Trans Child and Autism

[GarbledCopperpot]

Hi. So I have a quandary and looking for advice.

A while ago my DS (17 years old) declared to us that "he is a girl". Very out of the blue. No previous context except for the fact he's resisted haircuts for the past couple of years, and buys the odd pastel shade of clothing. No suggestion of trying to look, or act, in any way other than how one would expect a teenage son to act.

He has since sent us links to gendergp.com - which I understand to be a non-UK, unregulated private provider of hormones and puberty blockers and the like, and has been nudging about it ever since.

A bit of context. He is autistic. As a consequence he is not very social and I would say is socially immature. He has a small group of friends at school (now 6th form) but outside of that he does not socialise, and spends his time on his computer and mobile phone as many a teenager would. I would say he hasn't had the experiences to figure out "who he is".

I am not trans-phobic by any means - I'm in a workplace where D&I is supported - and I have worked with Trans people who have obviously already made the life decision and identify themselves as they do. However, it is my job as a parent to protect my child and, given his social situation, need to make every effort to make sure he doesn't make decisions he may later regret.

We have had a couple of conversations on this subject - we've tried to listen and be both non-confrontational and non-affirming. But what is really clear is that when we ask him to describe feeling etc he finds it very difficult.

He knows there is a very long waiting list for any gender based treatment - and thats why he's been sending links to gendergp etc - and it seems like he feels it's a "shortcut" to where he believes he wants to be - which I gather (though difficult as per conversations above) that he's more of the "whole hog" side rather than something less extreme.

I'm not going to say I don't think what he wants is what he actually wants, but at the same time I don't fully understand (or necessarily agree with) the view and it scares me: -

• It's a long and difficult journey however you look at it
• There are documented links between autism and trans feelings
• I know the number of people wanting to transition has increased exponentially in recent years, pointing to social influences and perhaps "fashion" - without wanting to downplay
• He gets sensitive to bullying - e.g. last week came home upset because someone laughed at him in town taking notes for a project. Obviously during any transition phase (and even at the end), he is going to look "different" and perpetually receive similar and worse reactions.

Despite knowing there's a long list, he hasn't gone to a GP to have an initial conversation and get "on the list". Even if he did go down the gendergp route (which I don't like for obvious reasons), that's still only going to go so far - he'll need the NHS eventually if he is diagnosed as needing further treatment - and even in the beginning for blood tests and the like.

The fact that he can't express his feelings, he doesn't realise that no-one will give him treatment if he can't articulate his feelings - there will (I assume!) be a lot of rigour!

So after that context, what I'm really asking is, what options exist for some unbiased councelling? Someone that can help talk through feelings, understand what it really means. If it's what he really needs to do, whilst I don't "get" it, ultimately I will support it. But I want to do everything I can to make sure he doesn't make an ill-informed mistake.

Thanks

I really feel for your son, it's a tough age and stage for young autistic men and women. My advice would be to find a non-gender-affirming therapist who will actually explore what is going on.

He feels different because he IS different from many of his peers. He thinks being trans will bring him into a kind of cool, glittery social club. I'm not a religious person but I find myself praying for this madness to end so young autistic people can hang out with other young autistic people without having to 'trans' to do so.

It's hard at his age but try and monitor his online consumption.

I am sorry you are going through this. I have been in this situation for years now with autistic dc (ftm). My advice is to ‘hold it lightly’, as therapists say. If you hold it lightly, perhaps he can follow your example? Don’t do what I did and go in all guns blazing with logic and stats and academic papers. I know it’s a shock and it’s hard as a parent. Now I don’t discuss or get drawn into arguments. Although when it all gets too much, there I am screaming ‘you can’t change your sex’ once again. I am autistic too so I have the black and white thinking too, but I’m in the opposite camp. But I focus on the quality of our relationship and making my child feel loved, wanted and accepted and as my dc (18 now) matures they know my view on this and the baiting from them on this topic has become less, although still there. For my birthday there was a strange mixed message. The card was from ‘my son’ on the inside but the hand drawn picture on the front was of me and them as a little girl wearing a dress.

It is a massive deal to your child as he has basically joined a cult. He will be watching on-line propaganda and you will be branded ‘transphobic’ for not rushing him into hormones, etc. it’s a familiar, well-trodden path for parents. You can find more of us in the Bayswater Support Group, at Parents with Inconvenient Truth about Trans substack and on here.

I wanted MN to set up a special space for us parents of trans identifying children but many of us are here for each other on this LGBT board.

I am a parent to a trans dc (f-m), she wants hormone treatment but luckily she can’t afford it, though she’s doing all she can to try including threatening to use her student loan. My dd is also autistic, has a small group of friends that are all LGBTQ+, one of her closest friends is trans and has just started testosterone. It does scare me, I’m happy for her to wear what she wants to wear, be called by what ever name she wants to be called by but I won’t support her putting hormones into her body or having surgery and there’s no way I would help find it.

