So disappointing that pride flags/symbols are being rejected because of trans ideology

[purpledaze24]

As a lesbian parent, I encourage my kids to embrace their rainbow family identity. However, I have mixed, mostly negative feelings towards trans ideology, particularly the idea that gender is a social construct and that there are multiple genders. I definitely don’t believe this should be being taught as fact to children. I’ve started to notice that fairly open-minded, pro LGB, straight people are starting to reject any association with the rainbow flag because of the association with trans ideology. I read a comment on here the other day that someone was given a rainbow badge to wear at work for pride month and refused to wear it because of the gender ideology association. It’s pretty upsetting that something I’m trying to teach my kids to embrace as a positive representation of our family, is now being stigmatised and taken over by the TRAs. I feel like our identities are being tainted by something I don’t identify with or agree with and literally has nothing to do with being a gay family. When I think about it, one of the most frustrating things about it is some non-binary people are straight, white, privileged women. They’ve adopted the identify in a desperate attempt to seem oppressed, in order to give their opinions about oppressed groups more weight, because now they’re “one of them”. Thereby further oppressing gay people! It makes me so mad!

I have nothing to add, other than to say I agree with everything you said 100%

I sympathise. Until recently I saw the plain rainbow flag as a positive thing. I didn't really like the later additions which tried to assign different "identities" to different colours instead of just a rainbow representing the hope of including the range of sexualities and otherwise meant anyone at all, whatever their race, disability, identity.

Trying to make straight people like me wear rainbows raises the question of "who exactly are we supporting"? Now that the "LGBTQ+" community is divided against itself what does a rainbow flag mean? I'm not a lesbian separatist myself (married heterosexual!) but that's who I think of first, because they gave so much to the women's movement. I do support everyone else as well but if the "rainbow" community is systematically excluding some lesbians then why would I choose to wear one?

As for the workplace, after DC told me they were "trans" and was about to start cross-sex hormones the sight of a rainbow logo anywhere caused me intense distress pain and grief which I had to master as best I could. I blamed the "rainbow community" for encouraging my DC, maybe not fairly, maybe DC would have done this anyway. In any case I am very glad I was not faced with rainbows at work so I was able to work professionally with other trans people even when I was still feeling very raw. I started to get over it after a year or so. Rainbows cause me nothing more than an eyeroll nowadays and despite all the politics I know most people do mean well by wearing them.

I never wore badges and lanyards and logos at work myself. I don't like making declarations of allegiance at work. I am proud to wear a plain lanyard with my employer logo on it because (to me) that says I will do my professional best for everyone regardless of their identity, origin, politics, sexuality or state of transition.

I’m a lesbian & I used to love the rainbow flag, but nowadays it feels actively hostile - even if it’s the classic one without all the stuff on top.

I am a bisexual woman, more gay than straight and I hate the rainbow ideology. I wouldn't fly a rainbow flag if you paid me. It's nothing but a negative ideology.

Being gay is normal, the rainvow movement and what they've pushed for (and done to the image of gay people) is not!

And its not the gay and lesbians that have done this. Its the TQ!!

I agree with you OP. I used to love the pride flag but now it's been hijacked by men trying to eradicate women's rights it seems to me more of a symbol of misogyny.

Straight person here (with gay sibling) who sympathises. All the gender BS has no place in the gay space. Old rainbow flag - great! New bullshit flag with the pink and blue chevrons - I want no part of it.

I agree OP - but until enough of the LGB groups under the control of the rainbow umbrella stand together and say 'not inour name' then it's going to continue.

I get you op. Growing up on the 90's I remember very open vile discrimination from gay men against lesbians.
Now very problematic men want access to female spaces.

Why doesn't the LGB community do something about it?

Some have done.
They formed their own charity. The LGB Alliance which was taken to the charities commission by the rainbow people to try and have its charity status revoked as it didn't include the TQ+.

Others like Mr Menno do a lot of work for LGB groups/people

Some try. And get kicked out of gay spaces for it!

Rainbows will always mean Greenpeace to me, they nabbed it first and it's burnt into my brain.

