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Brother-in-law inheriting mum's house? Help!

59 replies

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 00:50

Briefly... We are in England. My sister died a couple of days ago. After her death, my mum asked me to look at some paperwork and I found out that my mum added my sister and her husband to mum's property title deeds 9 years ago, after my dad died. No mortgage, property worth around £500-600k. I have 2 other siblings. None of us was aware of this until today. None else named on the deeds, just the three of them. I don't know whether my sister and her husband were added as joint tenants or tenants in common, or why they were added. There is a phrase 'The Transfer to the proprietor contains a covenant to observe and perform the covenants referred to in the Charges Register' in the deeds - what does this mean? My mum's will states that her children should all inherit equally.

What are the implications of my sister's death? Does this mean that my brother-in-law now owns half (if joint tenants) or 2/3 (if tenants in common, assuming an equal split, and assuming that my sister left her assets to him in her will) of my mum's house? Why would she do this?

OP posts:
McSpoot · 17/03/2025 00:57

Sorry if I'm dense, but why don't you ask your mother why she did it and how they were added?

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:00

McSpoot · 17/03/2025 00:57

Sorry if I'm dense, but why don't you ask your mother why she did it and how they were added?

I have... She's says she doesn't know and can't remember. She's in her mid 80's. No dementia diagnosed although forgetful at times.

OP posts:
CatsWhiskerz · 17/03/2025 01:07

Did/do they live there?
What's your BIL like? Is he likely to give up this ?

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:10

CatsWhiskerz · 17/03/2025 01:07

Did/do they live there?
What's your BIL like? Is he likely to give up this ?

Mum lives there. BIL doesn't. Hé owns 3 other properties outright. In answer to the last question, I simply don't know.

OP posts:
McSpoot · 17/03/2025 01:14

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:00

I have... She's says she doesn't know and can't remember. She's in her mid 80's. No dementia diagnosed although forgetful at times.

Hmm...that does complicate things. Was she already showing forgetfulness nine years ago? Do you think that you can approach your BIL? Maybe not now (when your sister's death is so recent) but in the near future. Or do know if a lawyer helped draw up the deeds? Can you connect them (if they exist)?

Snapncrackle · 17/03/2025 01:18

Do you have a copy of your dads will

could they have been added as trustee of your dads half when he passed away

when my mum passed away my dad had a lifetime interest in her half of the property and I was added to the deeds as the trustee of my mums half of the house ( so that basically the house couldn’t be sold by my dad on his own I would have to agree as the trustee of my mums half )

but at no point was I the beneficial owner of the property ( couldn’t sell it or move in ) I was just added as the trustee of my mums half of the house

GarlicStyle · 17/03/2025 01:24

You can order a copy of the Register of Title, which should include information on all charges registered to the property, for £7 here:
https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry

You can also buy it from a third-party service; they charge about £17.

Search for land and property information

Find a property and get its title plan, title register and see who owns it

https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:24

Snapncrackle · 17/03/2025 01:18

Do you have a copy of your dads will

could they have been added as trustee of your dads half when he passed away

when my mum passed away my dad had a lifetime interest in her half of the property and I was added to the deeds as the trustee of my mums half of the house ( so that basically the house couldn’t be sold by my dad on his own I would have to agree as the trustee of my mums half )

but at no point was I the beneficial owner of the property ( couldn’t sell it or move in ) I was just added as the trustee of my mums half of the house

That's interesting, did you have siblings? I don't have a copy of my dad's will, never saw it or benefitted from it in any way, so I assumed that everything passed to my mum. So if this is the case for us, does that mean that my BIL would now be the trustee? And who now owns that half of the house?

OP posts:
EricTheGardener · 17/03/2025 01:25

Yes to the above post - my parents owned as tenants in common, and this is what happened when my dad died. Now me and my brother are trustees of his half, and my mum has a lifetime interest to remain living there.

If they owned as tenants in common it would say this on the land registry docs:

"No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court."

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:26

GarlicStyle · 17/03/2025 01:24

You can order a copy of the Register of Title, which should include information on all charges registered to the property, for £7 here:
https://www.gov.uk/search-property-information-land-registry

You can also buy it from a third-party service; they charge about £17.

Thanks for posting, I've done that. It shows the ownership as per the OP.

OP posts:
Semiramide · 17/03/2025 01:27

Get a copy of the title deeds and your dad's will.

Arrange a meeting for all siblings plus mum to meet with the solicitors who handled the property transfer.

GarlicStyle · 17/03/2025 01:28

A copy of a will is available for £1.50.

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/help

There are circumstances in which you can't get one - official secrets (rare) and delayed probate (not very rare). However, it sounds as if your Dad's was all done and dusted as normal, so you should be able to get it straight away.

Search probate records for documents and wills (England and Wales)

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/help

GarlicStyle · 17/03/2025 01:28

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:26

Thanks for posting, I've done that. It shows the ownership as per the OP.

Odd. Did you get the title register or just the summary?

