Trans daughter

[Shouldibefedup]

Obviously I love them, but I am being judged as transphobic by friends, and my child. Nothing I can do or say will convince people otherwise.
help!

Why are you being judged as transphobic?

Who knows. That’s what is so difficult. I obviously don’t want my child to take testosterone, apparently I should be delighted . They are 19

Does she know the side effects of taking testosterone? Like from proper sources not Reddit…it’s really not pretty. 95% likelihood of incontinence for example

Good communication is key, and your daughter isn’t helping by calling you names.

Your ‘friends’ need to mind their beeswax, too.

Keep her close, and make sure she knows you’re 100% on her side.
Can you get her out in the fresh air, or just spend some time together, per se?

If you post in the feminism board you might get some helpful replies. It's a difficult situation to navigate. There's nothing transphobic about being concerned for her safety and it's better for her to know the facts before taking any action. Many of these steps are irreversible and have long term consequences so it's not something you can dip in and out of. I'm coming from the perspective of someone who thinks this whole thing is very dangerous, and that it's not a magic pill to fix yourself. Many people who transition regret it and feel they were misinformed and often mislead about the dangers. It's become an idealogy and equated with being gay when it's actually a psychological problem that needs to addressed firstly with therapy. Helen Joyce is amazing for putting across the facts of the matter in a calm, kind, logical way. look up her videos on YouTube. Any interview with her is great and a voice of reason in this cloud of madness.

One piece of advice I heard her give to parents whose children come to them with this problem is

1. Make it clear to them that out of everyone in the world you are one who only wants the best for them and that your intentions are good.
2. Explain that these actions can have long term harmful consequences that she mightn't have considered and that she needs to not do anything she can't undo until she's thought about it a lot. (I'm not an expert at all, just a concerned parent so best to look up more info- imo she should do masses of therapy and look into the facts, and not to be swept up in what others think she should do, there is no rush and it's important to be careful). (my opinion again, but I don't believe that this many people in society could suddenly all be transgender, I think it's a social contagion. Certainly a small percentage are but there are so many who regret going down this route and feel lied to, who were either gay, autistic or troubled somehow and thought this would be the answer to their problems)

Best of luck. Hope she is able to see you are on her side and want what's best for her and that she doesn't rush in to anything. xx

We are in an almost identical situation and have been for the last year OP.

We have also been called transphobic by our child and I’m sure some of our friends have thought that but haven’t said it. What we are could not be further from the truth, if this was somebody else’s child we would use whatever name or pronouns we were asked to use and wouldn’t think too deeply about it. We would probably do what numerous teachers up and down the country are doing and be kind and supportive However, as it is our own child we are in the unenviable position of having to research this topic in order to educate ourselves and try to prevent our autistic young person from irreversible harm.
One year on, all I can tell you is that I have not been able to find anything concrete to suggest that there is such a thing as being born in the wrong body. However, there is plenty of evidence for the harmful effect of trauma, sexual abuse and bullying on one’s identity and Neurodivergence adds another layer of complexity onto this.
As far as I can tell medicine seems to be split down the middle on this issue with some doctors affirming without question and others being critical. The NHS in general seems to be very affirming as are all of the private gender clinics, who seem to be motivated by money and do not take a holistic approach.
The only advice I can give you is to maintain and strengthen your connection with your child. Make sure they know, as a previous poster said, that you are the one person in this world who has their best interests at heart and that you will never abandon them.
Good luck OP. You are not alone in this impossible and heartbreaking position.
The only positives I can see are that the recent Supreme Court ruling made it easier for people to speak out and speak up. And the Cass Report offers some hope of holistic care going forward.
In the way that someone on a different thread likened anorexia to an extreme form of self harm, this too seems to be the same 😢

Thank you so very much. Your long and thoughtful posts are REALLY appreciated.
I need to read them again when I’m not quite so tired and overwhelmed.

it’s just nice to know I’m not alone. I have been having therapy which was going ok, I thought, but I seem to have spent the last two sessions justifying my viewpoint on trans issues - again I feel judged. I feel like I need to say the right thing.

ive just noticed she’s got she her on her email thingy. Should I be wary? Should I not see her? See how muddling this is.

The Gender: A Wider Lens podcast is really helpful, it’s on YouTube and Spotify x

You can't do anything about it as she is an adult. So the time has come to put your feelings aside and support her go with to appointments , call her whatever she wants to be called and start learning how to have s relationship with the new version of your child or lose her

There is a very good chance that your counsellor/therapist believes in gender identity theory. And, yes, declaring pronouns in emails signals either belief in gender identity theory OR that they haven't thought about it much - neither of these is useful to you.

You might benefit from support from this website:
https://www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/

I hope it works out for you and your daughter.

