My daughter is identifying as trans 6 months after sexual assault

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Hi, so unfortunately in March my daughter was raped. It was at a party that I didn't even know she was at. She's 14. Before this she was happy and confident and doing well but since then she's a lot more withdrawn and unfortunately spends most of her time in her room not wanting to interact with anyone. Obviously this is understandable as she went through something that noone should have to. This weekend she told me that she thinks she's trans. I am fairly liberal and generally accepting of LGBT people but I am very sceptical of her being trans. Prior to this happening, she showed no signs of being trans and I think a lot of this can be explained by what happened. I think she thinks basically had she been a boy then this wouldn't have happened, which is true, and so she wishes she was and she feels uncomfortable with her body because of it. I think she kind of wants a fresh start and new identity and something to blame her problems on. I don't know if this makes sense. She wants us to affirm her as trans but I don't think she is and I worry that doing so will make it hard for her to change her mind. She has been having counselling and she is keen to go to these sessions but she doesn't want to talk about them after, and she says her counsellor has agreed that she is trans. I messaged Mermaids about this earlier and the person I talked to was quite dismissive of this. They said that lots of trans people have trauma from the past that makes people doubt that they are, but that they are almost always trans and it's almost always unrelated just makes people doubt them. Tbh I seemed very unsure about this and have done quite a lot of research since about things like the Cass report and her situation sounds similar to some others who didn't turn out to be trans. Also, I read that this might be a good place to ask? Just basically want advice on what I should do to try and help her and what you all think about the situation?

I’m so sorry for what has happened to your daughter. Unfortunately this is not uncommon among females who identify as trans. I’ve read accounts of their experiences, one example that I can recall off the top of my head was one who said what a relief it was to be able to walk past a crowd of men and not feel scared and self-conscious. This was post op double mastectomy. Just to be able to walk freely and not have her body commented on, leered at, made to feel unsafe in.

I think, if it was my daughter, I might be inclined to say that I had looked into transitioning and had read that feeling as if you are trans can be triggered by traumatic events.

I would reassure her that, if she really is trans, then when she’s recovered from the worst of the fears the trauma has created, then her feelings will still be there, and that you will support her then. I would warn her that recovery might take more than a year, and say that for now she can dress as she likes, but that you won’t be supporting any more active transitioning at this stage.

Watchful waiting used to be the gold standard in cases like this, and 80-90% of youngsters recovered from their distress and continued without transitioning.

I would be worried about the counsellor as well, and in particular that your daughter won’t talk to you about the sessions, but I would also be concerned about what will happen if you try to push too far at this stage. The last thing you want is for her to pull away. Those on the internet will almost certainly be telling her you are likely to object. The movement is very anti-parent, unfortunately.

Mothers on Twitter have advised getting their daughters out and about on fun trips anywhere where there is no internet, so camping or day trips, going outside to look at the stars or nature. If you have time to be with her, so she feels safe, it might be a good reintroduction into the world.

You could also contact the Bayswater Support Group for advice. There might be other parents there who can give guidance on what has worked for them.

https://www.bayswatersupport.org.uk

There are a couple of posts above about monitoring internet usage. To add a different spin on this:

Some parents are comfortable with monitoring everything their child does on the internet, others aren't. Neither is perfect parenting and neither is wrong. Arguably, our most important job as parents is to protect our children while equipping them with the skills for adulthood. How we do it will be very personal to our own parenting approach e.g. for example some may set technology parameters while respecting their child's privacy and teaching them about critical thinking, others may monitor all use. Some may even stop their internet usage all together (that's how Erin Friday chose to approach things when her daughter declared a trans identity) in certain circumstances, others may think this in itself would be detrimental to how their child engages with the world.

The influence of the internet in helping children and young people believe that they are trans, when in fact they may be confused/distressed about their changing bodies during puberty or showing a trauma response after sexual assault, is massive and shouldn't be underestimated. But equally, there is another risk that a child will find their parent overbearing or will lose trust in them. There is a lot of info out there that says if a parent is not affirming your new identity, they are a threat to you and you should go no contact.

Another way to approach it could be to assume your daughter is accessing all of this information and that there are people in contact with her who are encouraging her to view a trans identity as the right answer for her. Some people on these forums may suggest a cautious approach (e.g. starting with "just pronouns" to see if that helps) but invariably the advice is the same: if that didn't help, why not try the next step (e.g. breast/chest binding)....? And so on, along the affirmation pathway.

