can't walk now and is extremely frail along with the low oxygen. So we're all concerned that will happen again tomorrow.

they seem on a mission to send people home...

He's not physically able to walk / discharge himself..

Have you contacted your local hospice? See if they can help, maybe hospice at home? They are literally experts in dying and can really make a difference in having a “good death”. OP, I hope everything happens peacefully.

I would like to try that but it is just so sensitive as don't think they realise or have accepted the situation? It does sound like the best option.

The GPs are more aware after the last time seeing him at home, so I suggested to MIL maybe could ring them and ask for advice perhaps too. I think they can refer to hospice.

Well, he got admitted back to hospital and been there a while now, low oxygen levels.

Things are not better really, they have said no much can be done, picked up other things (embolism for example)..now realising it is not just they have not been offered support but refusing it as well. Saying do not want home oxygen, refusing oramorph and home from hospital support.

Now the hospital are telling them he will be discharged again soon and they want him to go home but no support in place. It's very difficult to watch.