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LGBT children

This board is primarily for parents of LGBTQ+ children to share personal experiences and advice. Others are welcome to post but please be respectful that this is a supportive space.

Son wants to become a girl. His moods are killing me.

46 replies

Rgh254 · 17/06/2024 11:08

My son (17) has for some time expressed a wish to become a girl. I won't lie, initially I thought it was a fad that would fade however its increasingly clear that he really is struggling with his gender and the wish to be a girl.
We went to our GP who was supportive but basically sign posted us to charities and told DS to access counselling through his education provider.
His college said they didn't have capacity to help him so I spoke to a private advisor about everything just to try and get my head around it all and understand what the process is. They advised that the Cass review means now thar under 18s are unable to access any gender blockers or hormones and if he wanted to go ahead with the process he would be able to get a private prescription but we'd need to fly outside of the UK to obtain the drugs.
I advised DS given this new information it's not financially viable. We can not afford to fly to Dublin every 3 months to get his prescription and pay for the medication and that we need to wait another year until he's 18 to be able to do this legally in the UK.
That was a couple of weeks ago and he's barely talking to me. He's angry and mean and moody. I'm exhausted with the person he is becoming and whilst I completely understand that he must be going through hell right now with how he's feeling (he hates the body hair and how his body is becoming more and more masculine) I can't continue to be his emotional and verbal punch pag. He's in trouble at college and is on the verge of being kicked out. He's absolutely miserable. He's been secretly drinking. I'm very worried about him but he is pushing everyone away.

I don't know how to help him and I don't want to continue being treated the way I am being treated- it's making me extremely depressed. I dread having to get him up for college in the morning. He's so angry with me every day. He gets in trouble at college for not doing work/following instructions but can't ever gauge that it's his own fault for not checking his college messages or asking for help. He has a test later where he has to talk about something for 5 mins, but has made no efforts to prepare a speech. He has no gcses because so no one will employ him. I don't know how to help him and I feel like saying sod it, if you can't speak to me and treat me with kindness and dignity then I'm not advocating or having your back anymore. But I can't do that because I'm also scared he will do something stupid with how low he is. I feel trapped.
I'm trying go not make this about myself but it's so incredibly hard living with someone who treats you like that. His father was very emotionally abusive and controlling and it triggers all those awful memories and experiences. I feel suffocated.

OP posts:
Tipsyscripsy · 17/06/2024 18:01

Midgegreenstreet · 17/06/2024 15:00

I am in a similar position but with a child over 18. I love him but won't be gaslighted into pretending he can ever be anything other than male. I find reading the stories on www.pittparents.com helps me feel less alone and the support of other parents through the Gender Dysphoria Support Network have kept me sane.

Personally I wouldn't use an affirming therapist because it hides any comorbidities/other problems your son has got and means they won't be addressed. Bad therapy is worse than no therapy. I'd focus on improving your relationship, not affirming (avoid pronouns and new names) and wait. Most young people desist. Meanwhile think about your own mental health.

Fucking hell

WomenStuff · 17/06/2024 18:09

You have had great suggestions already.

It might help if you clarify to yourself where the line is. For me personally, it would be:

Names, clothing, hobbies, grooming etc = encourage son to express himself however he chooses.

Pronouns = your son will have been told online that people who won't use his preferred pronouns hate him and wish him dead. This is a horrible lie to tell a child and I would not collude with it. Out diverse society is full of people who don't share the same beliefs. With tolerance, we can all coexist peacefully.

Hormones and surgery. = is your son aware of Alan Turing? He was injected with female hormones as a form of chemical castration; a punishment for being gay when it was illegal in the '50s. It's really difficult because at 18 your son becomes an adult in the eyes of the law but our brains don't fully mature until mid 20s and your son could very much come to regret causing permanent harm to his body chasing what is essentially an impossible dream. Your son might be interested to learn about the growing trend of middle aged male transwomen: this cohort transitions for very different reasons to your son but one of the things they campaign for is that a person doesn't need hormones or surgery to be trans.

Do you have any gay or non stereotypically masculine male friends or family? So your son could feel it's ok to be a non macho gay man. That there is a place in the world for him too.

WomenStuff · 17/06/2024 18:18

ThatOpenSwan · 17/06/2024 14:01

Well first of all, you have a daughter, so maybe show her some basic respect and acknowledge that? Second of all, of course she's miserable - it's not your fault that the medical treatment for trans youth in this country is pathetically lacking, and it's valid to say that it's too expensive to do it privately, but given those two facts there's no easy answer to help her at the moment, and all you can do is be on her side (and again, starting by at least using her pronouns and asking if she has a preferred name, etc. would probably be a little bit of a help). Find out what she needs and what she thinks would help.

