Worst case sentence for causing distress by protesting?

[soontobesolo]

Hi,

I wonder if anyone can put my mind at rest about the worst case outcome in this scenario please.

Back in the summer DC was quite involved in the Palestinian encampment at his uni and went on several protests. On one of these a group of them were unhappy with the police treatment of another protestor and they ended up going into the police station foyer and staging a sit down protest. No violence occurred on the part of the students but several of them including DC were dragged away by the police and held overnight in the cells.

They were released under investigation the next day and the police held onto their phones. We were expecting it to be dropped but the police have decided to charge them with causing distress so they are due in court next week.

Can anyone talk me through what happens, is this an initial appearance in a magistrate's court and then there would be a subsequent appearance, presumably it would definitely be settled in magistrate's court as less serious or would they have option of crown court trial?

The whole thing seems a ridiculous waste of resources, there is lots of evidence on YouTube to show they weren't in any way violent and didn't resist arrest. There also seems to be a suggestion that the majority of those arrested were ethnic minority (including mixed race DC) whereas the protestors were mainly white students. I think the solicitor representing them is linked to the encampment and specialises in cases involving protests.

So thanks if you've read through this. My questions are basically, what is the likely process for this in terms of court appearances etc and, if found guilty, what's the worst sentence he's likely to receive?

He has no previous police involvement including in previous protests nor has he any sociaI media involvement in protest organisations. I understand that the laws have recently got tougher on protests because of just stop oil etc but he wasn't disrupting transport/essential services etc which is presumably why they've charged him with causing distress.

There's no chance he could go to prison as a first time offender is there? I have no prior experience of the criminal justice system at all and am fearing the worst!

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/protests-potential-offences-during-protests-demonstrations-or-campaigns-annex

You could be looking at a secrion 4a POA 1986 which could theoretically lead to a 6 month custodial sentence but unlikely for a first offender unless there are aggravating factors.

Thanks for your reply. How long would it typically be between his first appearance in court and when the matter is decided?

It feels like it's been hanging over us for ages already but I know there are a lot of backlogs in the legal system currently.

Yeah s4A seems to come closest but OP you don’t actually tell us the exact section/act/offence they have been charged with. You need to find that out.

s4a is only tried in the Mags by the way.

Each offence has sentencing guidelines so you will be able to look it up and see the worst case scenario. That’s what you’re missing. The offence he has been charged with will be on his paperwork.

OP I can see this from both sides. You are DC’s mother and love them more than all the world and want to protect them from harm and certainly don’t want them having a criminal record and you are naturally worried.

On the other side the Police are doing one of the hardest jobs, putting their lives at risk daily, many for less than £30k, and I feel for them having to respond to emergencies/bring people in or out etc with DC and friends clogging-up the foyer.

Worst case is 6 months in prison yes. Best case is the offence is not made-out by the Prosecution and most likely case is in the middle somewhere with a criminal record which may be ‘spent’ after a period of time but this is not my area. Easy to find out though once you get the offence details.

I guess it’s a very sobering lesson in peer pressure.

Thanks @FionaSkates. Yes, finding out the charge should clarify matters. He was only charged yesterday and promised me a scan of the charge papers but hasn't yet sent it.

The students were originally arrested on suspicion of violence in a police station but last night he mentioned the charge saying something about distress? I saw a lot of online footage of their protest and arrest and they were not resisting at all so while it would undoubtedly have been annoying for the police I'm not sure it could have been classed as violent.

He's lucky that his degree isn't one where a criminal record is an absolute dealbreaker and his future career wouldn't require an enhanced DBS so it should all be left behind him eventually. I'm just concerned on the effect it could have on his studies, especially a custodial sentence obviously.

The university seems to be supportive in general; apparently one of the arresting officers told the students they'd most likely be kicked off their courses and the university wrote them a letter apologising. They said that the university would do their own investigation and the police did not speak for them and had acted beyond their remit!

Anyway thanks for the clarification about the type of court. I'll wait for more information from my son!

FAFO 🤷🏻‍♀️

As they seem happy with locking up 13 year olds at the moment I wouldn’t piss around in a police station, violently or not.

So I found out the charges: it's section 1 and 3 of POA 2023 (attaching to another person to cause severe disruption to a police station) This was apparently linking arms with his friend in their sit down protest.

Also, section 5(1) and 6 of POA 1986, using abusive words/ behaviour/disorderly behaviour within the sight/hearing of another person likely to be caused alarm/harassment/distress.

This isn't great is it, looks like possible 6 month sentence?

Does anyone know if a protest is fairly likely to fit these criteria?

A suitable punishment to fit the crime would be to send him to live in Palestine.

