Advice on UK Prenup in long-term relationship

[SAHMPrenup]

NC to keep this separate from other posts.

Seeking some advice on prenups in the UK. I understand they’re not legally binding but can carry significant weight if properly drafted and agreed upon.

DP and I have been together for 9yrs and considering getting married. He’d like to have a prenup in place and I’m open to the idea as I could see how it might protect both of us.

Context:

• We have one DC(4) and a baby on the way
• I’ve been a SAHM since firstborn, a joint decision based on finances and what we wanted for our family
• I have a small self-employed business I started before I met DP, but it brings in a minimal income that mostly just covers my NI contributions and makes little to no profit (my intention has always been to refocus on building this back up after both DC are in full time education)
• I had a SIPP before becoming a SAHM, but I’ve not been able to contribute to it since stepping back from my business
• DP is the primary earner and has supported me generously, including providing a monthly allowance and a lump sum to invest (he had also done this on a smaller scale before DC)
• He had assets before we met, but much of his current net worth has grown while we’ve been together, during which I’ve taken on the bulk of childcare and home responsibilities, enabling him to focus on his work and investments.
• He is, however, also active in our home life outside work hours

For the avoidance of doubt, I really don’t mind having a prenup in place as long as it’s fair. Should I decide to walk away, then it’s my decision to change the family dynamic, and I’d be happy to abide by the agreement. Equally, if he decides to walk away, then it’s on him, and he should be held responsible.

Of course, we’ll be speaking to a solicitor when the time comes, but given my financial situation, I don’t have a lot of disposable income to pay for independent legal advice.

My main concern is that I’m in a financially weaker position, which feels vulnerable despite the trust and generosity in our relationship. I would want the agreement to reflect our shared life and my contributions, even though they’ve mostly been non-financial.

I’d really appreciate advice on what kind of provisions I should ask for in the prenup to ensure fairness and protect myself in case things don’t work out.

How can I balance protecting his premarital assets with acknowledging our shared life and my role in enabling his financial growth?

Thanks in advance for your insights! (and sorry for the long post!)

I know nothing on the legality of prenups but after having 2 children together I’d not sign one that could leave me vulnerable. If things go tits up, looking after yourself and your children will most probably be only your concern, don’t be fooled into thinking otherwise.

Hi OP - the women in my family have their own assets earned before meeting their partners and have chosen to have prenups to protect what they bring into a marriage

There are no guarantees, and pre nups hold less weight as a marriage progresses (usually after about 5 years) and needs of any children often the focus of financial settlements I understand

You need a solicitor’s advice not mine, but in short a prenup is not in your interests at all, I would question why he wants it

in your situation:

• you are the financially vulnerable party
• you have facilitated your DPs ability to earn by being a SAHM

You have nothing to gain from a prenup, actually you should not have had a child without marriage due to your financial position BUT you can’t turn back time

If as you say;

• He had assets before we met, but much of his current net worth has grown while we’ve been together, during which I’ve taken on the bulk of childcare and home responsibilities, enabling him to focus on his work and investments.

why is there discussion of a prenup? Did your partner bring an inheritance, substantial assets more than you etc?

IME: a prenup is to protect what was yours before you became a couple. I am questioning why this man wants to have you facilitate him having a family and earn, and also protect what he has today given that you have been a couple for 9 years, a family for 5 (the date you got pregnant with his child)

As a minimum, you should expect the prenup protects only assets he brought into the relationship before you became a committed couple (so long before your child’s birth)

In your situation I would try to have no prenup; but not if this means no marriage (you need to be married)

The only thing which could be considered protecting are assets before you started a relationship ( not pre marriage as it is clear you are in a financially joined relationship ).
Other than that I would not touch a pre nup with a barge pole. Assets/ funds go up and down in a relationship and are often a result of a combined contribution- especially when child care is involved. If you do separate then a decent divorce lawyer would make sure you get what is fair.

Financially, you would be best-off if you were married with no prenup, but with your starting point being that you are an unmarried SAHM, legally you are in a vulnerable position. Getting married with a prenup COULD make you less vulnerable than staying unmarried.

So if the only way for your partner to agree to marriage is to sign a prenup that makes you better of than just living together, it may well be in your advantage to sign it. Hopefully the prenup can be favourable enough to each of you that the process of agreeing it will not build resentments between you.

