Query re fraud and sick pay

[Pammela2]

Can a person continue to claim sick pay from their work place if they have moved 3 hours away from their place of work, sold their house and have no intention of returning?

They are still getting their sick line from their old gp and have not told their employer of this change, or their GP by the sounds of things.

You can continue to get sick pay as long as you are still sick.

Some employers will, for example, continue paying people with terminal cancer until they die.

Moving house won't stop sick pay unless you stop being sick,

Intending to never come back won't stop sick pay unless you are no longer sick (people with terminal cancer are not planning to return to work but are still entitled to sick pay under the terms of their contract)

Don’t know, but they may still be too sick to work.
Moving house doesn’t change that.
Sick pay doesn’t go on for ever anyway. In which case they will need to apply for benefits once it comes to an end.

Ok, thanks. So it doesn’t matter that they are still pretending to live in their old house to go etc?

This has been going on for some time (years)

Can you apply for benefits if you give up your job? They have also been working a cleaning job for cash in hand but apparently can’t manage the stairs at work.

Sick pay (beyond SSP) will depend on their workplace policies. It's unlikely to have anything about distance in it, but most will have a time limit. Some workplaces have insurance schemes so after a certain time you receive that, not sick pay (again, distance isn't an issue).

If they're lying about capability, or committing tax fraud, those are different issues.

Why don't you post your actual question and see if people can help?

I have but I don’t want to put too much information here as I think it’s pretty unique and so quite outing.

I think this person has played the system very well and it’s the public sector that is paying for it.

It does seem as though they have the system sussed though.
Thanks

I'd be surprised if they're still getting any kind of pay from a public sector job if they've been off for years

This is what I mean about complicated. There’s covid policies and claiming of a lot of holiday days for said covid absences. Aswell as other things.
but they are absolutely still getting sick pay atm.

I mean the real issue is are they sick?

Most workplaces have a limit on sick pay (often three or six months).

If they are sick and their contract says they are entitled to sick pay they are entitled to sick pay.

If they are not in fact sick that's a different issue.

As it’s public sector they can often have up to one year but it cannot be years. It would trigger occupational health surely?

It’s a bit complicated but atm the person is now cleaning sick pay. But this is after years of using different policies from the council which enabled them to be off whilst being paid.

COVID was years ago- how are they claiming holidays from that date? Are you sure you have your facts right?

the points about where they are currently living/intention not to return to work, are immaterial at this stage. People can legitimately have two jobs and only be signed off sick from one of them.

E.G. if they have been signed off as not able to do a physical role, that would
not necessarily mean they are unable to do a desk based job.

It’s hard to tell from the level of detail you have shared, but if they are claiming they are too physically unwell to do, e.g. a TA role, because they have a bad back, but are actually working in another similarly active role, e.g. a cleaner - I think most places would consider that fraud, if they were able to prove it, although proving it can sometimes be very difficult.

If they are also claiming benefit, they could be reported for potential benefit fraud - it should be investigated. The employer may also be utilising some kind of insurance policy to cover the salary costs - they would also investigate potential fraudulent claims.

They have also been working a cleaning job for cash in hand but apparently can’t manage the stairs at work.

Well, this might be the crux of it. Sounds like fraud.

It's the organisation's fault if somebody is getting sick pay after being off sick for years. Use the capability policy and dismiss them.

Your friend sounds like a Jeremy Kyle case. Their GP and their employer should be notified, but I couldn’t bring myself to do it.

Working cash in hand is fraudulent - if they are not reporting it correctly (paying cash in itself is not fraudulent).
Your friend may be required to keep their employer up to date with their address. Most GPs also require you to live in their catchment area.
But being off sick for a long time isn’t fraudulent in itself.

edited to correct myself re: being paid in cash

If they're misleading the employer than employer needs putting in the picture.

Ordinary sick pay, SSP, ends after 6 months. Even generous schemes for contractual sick pay, like those in the public sector, tend to reduce and cut of at nil after a year or so.

A permutant health insurance scheme that pays as long as you're sick is another thing but at the end of the day it's down to the employer and the insurer to keep people honest and deal with them if they're not.

What are you involving yourself?

Are you the employer/HR?

In which case you should seek legal advice and you would need to provide evidence of fraud.

If you are just a fellow employee, it is not your business to get involved...

Presumably there's more to it than the stairs. That's sorted with reasonable adjustments. If that was all it is the organisation would have done something a long time ago.

Sick pay as in a benefit is roughly the same as JSA I think ( never needed to claim so not 100%).

That doesn’t make sense op. Do you not know the full story and just making it up to fill the gaps in your knowledge. Of course they are not using holiday from Covid, give over.

I wish that I was. I’m not making any of it up, it’s been going on for a long time.
It seems that not much can be done though!

Thanks to those who answered the questions than to those assuming I’m not telling the truth!

HR can deal with this with their libe manager, are you either?

Yes, I am.

I think OP has said that this relates to a Local Government Employee.

If HR are not, for whatever reason, tooled up and able to deal with industrial scale piss taking then there's no straightforward answer.

A word in the ear of the right wing press?

Yea, exactly this.
If this were a politician or someone higher profile in the public sector then there would be outrage. I think it’s at about 150k that’s been paid out over the years because of various policies, starting at covid, that have been taken advantage of.

But it seems not much is going to happen until literal time runs out..and it seems an ill health retirement pay out might then be used.. will have to wait and see in a few months when everything has been used up.