Sounds like you need to let him get on with it and stop trying to minimise his behaviour. Maybe focus your efforts on trying to teach him to behave appropriately instead. Whether it was violent or not can you seriously not see why his behaviour is not ok

The courts are pretty tough on protestors at the moment but it's impossible for anyone to tell you what sentence he will get. Best person to speak to about it is his solicitor.

Yes a lot of minimising going on here.

Actions have consequences. That's the lesson.

Very unlikely to get a custodial sentence for a first offence. But also you don't seem to acknowledge that he has broken the law in two instances. There are ways to protest legally - I do it often - but for him to be charged with two offences is not a light matter and you haven't once said anything that would suggest you have acknowledged that he has acted illegally and that it is not, in fact, ok. Do you get cross when people chuck soup at paintings or is that fair game too? He's broken the law and these are the consequences. He won't go to prison, that would be highly unlikely, but will he think first before acting next time?

He needs competent criminal legal advice. Not from someone trying to get their name in the papers or via his protest group either.

You all need to stop minimising this, it's a serious set of offences to be charged with. And the charges don't entirely fit the narrative you're giving (or he has given you).

S1 POA 2023 is locking on
S6 POA 2023 is obstruction of major transport works
S5(1) POA 1986 is threatening or abusive words and behaviour
S6 POA 1986 isn't a criminal offence, so you might want to look at that again - it's guidance notes on the application of intent in the law.

Is he planning on pleading guilty or not guilty? That will affect any sentence.

Excellent advice. And yes good point about the pleading.

Why did the university apologise to him because a police officer suggested that his actions might risk his place on the course? Seems a bit weird?

I didn't even understand that bit of the post as it was written.

Section 1 (locking on) carries a maximum sentence of 6 months and/or a fine. This is a summary offence, so it can only be dealt with by magistrates.

Section 3 is actually causing severe disruption by tunnelling so, unless he has been charged incorrectly or has given you the wrong section number, he isn't telling you the full facts. This offence is triable either way, so it can be dealt with by magistrates or the Crown Court. If dealt with by magistrates, the maximum sentence is 6 months and/or a fine. In the Crown Court, the maximum sentence is 3 years and/or a fine.

There are no sentencing guidelines for these offences.

Section 5(1) (causing harassment, alarm or distress) is a summary offence and can only lead to a fine. He cannot be imprisoned for this offence.

Section 6 is not a separate offence. It is about the mental element of various offences. In this case, it means he can only be convicted under section 5(1) if he intended to be threatening, abusive or disorderly, or was aware that his behaviour may be threatening, abusive or disorderly.

OP says it is S3 POA 2023, not S6. S3 is causing severe disruption by tunnelling.

Have a look at the Sentencing Council website. Put the offence in the search and it’ll give you the guidelines.

Whatever the sentence, he's fucked up his future if he has a criminal record

Sorry I don't have any experience of this but the fact that prisons are supposedly at capacity may mean it's less likely that he gets a custodial sentence. Maybe!

@prh47bridge the bit about section 3 is mentioned where it says: LEGISLATION : contrary to section 1(1) and 3 of POA 2023. Then under that it lists CCCJS code and PNLD code but I don't understand those. The text above just states attaching to another person intending to cause/being reckless of causing serious disruption of police station. Nothing about tunnelling.

I'd like to think anyone can make silly mistakes in their youth which don't fuck up their whole lives! While I don't condone his behaviour I would certainly prefer that he'd been involved in protesting for a cause he believes in albeit inappropriately than, for example, getting into a fight after a drunken night out. But neither of these actions as a one-off should ruin someone's life going forward, that's not the sort of society I want to live in!

Unless he gets a custodial sentence, any conviction for these offences will disappear from DBS checks after 11 years. For many jobs, a conviction for these offences will not be relevant and will not harm his employment prospects.

You're condoning it by calling it a silly mistake and thereby minimising it. I very much doubt he will go to jail and it will disappear from his record after 11 years. As I said earlier, you can protest for good causes without breaking the law - it's called peaceful protest. It's a serious mistake and he needs to learn from it - the police don't just randomly charge people. And he's an adult - albeit a young one.

I'm not sure I understand the non sequitur of talking about other crimes - redundant comparison - you shouldn't want your child involved in any crime, regardless of the circumstance and that is where people are not quick to give you sympathy on this thread, because you seem to think this is not a big deal.

It won't "ruin his life" but for the next 11 years it very well might make it more difficult.

CCCJS codes are a way of identifying a specific offence. PNLD is a reference to the Police National Legal Database.

That reads to me like he has been charged incorrectly. Causing serious disruption of a police station is not an offence. If there was a serious disruption prevention order, breaching it is an offence under section 27. But section 3 is specifically about causing serious disruption by tunnelling. If there was no tunnelling, he is not guilty of an offence under that section.