Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Legal matters

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Original poster

Grandparents child arrangements order

73 replies

AndreaB1975 · 08/07/2024 23:33

Well, I'm a nana of 2 gorgeous grandsons, and my oldest son is their dad, he isn't either their mam but both have new partners. My son has completely turned his back on us. His family. He has been going through stuff but been awful to me. To cut a long story short, me and his step dad went yo try and sort our stuff with him, he got very angry, he went towards my husband I jumped in, we left but this really affected my husband, he rang the police and they advised us but they went to the mams house must be what they do, we said we had no safe guarding concerns so did she, 3 days later she stopped us seeing boys, and he has said it a few times. We have been in their lives constant had had them twice a month they stayed overnight, I went to my MIAM mediation meeting, she declined now I need to go to legal route. It's heart breaking. Solictor will try and negotiate if not I will need to get permission from court. If we have been constant in their lives will this be positive, I haven't seen them since may but feels ages xx any advice please..

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 08/07/2024 23:42

“ 3 days later she stopped us seeing boys, and he has said it a few times.”

What does this mean, please?

Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 08/07/2024 23:45

Sorry, yes the boys mam texted my husband and said we not seeing boys, and my son has said it a few times, we have done nothing wrong. He has even stopped talking to my mam who is 77 years old, he pushing us away, to be fair he seems to do this when he gets with a partner. He stopped talking to me for a year before..

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 09/07/2024 00:01

Would you consider leaving it for a couple of months to calm down? You saw them in May.

The situation with your son - who should be facilitating contact, not his ex -is clearly fraught, given police involvement. And suggesting mediation to you son’s ex after, what, 6-8 weeks, is pretty extreme.

SheilaFentiman · 09/07/2024 00:02

She may very reasonably feel it is your son’s job sort out contact with you, hence the text to your husband. Is your son still seeing the boys?

edited : to correct an error

Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:08

They don't get along and they had to go to mediation, they had no contact and my husband was in the middle they would contact him if they need to pass anything on, yes may not long ago, but it feels like ages when you are close to them, his ex has caused a lot of issues in the past. When they sorted put their plan in mediation it was agreed we sort our contact with her which we did and it was fine. Feels like they have stabbed us in the back. It's all a mess

OP posts:
Aquamarine1029 · 09/07/2024 00:11

You are not the parents of these children, and as hard as it is, the parents should be able to decide who their children see. Trying to force the mother to allow you to see them will probably backfire spectacularly.

Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:13

Yes my son has them every other weekend and once in the week. It's all just so sad and heart breaking. They are using the boys as weapons, even if there is stuff going on between adults, the kids shouldn't be involved, it's easy to stop people from Seeing kids, to hurt them... its the kids who matter, they had stability and routine. Also with a MIAM you have 4 months to use it

OP posts:
Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:15

I am not forcing anyone. We have been part of their lives since birth they are u and 5, we have supported both parents. Yes they are parent's but shouldn't use them to hurt people

OP posts:
Aquamarine1029 · 09/07/2024 00:16

AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:15

I am not forcing anyone. We have been part of their lives since birth they are u and 5, we have supported both parents. Yes they are parent's but shouldn't use them to hurt people

Taking them to court is forcing them.

SheilaFentiman · 09/07/2024 00:18

If your son has them every other weekend, why are you in discussions with the ex? I realise that was what was originally agreed but if she wants to step away, that is her prerogative.

Equally, if he has said to her that he doesn’t want you to see them, as their dad, it’s not really down to her to go against that.

Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:20

No it's not, what else can you do. We don't talk. I don't want to ho down the court route of course I don't but those boys have a right to have a loving extended family in their lives. I take it your not a grandparent..its so hard, as you say they are parents. Some grandparents may not be bothered, we are, we love and care for them.

OP posts:
Original poster
AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:22

But there is no valid reason to stop us, we haven't hurt anyone or anything. Just loved and cared for them. It's just all wrong. Hope the law changes

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 09/07/2024 00:24

i have no doubt that you love and care for them.

But I don’t think you have the rights here that you think you have. Yes, it is good for kids to have a routine, but that routine can change, and a new routine be formed.

If they were still together but decided to move to the other end of the country, meaning you saw the kids twice a year not twice a month, would you have tried to go to court to stop that?

Aquamarine1029 · 09/07/2024 00:25

AndreaB1975 · 09/07/2024 00:20

No it's not, what else can you do. We don't talk. I don't want to ho down the court route of course I don't but those boys have a right to have a loving extended family in their lives. I take it your not a grandparent..its so hard, as you say they are parents. Some grandparents may not be bothered, we are, we love and care for them.

I am a grandparent, and it would be interesting to hear your son's side of this story.

To cut a long story short, me and his step dad went yo try and sort our stuff with him, he got very angry, he went towards my husband I jumped in, we left but this really affected my husband, he rang the police

You show up uninvited and unannounced? Your son "went towards" your husband? That's all? Your husband wasn't assaulted, hit, kicked, yet you called the police?