I spent quite a bit of time on the same forums my daughter was likely to be accessing to see what was being said. This was back when I had no idea that there were places I could go to for information on it from a different viewpoint. It really is everywhere, not just the dark corners of the internet like Reddit e.g. the NPCC has a chat forum where children are sharing advice on how to access "gender affirming care".

IMO the most important things are to a) mitigate the impact of this bias as much as possible but without compromising your own parenting values and b) prioritise your daughter's mental health. She has clearly been through a huge trauma with this sexual assault. As part of prioritising her mental health, in addition to trauma support which is neutral on the subject of gender identity, maintaining your relationship with her and her trust in you is paramount.

Also, I echo RedToothBrush's caution above about Mermaids. I'd give them a wide berth, personally. Excellent advice above from PriOn1 too.

Thanks, I will look at the links. I have been doing more research since. Tbh this wasn't really something I was very aware of before. I do think it's best to just try and avoid talking about the trans stuff but it's hard as she is just unwilling to talk to me about other things. Hopefully with time then the trans thing will just go away I guess

We have filters on our wifi but I guess lots of things won't be covered by them. It does feel intrusive to look through what she is doing and I don't see what to do without doing that. She seems unwilling to come out and do stuff now which I do understand and you can't really force her

One of the features of trans ideology is precisely because it enables avoidant type behaviour and entrenches it.

This means its difficult to tackle certain issues because to try to do so is to be 'transphobic'. This isn't right.

It thus enables a state of denial and detachment from issues within identity politics (and which still remain regardless of identity) without resolutions. It just saves up problems for later down the line.

Its encouraging anxiety related responses because of this. Avoidance behaviour is a type of anxiety related behavior - it is the flight component, and the argumentative response is the fight response.

In this sense, it is possibly worth framing like this and saying that regardless of her identity these issues and these response patterns don't go away and she does need to consider this and deal with it.

Its about addressing behaviour not identity ultimately. See the behaviour for what it is. If it would be not ok in someone without a trans identity, it remains not ok for someone with a trans identity. Because equality and treating everyone the same despite identity.

Thanks! She is so unwilling to talk about it properly with me and when I ask her she just says something like "I just know I am." I thought she was at least having this conversation with her therapist, but it sounds now like she is not doing the right things but at least she likes talking to her. I feel like she wouldn't want to see a different therapist which I understand, since I know it takes time to build up that relationship. I guess I just need to keep trying and hopefully it will help. I'm pleased it worked with your daughter and hopefully it will also with mine. It's just hard to talk to her about it or feel like there is any progress

In addition to some of the excellent advice above, could you have a conversation with her around understanding that she wants to reject her femininity etc after what she has been through but she can do that without being trans. She can reject all norms of femininity if that makes her feel better but it doesn't have to be as extreme as identifying as a different gender.

There is more than one way to be a woman.

Sorry if this is obvious, I'm certainly no expert on this but was just my initial thought when I read your post.

I hope your daughter is ok whatever happens, what an awful ordeal for her.

I was surprised at what they said. I have screenshots if that helps with anything?

Thanks, this is a good idea. She was quite feminine before this happened which is partly why it's a shock but I think it would be good to make it clear now

Yes thats AMAZING.

That reads like its grooming you. Its absoluetely APPALLING and totally at odds with the Cass Review. Its minimising your concerns, not listening and just generally telling you at every step you must affirm and not ask questions. It is NOT a neutral position. It is at odds with the NHS position.

Its totally cult like.

I genuinely think that needs to be passed on to the charity commission and possibly others because of that. Hannah Barnes (on twitter as hannahsbees) who worked for Newsnight and wrote Time to Think, maybe a good person to forward to. She's a journalist who has proved herself to be reputatable and sensitive to issues and has massive concerns about girls like your daughter. (Without her I doubt Cass would have happened).

That text has actually shocked me. And I didn't think Mermaids could shock me further.

OP I am so sorry your daughter has been put through this trauma and I am so sorry that you as a parent have had to go through the pain of this too.
Just echoing the contacting Bayswater advice re the trans discussion.
I was also wondering if you could approach your daughter’s GP for further support, because she sounds like she isn’t coping, even with the help of this counsellor?

The GP could offer various approaches including maybe referring your DD for social prescribing for outdoor or gentle exercise and also potentially to other groups or counsellors for emotional support.