My personal believe is that transgender is an autism hyper focus and always has been. I’ve worked in and around the field of autism for 25 years. Over the last couple of years I’ve been back and watched tons of videos of older transgender personalities via the internet and can see signs of Asperger’s in every single one (Caitlyn Jenner and Kelly Mahoney are two well known examples)
I am also now in the belief that what used to be the fringe groups such as emo’s / metallers etc, were probably autistic too but we didn’t have the skills to see these different characteristics then.
Im not sure whether that makes things any easier or harder for you and I don’t think this is something that you could truly advise on until you’ve lived it. What we say we’d do with those we love and what we actually do can be very different.
I wish you strength for the journey ahead.

Wizzytimehfv I agree. I have a trans friend and they are obviously autistic, though they won’t admit it. I also have a goth/alternative friend who was recently diagnosed autistic again she was unaware that she was autistic (as she had only met more severely autistic people). I’m on the spectrum too, I like to dress a little quirky and I often get mistaken as a lesbian because I’m not very feminine. I think if all this trans stuff was around when I was a teenager I would have got swept away with it too. It’s just worrying that this cult thing is leading to teenagers taking hormones and permanently damaging their bodies.

Yes, it’s only in the last 3-4 years out of working in autism for 25 years that I have learnt to identify the much more subtle things that means more people are getting diagnosed now. In fact out of 10 girls I went to school with and have known very well, I can now identify autism in 2 of them and even the parent that also had it. (Also their siblings too)
Both had different characteristics but they were all harder work than the others. Sorry to describe to crassly but that’s how it came across as a child / teenager. I would never mention it as they are both undiagnosed. I can see very clearly now that what came across as very demanding/ controlling / dominating / hot and cold behaviour was actually their fear of the unknown / change and their different way of thinking. Both very funny though if they were in right mood!
Anyway, back to the point. Yes, trans is a problem as its life consequences are far more vast than other hyper focuses.
The internet has a huge role to play in this. Very dangerous for everyone really but for a child with a brain programmed to hyper focus… life altering.

My 15yr old autistic son came to me and his dad last year and said he was bi-sexual we had no issue towards his sexuality, he struggles to make friends due to the level of his social skills he has 2 female friends at school, I found out before christmas he has been talking to people on an app called discord which when I found out I was so scared and explained the fact of talking to people on the Internet is not safe and since then he has been talking non stop about being a femboy.... he asked for girl things all the time and my point is I am stuck and don't know how to support him I don't know if its because of my just a lack of understanding or the fear of losing my baby boy (sorry if that sounds daft) I don't know where to start a conversation with him to find out how me and his dad can support him... I am not going to lie this is not how I imagined my son growing up is that bad of me as his mother. Even though my son has wanted for nothing I feel like I am letting him down at the moment and I hate myself for that.

I know this is a very short thread of posts, but wanted to thank you for all of them. I'm having a really tough time with this at the moment, and it's such a relief to find posts that don't assume you're a bigot for being concerned about your autistic child. I'm also wondering if I really have any role/ value in my child's life. After 8 years of advocating fiercely for him, doing everything I can to get him to a place where he feels safe, and it's his father he's talking to about all this. This, despite the fact that it took 7 years for dh to "see" him, and meet him where he is, rather than constant having just one more expectation that ds could ever cope with. I have become a shell of a person, and clearly I've still got it wrong.

Meanwhile, in the most difficult day yet, this thread makes me glad I kept searching.

Thanks again.

It’s such a shame that autistic children are having to substitute real world friendships for the internet. This epidemic of social contagion is tragic. Your son is not trans. He is impressionable and has been viewing too much of this content online which has warped his view of himself. You need to do everything you can to help him realise he isn’t trans.

You’ve all saved my sanity today. I’ve just got off the phone with CAMHS and been given the impression that I’m a transphobe for a) quoting the Cass report re holistic view and b) suggesting that my autistic son who freaked out at puberty (but was Thomas the Tank engine for his childhood - has become the cool trans girl after using Discord and now believe they are trans. Had an Educational Psychologist demand their preferred pronouns were used in their EHCP at age 13/14 after they were not in school in years. Now have confided they don’t know. He sounds exactly like many of your kids - it does not add up. It is a cult.
my son has been in a gay relationship for 2 years totally supported - I think the trans movement is heteronormative and it disgusts me that they have weaponised gender dysphoria (medical) into an identity and have bullied experts etc.
I’m desperately trying to find non affirming care because I don’t feel I can trust any NHS service. CAMHS recommended Mermaids when I explicitly said we needed holistic care. Ffs. Anyone found a councillor who can help him understand that this is not the answer?
And thank you so much for being here.

@Parenttrapasd that sounds really hard and I wish you all the best in dealing with this. I'd be checking out the Bayswater Group and Genspect, which has a directory of therapists who will focus on exploratory rather than immediately affirming care: https://beyondtrans.org/therapists/

My own adult autistic DS flirts with gender identity. He is significantly autistic, has severe social anxiety and lives at home.

My approach has been to quietly allow him to believe that maybe I acquiesce to the idea that he might be trans, but do zero to either support or deny it.

He is far too socially anxious to go to the GP about it, or buy any female clothing, and I don't offer to facilitate this (or deny it. He hasn't asked).