Their ship "The Rainbow Warrior" still sails the seas.

I think Tanya de Grunwald has discussed this on a recent podcast: some in the corporate sector reverted to the "old fashioned" (not omnibus) rainbow flag in June this year - job done. Very elegant solution.

Having said that, @NoLoveLeftForRainbows, your not displaying any partisan symbols is an even better solution for individuals. "I will do my professional best for everyone regardless of ..." is spot-on.

Too late to edit the above, but I've found where Tanya tells Graham Linehan about the rainbow flag during Pride: Go to about 12:30.

Totally agree. The newly alphabetised crowd have buggered things up for mainstream gay people.

My hackles are up at the sight of a rainbow flag or lanyard now because I suspect the wearer thinks blokes in frocks are women and that they use one of a million meaningless terms for subsections of sexual orientation mostly created to make the person identifying as such “special”.

That said, I’m sick of flags in general these days and bloody tribalism.

I completely agree. I read two amazing articles about the Lionesses and Red Roses showing fantastic representation of lesbians. Sadly both articles finished with a paragraph about how trans women weren’t included and it wasn’t fair. I don’t agree with trans women in women’s sport so instead of sharing the mostly great articles with family and friends I had to delete them.

One of the headlines that popped up on my news feed was something

"The women's world cup has 54 Queer players"

I did wonder if they thought to ask the players if that was how they wanted to be labeled.

I agree with you too OP

The very idea that biological men who identify (what ever that means) as women and date women are lesbians just throws away the protections for biologically female lesbians.

I do not understand why people support this ideology.

Agree, OP. I don't agree with trans ideology at all, but LGB people still face a lot of discrimination around the world; we need to be aware of that and have solidarity with them. We're lucky enough to have been born in countries that treat gay people with dignity, but not everyone does, and thus a gay rights movement is still needed. People who are gender critical often forget about this.

However, I don't understand why there's so many flags, pins, lanyards etc. In countries like the UK. In my country of origin, flags of any type are way less prevalent. Sometimes the constant flags (of any type) make one feel more excluded... So while I support the rainbow flag, I could do with less flags/pins/lanyards in general.

This has just popped up again on my timeline.
And I have recently made this point to a friend.

Where I used to work they bought in some rainbow lanyards.
The purpose of these was so that they could be given to those that wanted to make a safe space for LGBTQ+ people.
Either being a person that they could approach or that they ran a club/safe space area.

However, all of the management team took the lanyards.
As far as I can tell they did this so that they could prove that they supported LGBTQ+ yet they don't do anything except show the lanyards.

What should be a good idea, has become pointless due to those that have centred the idea on them and not those that they should be supporting.

I read a comment on here the other day that someone was given a rainbow badge to wear at work for pride month and refused to wear it because of the gender ideology association
So do you think that was wrong? That they should have had to wear it?

I hear the frustration, and some of it resonates with me even though I come at this differently.
You've built a family, you've taught your children to be proud of who they are, and now the symbol of that pride feels like it's being pulled in directions you didn't sign up for. That's a real loss, and it makes sense to grieve it.
I have a trans daughter. So I'm not going to agree that trans identities are simply ideology or that they have nothing to do with the rainbow flag's history. Trans people, particularly trans women of colour, were part of the fight from the beginning. That's historical fact, even if the current discourse feels very different from Stonewall.
But I think you're pointing at something real when you talk about certain kinds of identity claims that seem more about social positioning than lived experience. I've noticed it too. And I think it's possible to hold both things: that my daughter's identity is genuine and deserving of support, AND that not every claim made under the trans umbrella is equally serious or coherent.
The question I'd put back to you is this: does stepping away from the flag actually protect your family, or does it cede ground to people whose interpretations you disagree with? The rainbow meant something before this current moment and it will mean something after. You could also choose to hold onto it and define what it means in your household.
What do your children make of all this? Are they encountering these tensions yet?

It must be really difficult, OP. If it helps, i have had it up to here (imagine my hand raised right above my head) with everything that comes after the LGB and have reverted to the old rainbow flag whenever i feel the need to display allyship.

If more of us did this it may help?