Snapncrackle · 17/03/2025 01:31

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:24

That's interesting, did you have siblings? I don't have a copy of my dad's will, never saw it or benefitted from it in any way, so I assumed that everything passed to my mum. So if this is the case for us, does that mean that my BIL would now be the trustee? And who now owns that half of the house?

the grandkids were the beneficiaries of both my parents will( they had mirror wills ) and both owned there 50 percent each
but left each other a lifetime interest in the property

both me and my sisters were trustees / executors so we were actually both put on the deeds when my mum passed away

if we weren't on the deeds then there would have been nothing stopping my dad from selling the house and pocketing the cash and the grandkids not getting eventually my mums share ( not that he would have done this )

you want to get a copy of your dads will first and then you can see what it says

EricTheGardener · 17/03/2025 01:32

I think the wording you mention in your OP is pretty bog standard, it just means when a property is transferred from one owner to another, any existing covenants stay attached to the property, not the person.

A covenant might be something like, you have to maintain a shared driveway. Or a legal restriction like you can't use the property to run a business.

Snapncrackle · 17/03/2025 01:33

I just googled what you wrote

What does the transfer to the proprietor contain a covenant to observe and perform the covenants referred to in the charges register and of indemnity in respect thereof?

Explanation. The entry in the Proprietorship Register indicates that the current owner (the seller) has a covenant to observe and perform the covenants referred to in the Charges Register. This means that the seller has agreed to abide by certain conditions or restrictions related to the property.

IAmNotASheep · 17/03/2025 01:36

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:24

That's interesting, did you have siblings? I don't have a copy of my dad's will, never saw it or benefitted from it in any way, so I assumed that everything passed to my mum. So if this is the case for us, does that mean that my BIL would now be the trustee? And who now owns that half of the house?

You can order a copy of your dads will ( if he had one ) on the Govn website
just fill in online

Brother-in-law inheriting mum's house? Help!
Snapncrackle · 17/03/2025 01:36

It seems odd that they would be added to the deeds unless they are trustees of say your dads half

and it’s weird that your mum didn’t tell you

did they loan your parents / mum
money or something and went on the deeds due to this

IAmNotASheep · 17/03/2025 01:44

If as you say your parents house is now in your mums, sisters and bils names then it does look like ownership has changed after your df passed away
If your ds left her estate to her husband it would mean he now owns 2/3rds of the property.
I wonder if they gave your mother some money for their share of the property. Perhaps she has invested that somewhere else.
You need to have a conversation with the whole family including your bil.

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 01:44

Thank you all. It looks like it's the situation that @Snapncrackle describes. Thanks @GarlicStyle and @IAmNotASheep for the link to get the will, I'll do that tomorrow. I don't think for one minute that anything underhand was intended, I'm just very anxious at a hugely stressful time for us all to get some facts. My sister isn't here to explain what happened, my mum is sad and confused and my BIL is wrapped up with being a single dad. I'm sure when they did this they had no idea that my sister would predecease my mum. I'm also wondering why my mum would put my BIL on the deeds and not her own children. No money owed/borrowed as far as I am aware. They wouldn't have needed to.

OP posts:
PyongyangKipperbang · 17/03/2025 01:45

You need to know when this happened.

If she cant remember when and why then you can use her age to challenge the legality of this. Sounds like coercion if it was recently.

ETA not to say that a woman in her 80's cant be on point, but it sounds like she is deteriorating.

IAmNotASheep · 17/03/2025 01:49

PyongyangKipperbang · 17/03/2025 01:45

You need to know when this happened.

If she cant remember when and why then you can use her age to challenge the legality of this. Sounds like coercion if it was recently.

ETA not to say that a woman in her 80's cant be on point, but it sounds like she is deteriorating.

Edited

It was 9 years ago Pyong
Almost impossible to prove coercion unless she was diagnosed with something relevant back then

McSpoot · 17/03/2025 01:51

IAmNotASheep · 17/03/2025 01:49

It was 9 years ago Pyong
Almost impossible to prove coercion unless she was diagnosed with something relevant back then

And the OP has said that there isn't a diagnosis now (much less nine years ago). And that the OP doesn't have any suspicions of coercion.

ManicFreakCreature · 17/03/2025 02:04

Thank you all so much for your help. I've ordered a copy of my dad's will. I'll go with mum to her solicitor to see if we can unravel this. My huge sadness is that they haven't discussed this with the wider family as it would perhaps have saved a lot of stress and heartache at an already hugely sad time. I'll come back and update at some point on who inherited the house 😔

OP posts:
IAmNotASheep · 17/03/2025 02:05

McSpoot · 17/03/2025 01:51

And the OP has said that there isn't a diagnosis now (much less nine years ago). And that the OP doesn't have any suspicions of coercion.

Although
I’m afraid you never can tell
My mums younger brother burnt his dads house down ( ie the family home ) after putting the insurance in his own name. Then used the insurance to build a new house ( grandads was an old Irish cottage with no heating or water or bathroom etc ) which he then put in his name.
The rest of the family didn’t find out till my grandad passed away.
There was a stinger in the tale for him though as he didn’t transfer the land it stood on. So he had a house but no legal right to walk across the land to get to it !

No one would ever have thought he would do such a thing and yet 🤷‍♀️