Please treat her better.

It's ok to be gay.

Gay boys don't need hormones that impact their fertility and sexual function. They don't need surgery to pretend they're not men.

It's ok to be non macho, not stereotypically masculine. Perhaps it's even good to be like this? Perhaps if there were more like OP's son and if those boys and men felt accepted by our society, rather than rejected, the world would be a gentler place?

The only people who lose out if we decide to accept humans that don't conform to regressive gender stereotypes are those who profit from the drugs and the surgeries.

SquirrelSoShiny · 17/06/2024 18:25

I'm sorry your son is going through this and has the misfortune to be 17 in the current climate. Is he neurodivergent? Literally every trans person I have ever met is neurodivergent and / or gay and struggling with internalised homophobia. You need to get him to a therapist but in the meantime let him know that you love him but he needs to understand you are not his emotional punchbag.

OkPedro · 17/06/2024 18:33

SleepPrettyDarling · 17/06/2024 14:56

I am in Ireland and didn’t know there was a clinic in Dublin prescribing to u18s. I’m very perturbed by this.

Apparently loughlinstown hospital

Midgegreenstreet · 17/06/2024 19:19

Tipsyscripsy · 17/06/2024 18:01

Fucking hell

What's that supposed to mean? I'm a bad parent because I don't want a child who has mental health problems to make permanent changes to their body? I've supported him in every other aspect of his life since he was born but I don't believe this will make him happier and there is very little medical evidence to suggest it would.

FlabMonsterIsDietingAgain · 17/06/2024 19:44

Has he been assessed for anything other than Gender Dysphoria, did the GP look for signs of depression, anxiety, autism, ADHD or anything else at all other than gender distress.

It's been shown repeatedly that gender distress often goes hand in hand with other conditions and that often exploring and treating those can be helpful.

Tipsyscripsy · 17/06/2024 21:18

Midgegreenstreet · 17/06/2024 19:19

What's that supposed to mean? I'm a bad parent because I don't want a child who has mental health problems to make permanent changes to their body? I've supported him in every other aspect of his life since he was born but I don't believe this will make him happier and there is very little medical evidence to suggest it would.

Why would you choose to cause your child pain like this?

I simply can’t fathom it

FlabMonsterIsDietingAgain · 17/06/2024 21:51

@Tipsyscripsy the entire world of medicine, psychology and psychiatry can't come to a common understanding and agreement about what the best form of treatment is for people with gender dysphoria, so why are you so convinced that affirmation and medical treatment is the right choice?

We are seeing real life accounts of people in their 20s who had body parts removed and took hormones that have forever changed their voices, hair lines, reproductive health and bone density, then they've realised that they made a mistake and want to go back to the way they were before. But it's too late.

For the sake of a little time and consideration of alternative possibilities, why would anyone argue against a slower and more considered approach?

SquirrelSoShiny · 17/06/2024 22:03

FlabMonsterIsDietingAgain · 17/06/2024 21:51

@Tipsyscripsy the entire world of medicine, psychology and psychiatry can't come to a common understanding and agreement about what the best form of treatment is for people with gender dysphoria, so why are you so convinced that affirmation and medical treatment is the right choice?

We are seeing real life accounts of people in their 20s who had body parts removed and took hormones that have forever changed their voices, hair lines, reproductive health and bone density, then they've realised that they made a mistake and want to go back to the way they were before. But it's too late.

For the sake of a little time and consideration of alternative possibilities, why would anyone argue against a slower and more considered approach?

I think the honest answer to your question is: because some parents are unwilling to be parents. They have unresolved issues from their own childhoods and how they were parented. They think being besties with their kids is the way forward when it's not. Our job as parents is to prepare our children for adult life. I'm not saying that the OP is one of those parents by the way, just parents who automatically affirm their children's every whim.

I remember my friend's son went through a brief phase of shitting in the garden because their puppy did it and he wanted to be a puppy. He was quickly parented into understanding that he would never be a puppy and shitting in the garden was not going to be on his list of acceptable ways to behave. He is now a fine young man who laughs fondly at his four year old self. He wasn't shamed for making a mistake, he was just corrected and parented. No one indulged him or told him that yes of course he could be a puppy and shit in the garden.

I have no idea why we pretend boys can become girls or vice versa. It is cruel and misleading, not kind.

Midgegreenstreet · 17/06/2024 22:10

Tipsyscripsy · 17/06/2024 21:18

Why would you choose to cause your child pain like this?

I simply can’t fathom it

How am I causing him pain? I'm discouraging him from taking a step that could have a catastrophic permanent impact on his physical health and is unlikely to improve his mental health. Have you read the Cass Review? Do you have personal experience of this situation?

