Joint residence and moving abroad

[Jollymummy2]

My ex and I have joint residence (by court order) of our daughter aged 10. I have her 4 nights a week and he has her 3 nights.
My new husband has a job oppotunity in South Africa on a 2 year posting which we would join him on.
I have 2 children with my new husband as well as my daughter from previous relationship.
My daughter wants to come too, and does not always enjoy her time with her father.
What is the process to change the court order and what is the likelyhood that the judge will agree we can take her.
Also is there anything we could do to sway things in our favour?

You need to make a Specific Issue application under section 8 of the children Act l989 (quoting you chapter and verse so you can look it up on google), unless you can get her father's written consent.

If he objects then the procedure is fairly lengthy - you should allow 6 months from start to finish, possibly longer, so you need to factor that into his plans.

The Court will have to take into account your daughter's wishes and feelings, as set out in a Cafcass officer's report (that's the thing that takes the most time as Cafcass are woefully understaffed), but also other factors such as educational, social, emotional etc.

You need to put forward a strong argument as to why she will benefit from being uprooted and taken so far away, and then uprooted again in two years' time. You also need to have properly researched proposals for how contact will be effected if you're successful, eg how many times you'll bring/send her home to see her dad per year, how much that will cost and whethr you will pay all of that cost, how you will organise indirect contact in the meantime, eg emails, cards, webcam, phone calls etc.

what do you think your ex will say?

How long has the current court order been in place and why did you need to have a court order? You need to consider if this application will look like an attempt to frustrate contact. On the other hand, if it is a long-standing arrangement, you will have to show not only that it would be beneficial for her to be uprooted, but also that the benefits will outweigh the trauma of the change.

Whilst mumblechum's advice is excellent, bear in mind when putting together proposals for maintaining contact with emails, cards etc that Dad could easily suggest that the child stays in this country and maintains contact with you via those methods.

Ilovetiffany...Ex would say no.

Tanga...Court order put in place in 2007. Ex took me to court after daughter told him i was pregnant first time around. He acused me of being a bad mother and all sorts of other nasty stuff and was trying to get sole custody, although was shot down in flames in court. He only got 3 days a week in the actual order as this was the amount of time he was having her anyway.

He is on his own, and has no family near by. I am concerned about my daughter as he is quite a controlling person. (although dont know how i could prove this!!)She has admitted to being scared of him, and did not tell him when i was pregnant with her brother as she was scared of how he would react. She has still not told him and her brother is 8 weeks old!!

I think it would be an amazing experience for the children to live in a new country. And it would be a great career step for my Husband, and is quite likely to mean we could then transfer to Canada at the end of this contract, which is where ultimately where we would like to live.

so you dont intend to ever return back to this country?

if she has been staying 3 nights a week with apparently no serious concerns other than "scared to tell him things" then it might be sen a sdetrimetnal to dad/dd relationship at this point - when she is older of course she will have more say.

i think you need to try and sell it to ex first in terms of sending her over for long hoidays, offering to pay costs (as you are the one choosing to move) etc.

otherwise as was said - he could argue she stays for her school etc and visits you for long holidays....

TBH we just dont know at this stage. It would depend largely on hubbys work. 2 years would be the minimum stay in SA.

how do you propose to keep up contact?

She could come back to UK a couple of times a year. I would imagine that we would come back once as a family for a few weeks, and she could fly over again for a week during school holidays. We already have Skype so she could use that to speak to him.

She wants to come with us, so does that get taken into account?

cafcass listened to my older kids but didnt so much with the younger ones.....look,of course she wants to come with you. you're her mum,she's way to young to weigh up the pro's and cons on this one

from what i know of court system you'll have a battle on your hands

try posting this on forums at www.wikivorce.com

There is an article about the law in leave to remove cases here;

www.familylawweek.co.uk/site.aspx?i=ed878

babybarrister is correct, there has been some concern about courts granting leave to remove rather too easily and perhaps it's set to become more difficult. However, if you can demonstrate the arrangements for accommodation, employment, education, contact etc are both viable and practical and moving with you would be the least disruptive to the child's sense of security there is every likelihood of leave being granted.

The courts will consider the motivation of your ex opposing the move as well as contact history and the wishes and feelings of your daughter. When all the points weigh equally the judge may find it less disruptive to education, friendships and relationships with the extended family to award residence to the parent remaining where they are.