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 09/07/2024 00:38

To cut a long story short, me and his step dad went yo try and sort our stuff with him, he got very angry, he went towards my husband I jumped in, we left but this really affected my husband, he rang the police
How can you possibly not see that you caused harm here with your actions. You don't have safeguarding concerns so you weren't trying to protect your DGC. Their mum has now had to deal with the police and understandably doesn't want to deal with your family drama anymore. Inviting her to mediation will have made the situation worse and solidified her views that she doesn't want to deal with you anymore.

Bellsandthistle · 09/07/2024 00:47

No, the law should not change to say grandparents have rights to see grandchildren when the parents do not want this. I understand it’s upsetting, but the courts will not overrule the parents.

Aquamarine1029 · 09/07/2024 00:47

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 09/07/2024 00:38

To cut a long story short, me and his step dad went yo try and sort our stuff with him, he got very angry, he went towards my husband I jumped in, we left but this really affected my husband, he rang the police
How can you possibly not see that you caused harm here with your actions. You don't have safeguarding concerns so you weren't trying to protect your DGC. Their mum has now had to deal with the police and understandably doesn't want to deal with your family drama anymore. Inviting her to mediation will have made the situation worse and solidified her views that she doesn't want to deal with you anymore.

Exactly. If anyone unjustifiably brought the police to my door, involving me in their drama, they would no longer have a place in my life.

OatFlatWhiteForMePlease · 09/07/2024 00:55

There are two sides to every story, do you think your son’s recollection of everything would tally with yours? As parents they may collectively feel this is the best decision for their children.

Flossflower · 09/07/2024 01:32

If you live in the UK or Ireland, grandparents do not have any legal rights over their grandchildren. You are wasting time and money by going down a legal route. If you bring legal action against anyone they are far less likely to allow you contact. Give it time.

Meadowfinch · 09/07/2024 02:19

Aquamarine1029 · 09/07/2024 00:25

I am a grandparent, and it would be interesting to hear your son's side of this story.

To cut a long story short, me and his step dad went yo try and sort our stuff with him, he got very angry, he went towards my husband I jumped in, we left but this really affected my husband, he rang the police

You show up uninvited and unannounced? Your son "went towards" your husband? That's all? Your husband wasn't assaulted, hit, kicked, yet you called the police?

Show quote history

This. Why on earth did you ring the police? You were in your son's house without invitation. If my parents had done that to me, I'd be estranged from them too.

Your son is a grown adult. It is up to him how he lives his life and manages his family, NOT YOU. You don't have the right to impose your views. You don't have the right to demand to see his children. You have breached his trust.

I suggest you leave it a while for things to calm down. Then you apologise for your husband's actions (which were completely out of order) and ask him if you can see his children. Does one of them have a birthday in the autumn? Perhaps go to a birthday tea.

Do not apply to court. You will only make things worse. You risk fracturing the family permanently. THEY ARE NOT YOUR CHILDREN.

HamBagelNoCheese · 09/07/2024 02:30

I'd be interested to hesr both your son and his ex's points of view.

If I'm understanding correctly (your posts aren't the easiest to decipher), it strikes me as odd that both your son, and his ex, who are separated with a coparenting relationship that has broken down sufficiently enough for them to require mediators, are both independently saying you cannot see the children?

I suspect there is a lot more to this than you are divulging.

123letsblaze · 09/07/2024 03:44

There is likely a good reason you haven't seen them since May. Trying to strong arm them into it won't help.

Ponderingwindow · 09/07/2024 04:02

It doesn’t matter if the parent’s reasons for cutting you off are valid. They are the parents and they are in charge.

taking them to court is scorched earth, never to be forgiven behavior. It is the kind of thing that may even have them looking to emigrate as a means of escaping you.

Calm down before you destroy 2 generations worth of relationships.

SomethingWrongWiththeWorldToday · 09/07/2024 06:37

I know a grandparent who took their grandchild's mother to court to secure visitation rights. Initially, the child regularly stayed overnight for two nights or more each month. However, when this ceased, the grandparent attempted mediation. Unfortunately, the parent did not attend, prompting the grandparent to pursue legal action. I believe the child was around 7 or 8 years old at that point. Eventually, the court mandated a regular weekend stay each month until the child reached the age of 16. If you have been a regular part of the child's life, you can win rights in court. Good Luck.

prh47bridge · 09/07/2024 07:23

A number of posts on this thread are incorrect.

Whilst grandparents do not have any automatic right to apply for contact, they can do so with the court's permission. Some grandparents succeed in getting a CAO ordering contact. Going down the legal route is unlikely to help OP's relationship with her son or the children's mother, but those saying OP has no chance of getting a CAO are wrong.