We have a good relationship, he knows he's loved, he sent me a card recently thanking me for my support and we're going on holiday together shortly.

Anyway, I don't want to detract from the OPs post. I only wanted to make suggestions that have helped me.

Tipsyscripsy · 17/06/2024 22:11

FlabMonsterIsDietingAgain · 17/06/2024 21:51

@Tipsyscripsy the entire world of medicine, psychology and psychiatry can't come to a common understanding and agreement about what the best form of treatment is for people with gender dysphoria, so why are you so convinced that affirmation and medical treatment is the right choice?

We are seeing real life accounts of people in their 20s who had body parts removed and took hormones that have forever changed their voices, hair lines, reproductive health and bone density, then they've realised that they made a mistake and want to go back to the way they were before. But it's too late.

For the sake of a little time and consideration of alternative possibilities, why would anyone argue against a slower and more considered approach?

I’m convinced that listening to my child and treating them with dignity and respect is the right thing to do.

If your child has told you they want to be referred to in a particular way, and you respond with ‘I won’t be gaslit into thinking this could possibly be real’ the agony your child must feel is devastating.

It is so utterly dismissive. I can understand not agreeing, but to entirely dismiss your child’s wants and wishes seems just unnecessarily cruel.

FlabMonsterIsDietingAgain · 17/06/2024 22:26

My understanding of sex came from science. There is no question amongst any sane and rational people about what sex is. No claptrap about clownfish or twisting of DSDs into a spectrum can overrule what we all know to be fact. There are 2 sexes and no human being can change from one to the other.

Gender is more complicated because language is being constantly redefined around the topic so common understanding of the word is being lost. A dozen years ago and going back well before that gender was a synonym for sex, the polite way of referring to a persons sex without using the vulgar word 'sex'. Now it means something more akin to personality, people seem to be assigning others or themselves a gender based on what colours, patterns they like and if they are flirty or outgoing or quiet or moody and so on. It's heavily based on stereotypes and is seen by many as regressive and somewhat insulting particularly to women who don't fit the stereotypes or don't buy into the gender ideology and so are being defined as non-women.

I have a daughter, she's not 'gender conforming' in that she likes dinosaurs and her favourite colours are blue and green, she prefers clothes that are practical with pockets and made of thick warm fabric so often shops in the boys section. She knows she's a girl, she knows that girls can wear boys clothes, girls can love other girls, girls can do any job they want, sport they want, hobby they want and she knows that girls can never become boys.

SquirrelSoShiny · 17/06/2024 22:58

SquirrelSoShiny · 17/06/2024 22:03

I think the honest answer to your question is: because some parents are unwilling to be parents. They have unresolved issues from their own childhoods and how they were parented. They think being besties with their kids is the way forward when it's not. Our job as parents is to prepare our children for adult life. I'm not saying that the OP is one of those parents by the way, just parents who automatically affirm their children's every whim.

I remember my friend's son went through a brief phase of shitting in the garden because their puppy did it and he wanted to be a puppy. He was quickly parented into understanding that he would never be a puppy and shitting in the garden was not going to be on his list of acceptable ways to behave. He is now a fine young man who laughs fondly at his four year old self. He wasn't shamed for making a mistake, he was just corrected and parented. No one indulged him or told him that yes of course he could be a puppy and shit in the garden.

I have no idea why we pretend boys can become girls or vice versa. It is cruel and misleading, not kind.

@Tipsyscripsy would it be kind and respectful to tell the young man in my example that of course he could be a puppy and shit in the garden? Is it respectful to lie to him? Is it cruel to tell him simple reality?

Don't be so absolutely delusional 🙄 It is possible to be both loving and truthful. Affirming a child in their mental illness is Gaslighting, not being truthful. 'Yes darling, I know you're an anorexic but yes you really are fat, I 100% affirm your right to starve yourself to death!' Parents need to be parents not pals. Allowing a child to make catastrophic choices with unknown longterm consequences is not love and respect but cowardice.

Midgegreenstreet · 18/06/2024 06:27

I listen to my child and treat him with respect. I'm proud of his achievements and tell him so. I just don't believe that taking cross sex hormones is likely to address anxiety and depression, may make his situation worse and in all conscience I can't support it. (All the parents I've met in this situation feel.rhe same way).

If someone you love converts to a religion you don't share you can agree to differ about it but you don't have to stop loving them.

bittertwisted · 18/06/2024 08:04

My partner's son wants to be known as a girl, and has changed name. He has always had long hair and dressed androgynously.
He is also extremely bright, likes to be seen as 'different and not normie'. Not a single other change has occurred in 2 years.
The change came when he went to Oxford, I believe it really is a means of creating a different persona through fear of a huge challenge. As the mother of an autistic child myself it is blatantly obvious he is autistic, which his dad agrees.