I wonder if that might help to gently make the point in a supplementary way, not taking anything away from the support she is currently getting, but just highlighting that the form of support this counsellor is currently offering your daughter- affirmation- is really not the only way to respond to an understandable absolute crisis of self and identity, after someone has had the violation of being sexual assaulted or raped.

A lot - not all - of that chat sounded like AI.

Maybe just because it's very scripted.

I'm so sorry you and your daughter are going through this, OP.

Mermaids have already been in hot water for giving/not giving medical advice in a court case.

They say on their website

https://mermaidsuk.org.uk/frequently-asked-questions-2/#:~:text=Mermaids%20does%20not%20encourage%2C%20influence,does%20not%20give%20healthcare%20advice.

Does Mermaids offer healthcare advice?
Mermaids does not encourage, influence or direct young people, their families or professionals involved in their care to pursue any one pathway. When people seek advice on healthcare, we signpost to relevant, trusted organisations such as the NHS.

Mermaids does not give healthcare advice. We may provide general information on NHS clinical pathways, but are not involved in the provision of medical care or in advising around whether a medical pathway is appropriate for an individual.

The above screenshot is not consistent with what they are saying on their website.

That poor thing. I can see why she would want to opt out of being female and have a new identity.

Has she been receiving any other therapy or help related to the trauma? Perhaps it is worth finding out if there are other counsellors or options available for help and to stop the existing one if you think this road she's going down will be harmful.

Such a lot for a young person to take on. And changing counsellor might be something she doesn't want to do if she's happy with her therapy, but it's important for it to be healing and not damaging and cause her even more problems.

Is she away from the people at the party, and out of contact and reach particularly of the person who is responsible. The less she has to escape in her every day life then the less she will be looking for an escape hatch like this. Your poor daughter, this is a horrible situation for her to have to deal with and understandable that she doesn't know what to do so might go down an avenue that might cause her all kinds of other issues.

I dont know if it's that bad but I was quite surprised at what they were saying. I don't have Twitter and I'm quite busy atm too, but if you want to share it with anyone then that's fine

I think referring you to GALOP, which is specifically for LGBT people, and to a support group for trans parents , is a bit inappropriate given the circumstances.

Thank you for sharing.

What struck me - having made this mistake originally and allowed my DD to legally change her name, to a something non-gendered fortunately - was the way you were advised that adopting pronouns and new name were reversible/impermanent. Indeed, legally they are, but they are not a benign act (as detailed in the Cass Report, hence the push for schools etc NOT to socially transition children without parental consent and involvement, if at all). As soon as you validate an identity by acceding to these you back the into a corner. It becomes harder for them to reverse out of a position because they will fear losing face.

Always better to advise that they can cut hair, wear boyish clothes - all of which ARE reversible and not really gendered (look at Mia Farrow and Annie Lennox etc), but may offer your DD a way of presenting that makes her feel less visible or sexed - ie makes her feel safe and less vulnerable while she is working stuff out.

I am so sorry for your daughter. What a terrible thing to happen to her.

Is her counsellor expert on rape and sexual assault? She should not be affirming your 14 year old daughter who has been raped is trans.

Ignore Mermaids whatever you do. That is essential.

The counsellor should not be confirming she is trans as that would be confirming there is something wrong with her body. She could be accepting of your DD without confirming.

Of course she is not trans but looking for a way out from what happened to her body because she is female. Who wouldn’t want that?

It must be very important to her now to feel in control, though, and it would not work to force your views on her, but somehow you need to hold her up without affirming the false.

I wish I knew better what advice to give but I would say keep her away from phones and computers. Try to get out doing physical things that balance the mind and body. Might she like riding for example?

I don't have any any answers I'm afraid.

However, my DD often experiences body dysphoria. This started at secondary school due to bombardment of sexualised attention from boys - usually dismissed by staff, even though the schools claimed to have zero tolerance policies. Last year she was raped by her boyfriend and chose not to go to the police - I believe this is partly on school & college as they normalized assaults.

She mostly wears baggy clothes that cover her from neck/wrist/ankle, but even then gets a great deal of misogynistic attention where we live. Even in this hot weather she prefers to wear oversized hoodies to hide herself away. I have suggested some pretty tunics but she feels they aren't plain enough.

She often won't leave the house due to the catcalling from boys of secondary/College age. She does also have poor MH (which she takes medication for). She will often rant about how vile all men are. I usually point out while there are many b*tardos out there, we do know several men of varying ages who are lovely - and who model healthy relationships in their behaviour and the way they treat females.

