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Legal matters

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Original poster

Child arrangements order

15 replies

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 14:08

So my partner has been seeing his children for tea after work twice a week or after school if on a rest day. He also takes his little one to school and has them both overnight once a month on a weekend off. His ex was not satisfied with this and took him to court, just like that they put a court order on him which tells him to have them over night once a month and in the holidays for a day each week. So the court order is doable and not an issue, however it happened on Thursday and already she is making allegations. She has said he threatened her in court and it's all on cctv, which he didn't do and wouldn't as he would definitely lose his job. Said she is taking him back to court. It's basically because she hasn't got her way with something. He is so so stressed that she will make him breach the order or make an allegation which could lead to him being suspended. She gives women a bad name! I'm not sure what the answer is but I've said I don't think it's safe for him to collect/drop off the children from her. I think he needs to protect himself. Just wondering if anyone has been in the same situation?
sorry for the long post

OP posts:

Reugny · 08/07/2023 14:41

If he threatened her inside Court then there would be court staff including security staff who would have seen it. If she has just made allegations and there is nothing to them then nothing will happen.

In regards to the Child Arrangements Order it is up to him whether he sees his children at the times that they are available from him to see/have them. Basically Child Arrangements Orders are an invitation to the parent the child doesn't mostly live with, and a summons to the parent they do live with. In other words if he misses seeing them as he's not organised then he's a shit parent.

However her allegations mean he should limit contact with her to written contact only - so email and old fashioned SMS not messaging apps to limit further allegations. If he is scared meeting her will trigger allegations then he needs to get the Child Arrangements Order changed so the children are handed over on a public place if school can't be used.

Original poster

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 15:23

Thank you! They've told him the court order holds 6 months in prison or a fine if he does not do as it says! He wouldn't not as it's the same as how much he sees them now

OP posts:

Reugny · 08/07/2023 15:32

Who is the "they" that told him that?

In the UK you cannot force a parent to parent their child. So if he decides to never see his children again then there is FA anyone can do. (This happened to someone I know. The dad also ensured he didn't pay child maintenance. He's now dead.)

He needs to seek his own advice about the order to make sure he understands it, which can be found from various fathers groups.

Original poster

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 15:44

Thanks, it was the court who told him

OP posts:

bellac11 · 08/07/2023 16:32

Is he not represented by a solicitor? He needs one to ensure the arrangements are suitable, child centred and that he is protected from her making allegations

There is a massive gap here, perhaps because you kept the story short or becaus he hasnt told you everything, you dont go to court 'just like that' because theres a massive backlog anyway and he would have got notice of it and an expectation that parents work out issues prior to going to court

So what actually happened?

Original poster

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 16:37

No he isn't represented by a solicitor as it's costing thousands already for divorce and financial order. He went to an initial hearing where they said that he and his ex could clearly not agree so would need to go to a trial but on the first date they issued the order.

OP posts:

Reugny · 08/07/2023 16:41

OP are you sure it isn't an interim order?

I know a few people who had them before the Child Arrangements Order. Interim orders can come with threats of fines etc but actual Child Arrangements Orders don't.

Even with interim orders if the father can't see his children as ordered for a good reason then he won't be penalised.

Reugny · 08/07/2023 16:43

Also OP it is worth telling your partner to pay for a solicitor to look at the Order and gave him advice over it. He doesn't need to be represented if he can't afford it

In fact all the parents I know who got representation used barristers. Some parents weren't represented at all.

bellac11 · 08/07/2023 17:21

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 16:37

Its not a trial.....

If he is paying for divorce proceedings, presumably he has a solicitor for that?

Its short sighted not to be fully represented.

Reugny · 08/07/2023 17:41

@bellac11 lots of parents aren't represented at all for Child Arrangements proceedings.

Though unlike the OP the ones I know had some understanding of what was going on.

Personally I think the OP is being lied to as if she did a simple Google for say "child arrangements orders England" or whatever UK country she was in, then she would find out information from lawyers firms, the government and charities like the Coram group about proceedings.

Original poster

Oldermumvibes · 08/07/2023 17:44

It potentially was but we were quoted 5,000 for this process alone and it's money we just don't have. I think that he will just have to comply with the order and continue as he was before court and walk on egg shells, will wait until she throws him under the bus. I think some women (and men) are never satisfied following a separation. It's having such an effect on his mental health, we both work in emergency services so it's not an ideal situation to be in with the allegations being made.

thanks all for reading and responding

OP posts:

bellac11 · 08/07/2023 18:46

Reugny · 08/07/2023 17:41

@bellac11 lots of parents aren't represented at all for Child Arrangements proceedings.

Though unlike the OP the ones I know had some understanding of what was going on.

Agreed

FatherB · 09/07/2023 02:04

Just to clarify, I don't think he can break the court order.

The resident parent is really the only one who can break it since the resident parent has to make the child available for those visits. The non-resident parent could choose not to show up and wouldn't breach the order, but obviously that wouldn't go down well in court at a later date.

That said if she doesn't make the child available, then she's breaking the order, not him. If I were you, i'd just advise him to basically follow the order as instructed. If she doesn't allow the visit, make a note of it, don't get angry, don't shout, she'll just call you abusive and say that it upset DC or whatever other nonsense. Just keep it civil and record the difficulties.

SullysBabyMama · 09/07/2023 02:32

As the court order is exactly what your partner wants, surely he just takes you or another witness in the car and he collects the kids from the door and doesn’t go inside her home, Then she cannot make any accusations?

TizerorFizz · 09/07/2023 09:49

Family barristers refer to court proceedings as “trials” in some instances.

I would follow the order to the letter. It’s well known by judges that some women use children to frustrate the orders so always note what is happening. Never get angry. Never threaten. Just be present when agreed. Never withhold money.

I would get representation. it will cost but better outcomes quite often.

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