However I can't deny his parent's lack of actual parenting astounds me. Never challenged about his obvious and vocal disdain for people who like 'normie' things. Never asked to help, or actually earn a living in his massive uni holidays. Not questioned when he talks Japanese to my kids to make them feel stupid. To me them not having any honest, fact based conversations on gender and sex is another example of their Disney parenting.

I don't express a view, he's not my child, and it causes huge arguments. My partner says why would I not want him to be happy if I try to suggest he can identify and live however he chooses, but he can never biologically be a girl

Rgh254 · 21/06/2024 16:58

ThatOpenSwan · 17/06/2024 14:01

Well first of all, you have a daughter, so maybe show her some basic respect and acknowledge that? Second of all, of course she's miserable - it's not your fault that the medical treatment for trans youth in this country is pathetically lacking, and it's valid to say that it's too expensive to do it privately, but given those two facts there's no easy answer to help her at the moment, and all you can do is be on her side (and again, starting by at least using her pronouns and asking if she has a preferred name, etc. would probably be a little bit of a help). Find out what she needs and what she thinks would help.

Please treat her better.

Your comment is so rude and unnecessary!
My SON is still asking to be referred to as a boy. I check in with him regularly to make sure he is coping ok, I have reassured him that I will love him no matter what. We have talked about his pronouns and he isn't ready to change them yet. I am acting in accordance with what he wants and when he is ready for me to use a different name or pronouns I will follow his lead!
Equally this is incredibly hard for me, I am allowed to vent in a private safe space.

OP posts:
Rgh254 · 21/06/2024 17:02

WitchyBits · 17/06/2024 14:54

Please please please check your Internet safety settings. It's very likely that your son is accessing porn. This exact same gender madness happened with not one but two of my sons and one ended up with a criminal record. All of it, ALL of the horrific shit my family have been through has been traced back to accessing pornograpy and developing a porn addiction as a child/teen.

Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I will have a check of our settings. I don't think my son would be looking at that kind of content for a multitude of reasons but equally who knows. I feel very lost in this whole thing right now.

OP posts:
Rgh254 · 21/06/2024 17:06

LottieMary · 17/06/2024 14:55

Accessing counselling would be helpful if financially possible.
Could they begin to start identifying with you what elements of masculine/feminine they want to feel/exhibit? A lot of men struggle with masculine identity - there’s no reason why is they wish they couldn’t shave/wax, wear more trad feminine clothing and aim to find a style that speaks to them without subscribing to the ultra strong masculinity in vogue at the moment. Is there any way of supporting with that eg shopping experience or something? Not trying to minimise how hard they must be finding it but to think lower cost, less medical intervention that would support them figuring out what they want

addressing some of the educational issues too, the speech sounds like they’re resitting English? If so, they don’t need the speech to do so - they can have a non entry for that element and not miss anything on the grade itself. The two exams are what is required. Have they got career goals or aspirations? Try to encourage that one day they will feel better and more settled and secure, and at that point they’ll want something to fall back on - GCSEs make that happens.

Thank you for your post. We are looking for a therapist at the moment.

He has a few friends who took him shopping. He wears make up and does his hair nice. But this is all very private.
I definitely will be insisting on Therapy before anything further happens as I know when he hits 18 I won't have a say but I want him to make sure he is truly making the right decision before he does anything further.

OP posts:
Rgh254 · 21/06/2024 17:27

Thank you for all the replies.

My son is openly gay but has never had a relationship. He is very very naïve and behind his peers both in his academic abilities and also emotionally. He is autistic too which means he becomes quite obsessed with things and doesn't really see the world in the same way as other people do. I feel like this is one of his current obsessions. I am not minimising it, I don't understand it enough but I do know my son better than anyone else and I know what he is like when he gets an idea into his head.
He has always been quite moody but since the gender questioning this has accelerated.

Its very interesting the point about the correlation between trans people and ND. I can see that now too in the others I have come across. They are all ND.

My son talks very openly to me about most things, we have a very open dialogue in our house. I am lucky in that respect. I think I need to make it clear he has to be respectful to me and stand my ground.

I think for now I will go away, read the links you all shared with me and focus my efforts on finding him the best therapist I can. I think there is a lot to be said about fitting in which I know he feels he never has. We live in a very diverse area, a great scene for young gay people etc and I really hope when he gets the chance to go out into the world and find his tribe, he realises he doesn't need to change genders to fit in. However if that doesn't stop him feeling the way he does then I will continue to support him through this.

OP posts:
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