Thankfully she's not fully captured yet. At times she thinks she may be trans, but after time to reflect, she usually comes to the conclusion that the way she feels is a response to boys' behaviour - and that treatment won't solve the problem. She tells me she's looking forward to being menopausal (like me), as she feels she "will give less fucks, like you mum" it will bother her less then.

Forgot to say, my daughter often buys things to try and give her a flatter shape under her clothes, again to give her a less feminine shape.

They also want "a boy's haircut", which backfired a bit as it actually makes them look more gamine/feminine.

It's such a shame to see the hatred she has for her sex at times, and worrying.

Best wishes to your daughter.

Can you move her to an all girls school?

That might help her with make attention and feeling like she has to escape being female.

I'm sorry to hear what you and your daughter are going through.
Idk if this has already been suggested but have you read When Kids Say They're Trans? whenkidssaytheyretrans.com
It suggests alternatives to affirmation.
The podcast Gender: a Wider Lens is also good.

I've now read the Mermaids screenshots.

There are a few points that jump out, OP:

1. Towards the start of the conversation you asked whether it was common for girls who had experienced sexual assault to subsequently identify as trans... and were told no, not really. Then by the end, you were told that there were lots of other parents in your situation whose daughters identify as trans after assault.
2. you are being urged to get her in to a counselling service that is recommended by Mermaids ASAP. Obviously this would be a counsellor who would affirm any trans identity as a starting point, then explore from there. This would therefore never be a neutral exploration of your daughter's distress as it is biased from the start.
3. you are also being encouraged on to an affirmation pathway: "take it step by step", "we're here every step of the way". As has been mentioned above, the Cass Report was very clear that social transition isn't a neutral act because it can lead to identities being locked in. On the point I told my daughter that I was happy for her to cut her hair, wear "boys' clothes" and use a neutral sounding nickname at school (plenty of girls do both these things) but there would be no change to her status until she had fully explored all of her feelings about her body - in my daughter's case it was her distress about puberty, linked to her autism.
4. you're told that "we won't push", yet there is a phrase used more than once which is very coercive (because it sets the parent up to feel guilty): "if they say they're trans, they're probably trans". If a teenager is wondering if they're gay, I can see why this phrase would work (if someone thinks/says they're gay, they're probably gay) but discovering your sexuality is nothing to do with how you feel about your own body. Unfortunately the conflation of T with LGB introduces an uncertainty where the net effect is to think you might be attacking someone's core, innate self if you don't accept a stated trans identity without question. Even if you've got other concerns e.g. it's following sexual assault, the child is autistic and distressed about their changing body etc.

Reading all of this, I'm now reflecting on my very first conversation with someone from my LGBT network at work. I've mentioned on other threads on MN (not on this board) that I found this network really helpful when I was learning about everything, and a couple of people in particular. I hadn't really given the first person I spoke to much thought until now. On reflection, it was a similar "sales pitch". I was told how important it was for my daughter to have access to a recommended counsellor as soon as possible (I received a list), that I could contact the network to arrange specialist LGBT training at my daughter's school (and that it was really important to do this sooner rather than later) and that it would be helpful for me to demonstrate to her how accepting I was of LGBT people. The only thing I did immediately after that call was make a start on the last point. The rest felt too pushy.

Firstly I'm so sorry this has happened to your daughter. How absolutely devastating.

You have had some excellent advice here, and I am horrified at the mermaids conversation. Your instincts are spot on. I would have a conversation with her counsellor and remind them of Cass and her recommendations. She should not be affirming you daughter and it needs a conversation.

The other advice I have is to set up stringent controls on her phone. She is likely to be on all kinds of forums as PP mentioned, all of which will be affirming her as trans. I know you will be worried as it's all she's got at the moment but she is incredibly vulnerable to grooming. A friend of mine who was in a similar position said her one wish is that she'd taken her daughter's phone off her at night and kept stringent controls on what she could look at. Talk to your daughter about what she is doing on her phone and be non judgemental about it. Encourage her to open up about what sites she uses and who she is talking to. Use parental controls that are built into phones or get an app so you can keep an eye on what she is doing. I know at 14 they really want their privacy and autonomy so this will likely be difficult.

As previous posters have said, try to talk to her about these feelings being a response to trauma and sexual assault. You could try Bayswater for support from other parents.