I second the recommendation of Bayswater Support Group, and if you want/need any stats, data and studies, then this site is helpful - there is a section on testosterone and other topics that will be relevant.

Testosterone really is a potent drug for female to take.

Stats for Gender - Providing reliable and accessible information on gender and transition.

As for your counsellor, honestly, I wouldn't continue with that individual, you shouldn't have be feeling judged or having to justify yourself. That is the opposite of what counselling or therapy should be.

Thank you. Unfortunately daughter is at college. So hard to talk.

Yes of course because no one ever in the history of the world got something wrong or made a poor choice. Have you heard of Kiera Bell?

OP, please get in touch with Bayswater Support Group and practice watchful waiting. Try to remain calm and focus just on your relationship with your child. I freaked out, immediately researched detransitioners and stats and tried to argue my child out if it. It was pointless and counterproductive. I have now quietly maintained a line that you cannot change sex and should not medicalise a healthy body if pressed to express a view.

Is your child also autistic? Adopting this identity is very common among autistic girls.

nightmare2022 thank you for this.
the post from you, maddy confused me - I’m muddled, as part of me is pleased she is finding her identity, a lot of me is concerned at how she’s doing it. I also really would rather she didn’t take testosterone, its so dangerous, and I would really rather she wasn’t being heavily influenced by her peers - and college. I’m all knotted up. It’s like she’s decided to take heroin and all the teachers and doctors who I’d normally trust to safeguard my child are saying how great! inject this! Mum you should celebrate!

I am reasesrching madly too - thankyou for the links everybody. But that has gone against me too. I’m not allowed to find out more - it’s transphobic - I have to be really delighted. But when I read trans or detrnsitioner threads on Reddit, I’m heartbroken for these young people.
thank you for putting my confused views into words so succinctly - I get all muddled as there’s the teenage girls then there’s old blokes and it all gets lumped together.
I will repeat ‘you cannot change sex and shouldn’t mutilate s healthy body ( for a fad).
Shes not autistic but has been through a lot.
Thank you, reading Bayswater amazing people

I’m all knotted up. It’s like she’s decided to take heroin and all the teachers and doctors who I’d normally trust to safeguard my child are saying how great! inject this! Mum you should celebrate!

This explains it perfectly

Maybe emphasise to her that her brain is still developing and doesn’t finish developing until age 25, so perhaps best to not do anything permanent until then. You are the sane adult in the room here. Be patient and listening too. But it’s fine to occasionally point out the disadvantages.

Thank you. Unfortunately even hinting at the disadvantages has caused a breakdown in communication.

@Shouldibefedup

Ok, so in your shoes, and depending exactly what has been said by both parties, I think I would offer an olive branch and say you’re sorry for how you’ve handled things up to now and that you’d really like to open up the communication again and understand how they are feeling.

More advice here if you’ve not already read this particular page on the website

That all said, if she is literally shutting down at the mere hint of reasonable questions then would a written communication work?

www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/toptentips/

Thank you so much everyone, and leafstamp that sounds like a good plan. I will read the link, make notes and discuss with my therapist. I can’t believe I’ve just written this! I’ve also deleted what was becoming a long and confused post.
thanks everyone

Good luck poster, I hope you're able to find a way to positively move forward with whatever your adult child ends up deciding to do.

Hey OP. Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but if your child wants to take testosterone then they're probably not identifying as a girl and yet you keep referring to them as "her" and "daughter". I could just be missing context but maybe this is why people are calling you transphobic? You don't need to immediately be on board with your child taking testosterone – it's a massive change and one that should be considered properly, but misgendering your child only harms them. I would also heavily stay away from Bayswater, and honestly mumsnet in general for topics like this. I don't know anyone who has used Bayswater and still has a good relationship with their kid. This side of mumsnet is mostly full of transphobes who care more about their own reputation than their children's wellbeing.

Whether you like it or not, your child is an adult now and you will not get a say in what they do unless they trust you, so the best thing you can do is keep an open mind and let them know you care about them

I myself am trans.
my mum guessed when I young I wasn’t “normal”
she kept asking and asking me till I mentally broke down and told her, she supported me tremendously and bond in family for each to be happy helped so much

I have a friend (AFAB) who has had a complicated journey with their gender identity. They are in their late(r) 40s now. In the last 5 years, they've started to take Testosterone as part of their journey with their identity.

Now I'm not saying I understand it and their case is particularly complex because they do not identify as trans. More like agender or non-binary. They date men. But what is undeniable is that their mental health has improved dramatically since taking "T". They aren't even sure why but they report feeling at their optimum. They definitely feel like their body needed more T than they had.

And yes, their appearance has changed, but I don't think they look like a man. You might assume they are a gay woman though.