We have done this tiptoe dance for probably 7 years now. At one point he changed his email tag to a female name, but it's male again now. He tends to play as female characters in games and his hair has grown very long (waist length).

He is in no way female in his thinking, outlook, interests, or early history. I am not going to facilitate this; but neither am I turning into an issue he can rail against. I just never mention it. I buy his clothes, and it's male clothing but mildly unisex eg in colour or pattern. He is of course free to buy other clothes if he wishes, but he doesn't.

Can we make this a regular /recurrng thread like the Stately Homes one? I would love to have a community of other parents to talk about this stuff with? I have no one apart my DH in real life who understands the worry of all this.

My DS is 10 and has moderate ASD and severe ADHD. He's Constantly telling me he's a girl. He has extremely poor critical thinking, is emotionally very young and naive. In short, he's very vulnerable to the nefarious influence of others. I'm so, so worried about the puberty years and protecting him from the influence of the hard-line trans activists who have their own agenda to push. He needs to find his own path and not be pushed into anything.

Anyone have any useful links to objective websites or reading material? Please share....

@Xiaoxiong thank you for the info. I'd never heard of the Bayswater Group before!

It’s such a shame that autistic children are having to substitute real world friendships for the internet.

To be absolutely honest though many of us didn’t really have friendships pre-internet.
It’s a shame internet friendship can’t exist without the inevitable pressures to conform to some ideology or other.

I am happy to join as a regular thread!

My DS is at Uni and 'came out' as trans in yr 2 ('pansexual' in yr 1). Has a girlfriend (who is also a boy). He now goes by a female name there but we kind of ignore at home, I call him darling instead. He is not diagnosed autistic but has shown many traits over the years. He is very academic and has always had plenty of nerdy friends (several diagnosed with autism) so his quirks have not caused any issue. He has never been feminine in any way (though I wouldn't think he was female whatever!) so it was quite a surprise. He wears the same clothes he always has (comfortable, no attention pls) but not cut his hair. I think the crux is that he has enjoyed the feeling of being part of a big group for the first time. He's loved his time at Uni and is really happy so that's my saving grace.

I have gone down the 'neither affirm nor deny' route and have made minimal fuss and treated him exactly the same as ever. Taking hormones is my 'red line', I do not want him to ruin his body, and he has refused to discuss when I asked. He will be coming home for summer soon so it will be at the forefront again. DH is coping quite badly and thinks DS is ruining his life. We are trying to support one another.

Thank you so much @Xiaoxiong for your links - so appreciated and for others sharing their experiences. They are so similar. I’d like this to be a group - I’ve never really used mumsnet so need to brush up on how it works!

Az Hakeem is very much worth listening to. He's a psychiatrist who worked with adult transsexuals and transvestites, the vast majority of whom were autistic. Sadly he no longer sees patients due to abuse from trans activists but he does work with parents.

There's also this organisation

can-sg.org

Hi everyone, I was looking for some threads for parents of autistic/ trans children, I would definitely like an ongoing support thread. My dd is15.

I'm totally at sea with the whole trans issue and really need some relatively neutral views without being accused of transphobia. I'm not just blindly accepting and charging down the medical route. But I do want to preserve a relationship with my child. A relationship that has been sorely tested over the last 18 mths by her eating disorder.

I have absolutely no issue with the autism (she's like most of my family!), the eating disorder has been very well tackled by CAMHS.

It's the trans issues that I'm struggling with. She thinks changing gender will magically make her happy.

It's really interesting to read other people's experiences. DD has never been very 'masculine' and hasn't changed her pronouns. It just doesn't make very much sense to me at all, although I'm trying to understand. She just talks about how gender is a feeling and can't really explain much more.

Up to now, I suppose we've been hoping it'll go away but I realise that's very unrealistic. I think we'll aim for 'holding it lightly' I like that phrase!

My advice for those that don't know would be to read up about the Webberley's, about Michael Webberley being struck off and their move abroad to allow them to continue to sell medication online. Also read reddit transgender pages where posters complain about the Webberleys and how the NHS will not work with Gender GP.

Interesting to perhaps share with your child
This is a link from The Bayswater group of parents - this child has worked out why they were attracted to the trans idea. https://www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/toptentips/ - really helpful. It’s a bloody minefield. I have noticed that my DS is only interested in the whole trans thing when they are upset or feeling overwhelmed. When they are happy it doesn’t seem to figure as much. I think it’s a very seductive hook to hang all the adolescent stuff on… thank you for sharing and being here too.

I feel for you OP.

I'd try and find a neither affirming nor non affirming therapist, who won't push DS either in one way or the other, and direct DS to licensed gender clinics.

Autism and being trans is interlinked - but ultimately your DS being autistic does not mean he is not trans, unlike what a lot of people on MN might say.

It might be a good idea to start your own thread on this.

Him changing gender may help a lot as his dysphoria may be the main cause of his low mood.

I work with people with Austism and quite a few are trans. In your shoes I’d refuse to get medication through gendergp (I’d refuse to take risks with his health) and redirect him to the GP for a safer more rounded formal approach.

More urgently I would get unbiased counselling. Ongoing over a long time to help him explore and learn to express his feelings.