I can understand your partners apprehension about getting married without ANY prenup because if you were to get married and then get divorced, the starting point would be that you would be entitled to half of everything he has, or even potentially more if that is required to maintain your same lifestyle after divorce, including assets that he had before you even met. While that is considered “fair” in UK law I personally think it is not fair at all, and I think that a person who wants some protection from that sort of outcome is not necessarily being a dick. Conversely, where one person has sacrificed their earnings power so the other can earn a lot, they should clearly be entitled to a healthy share of the benefit from that increased earnings power, perhaps even as much as 50 percent.

You really should get your own legal advice, or at least shared advice from a mediator who is impartial and familiar with UK law, because otherwise what you agree as “fair” will be overly shaped by his own needs and his own advisor and could be grossly unfair to you. One way to help your partner be comfortable with this is that if you do NOT get your own advice, the prenup may not be valid!

However you should also be aware that a UK solicitor who advises you individually is likely to push you to go for the maximum benefit for yourself, and that could lead to problems in your relationship, and you may need to push back against your own solicitor if you get one.

If it were me in your position I would want a legally trained, impartial mediator, one who would try to see both sides and get to an agreement that is morally fair to both and that facilitates continuation of a healthy relationship. For example, maybe you work out what you each had when you started taking on more than half of the household duties, and you agree that in the event of divorce, you each keep that level as a starting point and then to share 50-50 any uplift in excess of that. Or maybe your partner can identify specific investments held as of that date and ringfence those investments including their appreciation, but again share 50-50 whatever came beyond that. You would, however, also need to consider your lost earnings power going forward, which might justify your getting some sort of additional compensation for that in addition.

How to find someone you can advise you who will help you to find an agreement that is fair while also getting along? It’s not easy, but it’s better than not having any advice! There is a divorce firm whose ethos is aligned with getting along, called amicable.io. I don’t know whether they help to write prenups but if not, they might be able to direct you who does.

^ agree 💯 with Yankee Dad, this is good advice

Push on getting your own advice to make any prenup valid (if not independent advice, then no prenup).

@BeanBeliever thank you for your detailed response.

It’s a fair question to ask why the discussion of prenup.

I think he’s always had a small underlying insecurity of getting financially screwed (previous relationship dynamics, things he’s seen happen to friends and work colleagues). I know this has contributed to it taking so long to get to this point for him. We have very open and honest conversations on the subject.

As you say it’s perhaps not in my best interest to have one but worse to remain unmarried so I’m taking the pragmatic approach and would rather have one with the protection of marriage.

I also do believe it’s fair that I don’t benefit from assets pre-relationship or even increased earnings after a split, provided a final settlement is fair and our children are not disadvantaged. Ultimately they will still benefit from that even if I don’t and they are our priority.

But I do think it’s important to highlight my contribution during our relationship pre-marriage as you noted.

Thank you @YankeeDad your response is incredibly helpful and much appreciated. I think your suggestion of a legally trained, impartial mediator is a very good one and knowing DP I know he would have no issue with that. I feel like he just wants to have some security in place for himself as he has worked very hard for what he has even before we met. If it were me I cannot say I would feel differently and like him I just want to protect myself.

You and PPs have made some great points I will be noting down and putting together. Highlighting also what @BeanBeliever has said about us being a couple for 9yrs and a family for 5.

Thank you for everyone’s input. This thread has helped me clarify I would be fine with a prenup that protects the assets he had before we became a family, not at the point of marriage (and why shouldn’t I be ok with that as it would be fair and I did not bring much financially into the relationship). But my earning power has definitely been impacted by my status as a SAHM whilst his increasing has been facilitated by my role in childcare and in the home. We have essentially been living as a married couple so I think it’s fair to make sure that is very clear.

Thank you for helping me organise my thoughts on this.

@SAHMPrenup : you sound really sensible and fair

I agree with your position (& this is the position I will use myself).

