Faulty car

[Mum3700]

Hello,

I’m looking for some legal advice regarding my car.

I bought it in January, second hand from a local dealer. Within a month the tyre pressure warning light had come on, my husband inflated the tyres and reset the computer. A few weeks later it happened again, I took it to a local Kwik Fit, they inflated them again. Repeat again a few weeks later. When the warning light came on for the third time it was obvious there was something going on, so I called the dealer and they took it in to their workshop. They re sealed the rims and said it was now fine.

At this point my six month warranty ended, but obviously the issue was initially raised beforehand. Less than two weeks later, during a fairly long journey with my 3 children in then back, the light came on again. I rang the dealer and said this was ridiculous now, and I wanted it either fixed for good or to return the car. Before heading back from my trip I took the car into a Kwik Fit for them to inflate the tyres yet again before I drove home, and they said the back two tyres were much lower than they should be. The dealer picked the car up once I returned and took it to a different local garage for a second opinion apparently, and returned it later that day, with all four tyres having been re sealed - again. I was assured it was all sorted out now. Fast forward a couple of weeks to today and the light came back on tonight! I can’t believe it.

Whatever they assumed the problem was, it clearly isn’t that. They’ve assured me it’s been fixed twice now. The car is unreliable, the issue has been ongoing since I got it and I just want to return it now for a refund (taking into account depreciation - I’m unsure how this works?).

I’m just wanting to know my legal rights, and what to say when the garage argue with me, as I know they aren’t going to want this car back!

Thanks.

Since you bought it from a dealer, the car must be of satisfactory quality taking into account its age and mileage.

I note that you don't say any of the tyres have been changed. If one or more of them has a slow puncture, no amount of sealing the rims and reinflating the tyres will deal with it. And, as tyres are consumables, if it is a slow puncture, it is unlikely this will allow you to get your money back.

The main problem you have is that it is more than 6 months since you bought the car. It is therefore up to you to prove that the car was faulty when you bought it. You will need to get an engineer's report identifying the actual problem, stating that it was there when you bought the car and that this means the car was not of satisfactory quality. You can then ask for a refund less a deduction to take into account the use you have had of the car.

@prh47bridge thank you for your reply.

I have had the car for over six months now, but I first raised the issue with the whilst still within the six month warranty period - does this help?

I presume both the dealer and the other garage they took the car too for a second opinion; both ruled out slow punctures in any of the tyres; as both treated for rim sealing? The invoice I saw for the second opinion garage (not that I was asked to pay) described it as ‘rim seal valve and balance x4’.

I tried to research my consumer rights online yesterday, it states on whatcar.com -

‘If a problem is found after 30 days, but within six months of purchase, you can request a repair or a replacement vehicle. The onus is on the seller of the car to prove the fault wasn’t present when the car was sold; if they can, and you’re likely to have known about it, you won’t get a refund.
When it comes to repairs, the dealer has one chance to fix the fault. If the fix doesn’t work, you are entitled to a refund. You won’t get the full purchase price back, though. Any usage of the car will be taken into account and the refund will be adjusted accordingly.’

I see it as I’ve trusted the dealer twice now to fix the repair (starting within the six months) and it hasn’t worked so I’m entitled to a refund?

Thank you!

I have no idea where you stand on the legal front, but I had the same problem with a couple of my cars in the past.

On one car...

1 tyre kept losing pressure very slowly.

Checking with a pressure gauge every day you couldn't notice a difference. But every 2-6 weeks or so (depending on use) I'd get the warning light on the dash and when checking again with the gauge there was a definite small pressure loss since "x weeks" ago.

This cycle repeated for months (no warranty, so just dealing with it when time permitted, etc.).

Had the valve replaced twice, had the tyre removed & re-seated/sealed twice and continued to happen with a brand new tyre.

In the end, it was a tiny hairline crack about 2CM long on the inner edge of the alloy rim.

Took it to an alloy wheel repair place and they welded it up for about £30-£40 and it was fine ever since.

So easy to miss - just a tiny "line" - like a crack in the glaze of some crockery. Couldn't feel it. Couldn't see it until all the muck, etc. had been washed off.

If you haven't already - it might be worth investing in a tyre pressure gauge for about £5 and checking the pressures once a week and keeping a record - See if you can identify which tyre is tripping the sensor.

(I know you mentioned both rear tyres in your OP - maybe it's been driven over a speed-bump / kerb / collapsed trench, etc. and cracked both rims)

I realise this won't help you on the legal / refund front, but might help you get to the root of the problem.

On the other car - it was more random and tuned out to be a faulty wheel-speed sensor (some tyre sensors actually get their info from the "wheel speed sensor") - Sometimes when driving over a big puddle or over a rough bit of road or over those rumble-strips at the edge of a dual carriageway - The wheel-speed sensor would freak out and trigger the tyre pressure warning! A replacement £20 sensor (+5 mins labour) cured it.

Good luck.

The fact the fault first showed itself within 6 months helps, but the dealer may still try to argue that this is normal wear and tear or that you have done something that caused the issue.

The fact that both the dealer and the other garage sealed the rim doesn't necessarily mean they checked for a slow puncture. And, as the previous poster says, they may have missed something easy to fix, such as a cracked rim or a faulty sensor.

@prh47bridge but they've had two separate occasions to find the fault and fix it, and failed to both times? It was their chance then to find the actual issue, if they've guessed wrongly twice that's their fault, no?

I really do want to give the car back, take the hit on whatever depreciation amount I'm given, and buy elsewhere. I have no faith left in the car, I don't consider it safe or reliable, and I haven't got the time to keep taking it back to the dealer (it's local but still 45 mins away and I work full time).

@EarWigJo it's definitely not a sensor issue as all four tyre pressures had dropped within 2 weeks, one in particular was down 10psi.

Yes, if they have incorrectly identified the fault that is their problem. I wasn't trying to say otherwise.

I’d suggest you take it to a good independent tyre place and ask them to take a look at it. Presumably you’re checking your tyre pressures regularly anyway? Monitor them over the course of a couple of weeks. There are only a limited number of problems that can cause this. A slow puncture, faulty valve, cracked wheel or corrosion on the wheel where the bead seats. The valves should’ve been replaced when the tyre was removed for reseating so probably rule those out.

Is it a BMW by any chance? They’re notorious for cracked wheels.

Get a definitive diagnosis from someone who knows what they’re talking about, this is probably a better use of your time than fighting a difficult dealer.