Take into account not just the number of years, but earning trajectory: most people’s earnings and wealth start small, build in 20s-30s and peak in late 40s or 50s. Without DC you would also have been increasing your earning power in the last 9 years most likely

As an aside: I’d suggest you get the pre nup, marry, then start doing more work once your second is older

You are getting a hint that your husband to be has a bit of ‘what’s mine in mine’ at the back of his mind (this is ok, most people do). He should have proposed before your first baby and has not done so in the last 5 years: I would say that getting a bit more power in the relationship could only help

@BeanBeliever great point about earning trajectory and earning peak. We’ve actually just had a chat on the subject again and I suggested a mediator as recommended here and he’s on board. (edited to add that it’s a point I will add to submit to a mediator when we appoint one)

I wouldn’t say he’s in the what’s mine is mine camp exactly due to his continued generosity way above what others might deem fair and the fact he has no legal (although one would argue he does has a moral) obligation. He’s been like that even pre-kids and has always said he wouldn’t see me disadvantaged, even though we are not married and even if we split. But we know humans will human when emotions are involved so 😅

I seem to be very invested in this thread 😁

The prenu also needs to cover pensions: sounds like your contributions have been minimal for past 5 years and may be low for next 5 or so with a new baby

You are unlikely to ever ‘catch up’: what is the plan to make sure you are provided for in old age? Is your DH to be willing to contribute to pension for you (tax efficient for him). Do you benefit if he dies?

This (plus housing) would be critical to me.

Your DH may very well think that his pension is ‘his’: as you are a SAHM this is
debatable

As far as not being disadvantaged: you very much are already sorry as you have not been funding your own pension and are sacrificing income growth: a prenup that takes the financial ‘joining’ bank to when you started a family seems fairer to me

^ to add: seeing a close friend who was a SAHM without marriage unable to afford to leave her (previously fine, now difficult) partner in the context of much lower earnings as a family for them both has made me see that what seems ‘fair’ really isn’t 10/20/30 years down the line: there is a lot to think through, whereas if a couple marry before DC this is all moot

@BeanBeliever well I certainly welcome your attention and time investment 😂 Thank you!

Currently I’m the named beneficiary of his pension, will and he has life insurance. So we are somewhat covered should the worst happen. I have those things in place too.

I did put to him the real world examples of what he would deem fair if down the line he bumped his head, had a personality change, decided to cheat or run off with someone else or by some strange alternate universe loop became abusive. If it were our DDs in my position how would he see them protected.

It gave him something to think about, he said he’d go and think about the situation if DC were small vs if DC were grown. He also showed me a draft of points which included priority over staying in marital home and providing continuity to kids, plus child maintenance and spousal support. I really don’t feel like he’s trying to screw me over just wanting things in place.

There was no mention of pension or older age on there so your point about fairness now vs 10/20/30 yrs down the line is a good one too as yes considering i’ve taken myself out of the work and business market at arguably peak years I’m very unlikely to ever ‘catch up’ as you say…unless the lottery comes in 😂

That’s why his increased earnings should benefit both of you. His pension etc

You don’t need a prenup you need to get married to protect yourself. He may want a prenup if he has large assets before you got together.

Remember if you are not married it affects inheritance tax.

Thank you, that’s a good point and yes we are aware. I have looked at options but really marriage is again the best protective route. He had looked at a Trust set up but they seem to be costly too.

@SAHMPrenup : both you & your DP sound very reasonable! Please keep us updated… I think knowing how the discussion lands can be very helpful to others in this situation

Yeah it’s much easier to just get married! Being a SAHM is a vulnerable position to be in if you’re not. You can set up all kinds of stuff but it doesn’t get past everything.

I agree with all PPs who say that getting married with a prenup is much better than staying unmarried and setting up trusts, etc. It sounds as though your partner understands that being an unmarried SAHM puts you in an unfair and vulnerable legal position and he is willing to change that. And you seem to understand that he finds it unfair if you gain a right to claim a share of his savings and assets from before you were a family, which is lovely and not universal.

The recent budget showed that the tax rules around trusts, already designed to be punitive, can change drastically at any time and are generally only going in one direction.

The exemption from IHT when one partner in a marriage dies and leaves assets to the other is of gigantic benefit for anyone with assets above £500k and cannot be replicated in any other way except possibly through term life insurance, which can be very expensive.

One thing to add is that any solicitor drawing up a pre nup will insist that you get independent legal advice.